Ask A Korean on Korean History

[Eretz Yisrael]

Hi guys, after reviewing some of the threads on the site regarding Korea and some of the users' opinions on Korean History, I decided to attempt a history thread with regards to Korean history.

Having lived and studied in both Korea and China, I regard myself as having a more balanced view of Korean history compared to some Koreans and Chinese; and I hope there would be good questions raised on it.

Two disclaimers though:

- No, I am not on either side of the Korean/Chinese nationalist historian camps; I personally found it ridiculous when Chinese media broadcast so-claimed Korean historians claiming such and such were not Chinese but Korean; at leas most of these stories has been verified to be false and made up by major Chinese news media such as Fenghuang and QQ for the purposes for inflaming Chinese nationalist agitation against its neighbors; one suspects it was done for the purposes of decreasing foreign cultural influence on the Chinese populace as well as for the purposes of diverting attention away from internal problems in China.

- I have lived and studied in the US, China, Korea, and am currently a Finance Student in the UK; my relative range of expertise in Korean history lies near Korean classical history and the period before that.

 

[MilesGregarius]

Hey Eretz, long time.

Not so much a history question as a question about what South Korean kids are taught:

How much do kids in school learn about the Lee Syngman and Park Chung Hee governments crackdowns on dissent? Kim Dae Jung's exile and Chun Doo Hwan crushing of the Kwangju uprising seem well known, but how common is knowledge of stuff such as the military's massacres of leftists and nationalists in Cheolla and on Jeju in the '40s or the judicial murder of Jo Bong Am in the '50s?

Also, what is "classic" in the Korean sense? Joseon? Koryo? Unified Silla? Three Kingdoms?

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

Hey Eretz, long time.

Not so much a history question as a question about what South Korean kids are taught:

How much do kids in school learn about the Lee Syngman and Park Chung Hee governments crackdowns on dissent? Kim Dae Jung's exile and Chun Doo Hwan crushing of the Kwangju uprising seem well known, but how common is knowledge of stuff such as the military's massacres of leftists and nationalists in Cheolla and on Jeju in the '40s or the judicial murder of Jo Bong Am in the '50s?

Also, what is "classic" in the Korean sense? Joseon? Koryo? Unified Silla? Three Kingdoms?

Long time, Miles.

Park Chung Hee's military crackdowns are taught, but details have always been grossed over; as for Syngman Rhee, I am not sure, but the trend these days is that they tend to portray him as a national hero who had to make critical choices at a time of national emergency. His post-war rule and the corruption is barely mentioned in detail.

The military's massacres in Cheolla and Jeju have barely been taught, if not not mentioned in textbooks at all. Nationalist revisionism in Korean history textbooks seems to be discreetly on the move these days, as well all the talk of Korean greatness prevalent in Korean youth.

Classic Korean history as in the period of history up to Balhae and Goryo after it.

 

[MilesGregarius]

Kind of as I assumed.

It's sad that Rhee Syngman is being exalted. Rhee was a pitiful little puppet of the Americans with no apparent desire to be more than that as long as he remained in power. Plus, his pushing for war with the North while not actually preparing for one was downright criminal.

Park was a cold-hearted bastard, but he was effective and actually made strengthening Korea a priority. His crimes are mitigated somewhat by the fact that they served a purpose beyond merely holding power.

I saw recently that Jo Bong Am was recently rehabilitated, declared innocent of the trumped up charges of treason that led to his execution. Does anybody under 60 even know who he was?

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

Kind of as I assumed.

It's sad that Rhee Syngman is being exalted. Rhee was a pitiful little puppet of the Americans with no apparent desire to be more than that as long as he remained in power. Plus, his pushing for war with the North while not actually preparing for one was downright criminal.

Park was a cold-hearted bastard, but he was effective and actually made strengthening Korea a priority. His crimes are mitigated somewhat by the fact that they served a purpose beyond merely holding power.

I saw recently that Jo Bong Am was recently rehabilitated, declared innocent of the trumped up charges of treason that led to his execution. Does anybody under 60 even know who he was?

Actually a surprising number of Korean university students are quite passionate for politics and history, albeit a bit too left for my taste. I remember having to talk with a Korean friend of my brother who just came out of the army and he was quite full of contempt at contemporary politics and the conservative right.

