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AZ-03: The Peacemonger

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Succession Games' started by azaris, Jun 22, 2007.

  1. azaris

    azaris King

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2007
    Messages:
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    Location:
    Finland
    Russia is (or will be) one of the world superpowers. As such, it is our responsibility to maintain world peace.

    Version: Warlords 2.08
    Mods: NO
    Leader: Peter (Russia)
    Difficulty: Prince
    Map: Pangaea
    Size: Standard
    Era: Ancient
    Speed: Normal
    World wrap: Cylindrical
    Opposition: 7 random AIs (one more than usual to keep us busy)

    Special rules:

    Diplomatic or space race victory ONLY
    No vassal states (fight to the death, baby)

    Variant rules:

    • We must adopt Pacifism as soon as we get Philosophy and never switch. Must also research Philosophy before Music, Civil Service, Theology, or Guilds.
    • All civs are non-rogue at first. Any civ that declares war on another non-rogue civ becomes a rogue civ.
    • We must immediately declare war on any rogue civ and cannot make peace with them until they cease all wars they started against non-rogue civs, at which point we can sue for peace (but don't have to).
    • We cannot declare on any civ that is not considered rogue at the time. Nor are we allowed to bribe another civ to declare war or a non-rogue civ. We are allowed to bring in war allies in a battle against a rogue civ as long as it remains rogue, but not after it has ceased to be rogue, even if we are still at war against them ourselves.
    • We are allowed to destroy rogue states, but only as long as they remain rogue.

    Russia is a peacemonger, but Russia is also cunning. We can negotiate embargos, break deals, and do other non-war related diplomacy. If this leads to a civ declaring war on another (or us), then so be it. They made the decision, they live (or die) with it.

    Standard 24 hours "got it", 48 hours to play and report. Turnsets are 20/15/10 as usual.

    ROSTER:

    azaris
    pigswill
    Kodii
    Oddible
    LuvToBuild
     
  2. Oddible

    Oddible signal / noise > 1

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    So rogue civs become non-rogue as soon as they are at peace with everyone right? So cannot start any war with any civ that isn't already at war.

    Diplomatic win could be difficult because of the req to immediately declare. Would lose the diplomatic perk of waiting for someone to request an alliance. Will likely have declared on most other civs by late game so will need to have a strong military to fend off any threats. So Defensive Treaties are ok right?

    Going to need big $$ to support the army after Philosophy.

    I haven't participated in a SG since Civ3 but I'm in if you'll have me!

    Hope there are a lot of rogues during the cossack years!
     
  3. azaris

    azaris King

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    Welcome, Oddible. A rogue civ becomes non-rogue when it makes peace with the original opponent. So for example, if Saladin declares on Hatty, we must declare on Saladin. If we bring in Monty and Alex in the war and Saladin later declares on Louis, then we must remain in war against Saladin until he is no longer in war against Hatty or Louis.

    Diplomatic is harder than usual, but doable. I did almost get it in a test game. Don't forget the default AI is not very warlike against other AIs.

    Oh, and DPs do not violate the variant rules so they are allowed.
     
  4. pigswill

    pigswill fly (one day)

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    What happens if you don't research philosophy; its a pre-req of liberalism but what else does it affect?
     
  5. Oddible

    Oddible signal / noise > 1

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    But... but... we are peacemongers!? Why wouldn't we research philosophy!? Given a choice of Civil Service (Macemen) or Guilds (Knights), I'd have to choose Philisophy, Music or Theology!

    I might suggest since we are peacemongers that getting Philosophy asap is an early goal!
     
  6. azaris

    azaris King

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    I added a variant rule that states we must research Philosophy before any of the other 8th tier techs (Music, Civil Service, Theology, Guilds).

    Now all we need are more peace-loving leaders.
     
  7. pigswill

    pigswill fly (one day)

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    If you're going to declare war on any civ that declares on someone else its going to be a bloodbath; on the other hand you'll pick up lot of mutual military diplo bonus.

    If you're stuck for players to join after the current roster from AZ2 sign up I'd like to give this one a go (tho' I'm not playing very well at the moment).
     
  8. Kodii

    Kodii Ka ICE

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    I will ditto pigswill, considering the thread has been up for a while now.
     
  9. azaris

    azaris King

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    Welcome, pigswill and Kodii. Nice to have some really experienced SGers on board.

