Badly lost to greece tourism

[michaeljhuman]

I was playing China, trying to win with culture. At some point I realized it was hopeless in a game with Greece in it.

King difficulty, small map, online speed

Greece had twice the tourism I did. And I was not sure how that was possible. On turn 133 : 223 to my 80. I suppose Greece could have had some bonuses I did not by that time. There's a limit to how much you can get from great people due to generally having a limit of 5 cities ( by city 6, it just seems too late to do anything useful.) I doubt they had broadcast up and running that early.

I am not suggesting China should easily beat Greece at tourism, but 223 vs 80 is a beatdown I did not expect.

I won easily the next game, ending up with over 700 tourism per turn, base ( and no idea how I was generating THAT much, I am still trying to analyze that save game.)

I suppose I have rambled enough, just curious, what is the AI doing to get so much tourism by turn?

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

They do get a unique cultural district. AI likes to prioritize their unique infrastructure.
At the same time that district would have given them a lot of Great Writer, Artist and Musician Points. Great Works tend to produce the most tourism of anything in the game, I believe.
They can also get Great People easier with the Wildcard Policy Slot, including Engineers which some could speed up wonder production.
And lastly both of the Leader's special ability makes it to where you can travel up the Civics Tree faster with culture.

 

[michaeljhuman]

I can understand getting a lot of great people. I can do that too, but I don't have enough space to put their works it seems like.

 

[Archon_Wing]

Tourism doubles after computers so it is important to get that. Otherwise getting lots of seaside resorts and archeological artufacts that are themed also help

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

The best way for tourism is by building many Theater Squares with the buildings and filling them up with Great Work Slots. Theming the museums can also be important.
Wonders can work as well especially the ones with the Great Work Slots (Great Library, Apadana, Mont St. Michel, Oxford University, Bolshoi Theater, Hermitage, Broadway, Sydney Opera House)

 

[Kyro]

I was playing China, trying to win with culture. At some point I realized it was hopeless in a game with Greece in it.

King difficulty, small map, online speed

Greece had twice the tourism I did. And I was not sure how that was possible. On turn 133 : 223 to my 80. I suppose Greece could have had some bonuses I did not by that time. There's a limit to how much you can get from great people due to generally having a limit of 5 cities ( by city 6, it just seems too late to do anything useful.) I doubt they had broadcast up and running that early.

I am not suggesting China should easily beat Greece at tourism, but 223 vs 80 is a beatdown I did not expect.

I won easily the next game, ending up with over 700 tourism per turn, base ( and no idea how I was generating THAT much, I am still trying to analyze that save game.)

I suppose I have rambled enough, just curious, what is the AI doing to get so much tourism by turn?

5 Cities by end game is incredibly low if you ask me, the game penalize players for having lesser cities. Seems like map size may be an issue here but you technically can have at least 10 if you squeeze your cities tight which isn't very fun but necessary by design.

 

[AmtrakQuebec]

You can certainly beat Greece in a tourism battle with 6 cities on a small map, done it many times, 5 is pushing it. Did the Greeks build the Apadana? If they did and wonder-whored, they can get Suz of many city states which helps their Culture build quicker so they can get to Tourism multiplier Civics fast.

 

[Archon_Wing]

5 cities is on the low end, but not fatal on a small map, though it really depends on how many cities the others have.

One thing that can help with delaying an enemy culture victory is by building a decent enough culture per turn yourself; focus on civics and getting the inspirations.

 

[cazaderonus]

if they founded a religion it might also have added a nice buff to their tourism. Relics from goodie huts and faith building all add up as well.

 

[Victoria]

what is the AI doing to get so much tourism by turn?

If Greece built just Amphitheaters and put great writers in each they would generate 80 tourism initially and 160 tourism after computers. A few wafers and a museum and they are easily at 200.
The problem with Greece is not really the tourism of 200 but the culture they would have been generating which would seriously slow down your chance of victory.

1 amphitheater = 32 tourism after computers
1 themed archaeological museum = 54 tourism after computers
1 broadcast centre = 18 tourism after computers and satellite broadcasts.

So a single Greek Acropolis could create 104 tourism

Wonders create somewhere between 4 - 16 tourism after computers depending on their era
A single seaside resort can create anywhere between 4 and 40 tourism depending on what they have

Open borders is +25% tourism to a civ
A trade route is worth anywhere between +35-+125% tourism to a civ.

Lucky you were not against Teddy, he double tourism with broadcast centres.

 

[michaeljhuman]

thanks for all the replies. I didn't realize 5 cities was too low. On online speed, at some point ( very rough estimate turn 100,) it seems to take too much work to get a culture district and the buildings into the city to make a difference. And space can be very limited for good city sites. Of course I can speed things up a bit by holding gold to buy the buildings. And I can be careful about putting cities in low prod areas. I am SURE I can improve my gameplay, but whether 6 cities is practical on a small map with online speed is unclear. Certainly I can experiment.

 

[michaeljhuman]

5 cities is on the low end, but not fatal on a small map, though it really depends on how many cities the others have.

One thing that can help with delaying an enemy culture victory is by building a decent enough culture per turn yourself; focus on civics and getting the inspirations.

I have no problems with culture I think. I just presumed I could not actually that game myself, unless I attacked Greece, and there was too much in the way, and it was too late in the game I thought. Maybe I could have transitioned to more science, and gone for high tech units, and gotten enough open borders to smash through. But I admit to hating war. SO boring and slow.

 

[Josephias]

Try spies robbing their works of art! Worked for me once to take the Tourism lead from Greece, altough it was Prince dif.

 

[Archon_Wing]

I have no problems with culture I think. I just presumed I could not actually that game myself, unless I attacked Greece, and there was too much in the way, and it was too late in the game I thought. Maybe I could have transitioned to more science, and gone for high tech units, and gotten enough open borders to smash through. But I admit to hating war. SO boring and slow.

You need to keep your science up so you can get radio (seaside resorts) and computers (2x tourism). In a lot of games on King, I have like 10 tourism if even for most of the game, but that usually lets me overtake anyone in culture by spamming archeology digs, resorts, and broadcast towers.I would suggest to prioritize science over culture early on. Often times you can't even beat them to the first writers unless you buy the great person.

As for war, the trick is to build a lot of old units early on such as warriors and catapults and then use the 50% discount upgrade cart to upgrade them to infantry and artillery. And then buy an air balloon that gives siege units 3 range and you should be able to take them down fairly easily.