What he doesnt know, however, is that the Old Left (represented by Kim Daejung and Kim Youngsam) is about as bad as the Old Right; I could put it in terms of the Right being cruel, yet in the end, nationalistic bunch. I personally admire both Rhee Sungman and Park Cunghee because of their nationalistic outlook. I remember reading a quote from Park Cunghee after coming back from attending a ASEAN summit meeting that he would never go back to the outside world before his country has risen up from poverty because back then every ASEAN country was rich and prosperous, with the notable exception of South Korea. A man who had gone through two wars and was noted for his clean effective purges of the left cried on national television as he described his feelings. It made a lot of people cry back then. Whereas Kim Daejung's political 'lobbyists' used to go around Jeolla province living off the local Chaebol families living there while paying them at all. Park was probably thinking in terms and felt disgust when he tried to kill Kim Daejung in the Japan Sea. But they lived out of the crisis and became national heros; martyrs of the Korean democratic movement. To be honest, I'd rather admire Park and the Right then Kim's Party. I respect the man for his life story, but I'm not sure about all the people subordinate to him.

Rhee was a man of fortitude and vision, but I admit he was also very very narcissistic; you can see his loftiness during his tenure as the President of Korean Government in Exile during World War II. Will have to remind you that he did not have many choices back then; all the major leaders of the Korean Resistance Army (Gwangbokgun) as well as Socialist leaders were in Seoul, not in Pyongyang,and Rhee knew that the country would have to handed over eventually to Communists in the North, who were subservient to the Soviet Union and had little national interest in mind. Rhee was ingenious at grasping power politics in the international political arena; as a young man, he got in trouble with the Gojong many times due to his insight and his subsequent activism with his compatriots in the Independence Club. But then he got ruthless, and with American and Soviet pressure closing on him, Im not surprised he massacred leftists before the war and during the war. A murderer no doubt, but a reluctant one perhaps? The man, being a devout Christian, also had problems of guilt accompanying his actions and some speculate it was this as well as many other factors that made suddenly go on a self-imposed exile to Hawaii.

 

[aronnax]

When was South Korea ever in ASEAN and how was every country in ASEAN rich and prosperous?

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

When was South Korea ever in ASEAN and how was every country in ASEAN rich and prosperous?

Oops sorry there I meant Seato

And prosperous as in they didnt have to export wigs as their main commodity. Thats how dirt poor South Korea until the 80s.

 

[Midnight-Blue766]

at leas most of these stories has been verified to be false and made up by major Chinese news media such as Fenghuang and QQ for the purposes for inflaming Chinese nationalist agitation against its neighbors

How much of Korean imports to Japan were Korean, and how much was Chinese?

 

[Kraznaya]

suiko was a korean queen amirite

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

How much of Korean imports to Japan were Korean, and how much was Chinese?

Huh? I dont quite understand the question you're trying to ask...

suiko was a korean queen amirite

Are you calling about the Japanese Tenno Suiko-tenno? If it is, then no.

But there are other figures in Japanese that have been rumored to be of Korean origin, such as Kammu-Tenno's mother, Takano no Niigasa (a descendant of King Muryeong??), Amenohiboko (legendary Silla prince?), or the Baekjae-founded clan of Kudara no Kunishiki.

 

[civ-addicted]

Has there ever been expansionist attempts by Korea towards Manchuria (after Goguryeo and Balhae), China or Japan?

 

[Smellincoffee]

Is there a general attitude toward Japan in South Korea?

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

Has there ever been expansionist attempts by Korea towards Manchuria (after Goguryeo and Balhae), China or Japan?

Well, it can be said that various Korean guerilla movements tried to take over Gando (today's Yanbien Autonomous County in China) whilst being a protectorate under Japan; and there was also once when Choson had to take control over Tshushima after the Japanese pirates had become a problem large enough for the Choson Navy to take action. But no, there has been no serious attempts at expansion by Korea after Balhae.

It can be argued that the last king of Goryo wished to expand into Manchuria, but his general Yi Song-gye went halfway, turned around, and overthrew the Goryo monarchy.

Is there a general attitude toward Japan in South Korea?