    I'd like to find one more player, but I think we have enough to get started. Are we agreed on the variant rules, or are there still some issues?
     
  10. pigswill

    pigswill fly (one day)

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    I suspect that this will be a war-heavy game; lots of warfare while running pacifism will be a bit of a challenge. I'm happy enough with the variants, presumably any state that declares on us is a rogue as well. I think that I'd rather play this at epic speed to maximise the benefit of our (expensive) units.
     
  11. azaris

    azaris King

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    Like I said, I ran some test games, and there weren't too many early wars. Of course they had no Monty in them. :ar15: Actually, a bigger problem is that we will run out of land to expand very quickly and won't have any guaranteed wars against our closest neighbours.

    A civ that attacks us is rogue, yes. I actually tried a tactic where I was the worst enemy of half the civs on the map, to keep them from attacking each other or my friends. There are a lot of diplomatic games we can try to play.

    I will read up on the finer details of epic speed and decide between epic/normal, then roll a start in the evening.
     
  12. Kodii

    Kodii Ka ICE

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    Just to clarify, a rogue AI that has ceased any participation in a war becomes non-rogue again?

    Also, if a non-rogue AI declares on a rogue one, then the non-rogue AI remains non-rogue? :crazyeye:
     
  13. LuvToBuild

    LuvToBuild Prince

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    Mind if I join you guys? I've played with pigswill before a couple of times but its been a little while. Finally getting back into playing Civ again and haven't played a Warlords SG yet. Looking forward to the BtS expansion coming out and would like to get back into playing some SGs again in anticipation.
     
  14. azaris

    azaris King

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    Once it ceases any wars it started.

    Yes. "Coaliting of the Willing".

    Here are the settings:



    I went for Normal speed since we only have four players. I'm also not sure how the unit costs are scaled with the game speed. Here is the start:





    Settle in place I suppose, but what is our starting strategy? I think Agriculture first and then Bronze Working. After the initial worker try and get that city growing quickly to pump out settlers to grab the best spots before we run out of real estate.
     
  15. azaris

    azaris King

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  16. Lucky The Fox

    Lucky The Fox Prince

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    Any chance for epic speed if I offer to be the fifth player?
     
  17. LuvToBuild

    LuvToBuild Prince

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    Thanks! Glad to be on the team.

    Settle in place sounds good. I see no reason to move. Given our leader traits and SG variants, I'm assuming we will be looking to produce a lot of specialists? If that's the case, Agriculture and BW does sound like the way to go. Rice farm and plenty of grassland for regular farms, some that need chopping. Do we want a worker to be the first build or do we want another scout? An early worker timed to complete along with Ag might help us grow quicker in the long run but a scout would help us pick juicy city sites early and would let us grow a bit first. That's my two cents worth anyway.

    Long term, those bananas look ripe for the picking (and we need the dye for our hippie Love and Peace shirts, ;) ). Since religion and Stonehenge probably aren't a high priority, Calendar seems to be an early goal at some point. Maybe Ag, BW, AH, Writing, Alphabet, and then try to trade for Mathematics and Sailing? I'm not sure that a beeline is in our best interest but I think it would be a good idea to work towards that early. Let the other civs worry about getting religion.
     
  18. Kodii

    Kodii Ka ICE

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    Are we peacemongers or space monkies? :crazyeye:

    Agri then BW sounds like a nice plan to me. Too bad our capital is a calendar start. Also doesn't look too hammer-heavy, with one grassland hill to the southeast and one to the northeasteast.

    I think a worker first is the best choice. One scout is probably enough to find that yummy second city site.
     
  19. azaris

    azaris King

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    Lucky The Fox, I decided to go Normal speed, but you're welcome to join if you want to.

    I'll play the start tomorrow.
     
  20. pigswill

    pigswill fly (one day)

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    I'd consider going 1S; we lose the dyes but gain a couple of hills which will be helpful in early production. Could go for a fairly standard tech sequence: agric, BW, wheel (or AH first if no local copper), wheel/AH, myst (for monumental border pop), pottery, writing, alphabet, back track to meditation, priesthood then CoL. By this stage we should have at least two cities, one builds units, other builds lib and runs a couple of scientists for GS. As long as we can pick up maths in trade we get to lightbulb philosophy.
     

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