Well, there was a lot of anti-Japanese sentiment right until the 1990s, but besides that not really. Korea, during its years as a protectorate of Japan, had two opposing camps with regards to the Japanese occupation: those who were against it and those who were supportive of it. The ones against occupation were mainly Korean Indepedence movements, Korean guerillas, the National Government in Exile, and Korean Christians (due to their oppsition to the Shinto religion); many other were supportive of it, and if you look at archives dating from that period, you can actually find photos of 'patriotic' Koreans waving the Nihonmaru and enlisting in the Japanese Army.

But then as Korea became an independent nation, the fromer group which I mentioned gained power, and after the Korean War, many of those who had been affiliated with Japan in one way or another were denouced as Chinil-pa (Japanophiles? dont know if this is the right word) and there were various attempts by Korean politicians to remove these people from power. One famous person affiliated with Japan include Park Chung Hee, who was an officer in the Manchurian Army, who later became President of South Korea.


------------------------------------

Coming back to Goryeo, as the self-proclaimed successors of Goguryeo (they had in fact nothing to do with Goguryeo), they always did have this intent to reclaim the lands of Manchuria. But Goryeo had a hard enough time just trying to the Jurchens, Mongols, and Khitans out of the peninsula.

 

[CELTICEMPIRE]

who do you think is the most influential person in Korean history?

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

who do you think is the most influential person in Korean history?

Wow that is a very hard question.

I could say the most influential person in Korean History was King Gwanggaeto of Goguryeo, as his military exploits started from Japan all the way to Rouran (present day East Turkestan) , if Korean historians are right in their interpretation of the Gwanggaeto Stele as well as right on their hypotheses of Goguryeo's military acheievements near Rouran.

I can also say that Rhee Syngman was also a inlfuential figure in Korean history, but that is by far debatable.

 

[innonimatu]

Speaking of christians in Korea, how did christianity spread so much in Korea?

 

[Perfection]

China or Japan, which one has in total been the bigger jerk to Korea?

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

Speaking of christians in Korea, how did christianity spread so much in Korea?

Christianity spread in three consecutive waves: first was the introduction of Catholicism and the abrupt persecution of it by Daewongun of Choson (Regent of Gojong when he was young); American (Presbyterian and Episcopalians), Anglican and Australian missionaries coming into the country, amongst them being Horace Grant Underwood, Henry Apenzeller, whose lead helped lay down the basis for a modernized Korea during the turbulent years of the Russo-Japanese War by spreading Western medicine, literature, religion, and culture. Of course there were secular Westerners helping Koreans that benefited massively for the country, but the Western missionaries made a change that forever changed Korea. This ended with the Japanese occupation of Korea and the resulting prosecution of Christian due to their opposition against the Shinto religion. The last wave came in the aftermath of the Korean War, when the country being one of the poorest countries in Asia as well as continuously under the threat of war from North Korea, resulted in socialist-leaning, Protestant church movements which emphasized Puritan ethics in nation building, as well as the emphasis on receiving material and spiritual blessings from God. This has been characteristic of the Yoido Gospel Church and Doorae Presbyterian Church, where both Pastors David Yonggi Cho and Kim Jinhong who in their early careers focused on the poor communities.

China or Japan, which one has in total been the bigger jerk to Korea?

Um...I think it has been by far China. Japan did many horrible things in Korea, but none of that amounts to sending 1 million volunteers. But Koreans tend to hate Japan more because of the psychological effects of the occupation. What people dont remember is that there used to be many volunteers and pro-Japanese Koreans who actively tried to promote the war.

 

[kiwitt]

Is there anything in Korea's history that would stop an eventual re-unification as alluded to in this article.

Were North Korea to implode, Chinese, U.S., and South Korean ground forces might meet up on the peninsula's northern half in the mother of all humanitarian interventions

 

[Eretz Yisrael]

Is there anything in Korea's history that would stop an eventual re-unification as alluded to in this article.

I'm not quite sure what you are suggesting there, but China could argue that Goguryeo, which roughly covers present day Manchuria and North Korea was part of Chinese history and use that plus humanitarian concerns to occupy the country.

As I said elsewhere here in the thread, it was in some ways, a good thing that Tang-Shilla forces eradicated Goguryeo from history; if Goguryeo had continued to survive, then it might have united the peninsula and then further endeavored to conquer China, which would certainly have resulted in Goguryeo becoming Chinese.