Balance & AI Training

civ_king

Deus Caritas Est
Joined
Mar 9, 2006
Messages
16,368
Just so you know, RifE allows the occasional Oasis as well. We just allow a spell for arcane units, letting you place it yourself; One per city.

That's just shameless :lol:
 

civ_king

Deus Caritas Est
Joined
Mar 9, 2006
Messages
16,368
Yes, but it also served to point out a different method that leaves more control in the hands of the player, if it's decided that Malakim in Orbis need more Oases. ;)

does the AI understand?


@Ahwaric, check out the naval code in the next level up forum
 

Humakty

Happy Goblin
Joined
Nov 16, 2007
Messages
762
Location
CheeseLand, Lyon
I also find the AI lacking in military consistency : it throws at you its elite units, while carefully leaving the support to garrison cities.
 

scutarii

King
Joined
Jun 10, 2008
Messages
747
self explanatory
 

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Wauthan

Inaniloquent Nihiliarian
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Messages
310
Location
Sweden
self explanatory

Just to make sure. I assume that the point you're addressing is that AI doesn't pick up or use items in a consistent manner. While I agree that's a bug I confess I'm happy that the AI doesn't use Holy Hand Grenades against the player. Those things are disruptive enough. And a bit silly.
 

Ahwaric

Shrubbery-hugger
Joined
Nov 12, 2005
Messages
1,217
Location
Kraków, Poland
Just to make sure. I assume that the point you're addressing is that AI doesn't pick up or use items in a consistent manner. While I agree that's a bug I confess I'm happy that the AI doesn't use Holy Hand Grenades against the player. Those things are disruptive enough. And a bit silly.
Yes, I need to find a way to make the AI pick equipment. But there are far worse AI offenses.
Regarding hand granade, I will remove it if asked for. It is an easter egg first of all, but I had some fun when I used it on Hyborem in one of the scenarios.
 

Kalina

Just lurking...
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
514
Location
Łódź, Poland
Yes, I need to find a way to make the AI pick equipment. But there are far worse AI offenses.
Regarding hand granade, I will remove it if asked for. It is an easter egg first of all, but I had some fun when I used it on Hyborem in one of the scenarios.

I don't mind either effect or flavor. In fact, I like effect and it can be easily reflavored to different item (scroll with powerful, ancient spell ? holy item of Old Ones ?) , while keeping effect :)
 

Wauthan

Inaniloquent Nihiliarian
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Messages
310
Location
Sweden
I don't mind either effect or flavor. In fact, I like effect and it can be easily reflavored to different item (scroll with powerful, ancient spell ? holy item of Old Ones ?) , while keeping effect :)

Yeah I can agree with that. Would be nice to tie something in-game to the Old Ones. And somehow an A-Bomb spell seems very appropriate for this religion. Perhaps a scroll containing part of the name of the Creator?

Guybrush Threepwood could use the same treatment. Lanun could use a hero with a close tie to the Old Ones, bot who's not actually part of the religious order itself. No, I'm not thinking about "Davy Jones" though the comparison is unavoidable.
 

arstal

Say No 2 Net Validations
Joined
Dec 22, 2005
Messages
771
Are workers still suiciding in Orbis?

The only time a worker shoudn't do everything it can to avoid battle is if it's the last defender of a city. You make that fix I think worker AI would be fine.
 

daveishere55

The Mad Scientist
Joined
Mar 15, 2010
Messages
35
Location
My Very Imposing Castle OF SCIENCE!
I've noticed some unusual AI religion behavior in my latest game after installing patch b; namely, some of them flip religions almost randomly.

For example, the Malakim under Kane founded the Old Ones in their second city, then spread that to their capital. Within the next 20 or so turns, RoK spread to their capital. They then spent the next few hundred turns switching between the two religions about every 10 to 20 turns until they got a city with Empyrean, which they adopted and have kept so far.

In the same game, the Order had spread to one of the Ljosalfar cities, caused them to adopt it, and they spread Order to their capital. However, when Empyrean reached their lands, they immediately switched to that for about 10-ish turns, then switched back to Order.

This seems like some sort of issue with the AI favoring certain religions for certain civs. If it is, it seems like it could use a little rebalancing to keep the AI from crippling themselves by constantly switching state religions.
 

Kalina

Just lurking...
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
514
Location
Łódź, Poland
Speaking of religions, I noticed that Runes are usually founded very late, even with Khazad and Luchuirp in game. Strange thing, as it quite powerful early religion, not only for dwarves.
 

Fluesterwitz

Chieftain
Joined
Jul 23, 2009
Messages
79
Just some feedback,

in my last game I was hit by The Blight - and survived. At first I s'posed it was game over, but while my cities lost some pop and lots of production, the effect levelled-off eventually. In fact, it felt like I s'pose a pandemic might appear from the lofty heights of the citadell, scary but basically a challenge to overcome. IMO very well designed. :goodjob:

Other fronts,

Jesemus (sp?), the Palatinate's hero is a mixed bag. He should either be earlier and a bit weaker or -preferably- be more melee/inquisitior oriented. Maybe that's just my predilection for Warhammer/Sapkowski (sp?) style fantasy.;)
 

Kalina

Just lurking...
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
514
Location
Łódź, Poland
You mean Jesemir ;) and i agree he could/should get some change

And feel less like water Shugenja ? ;)
I believe he is supposed to be follower of all those nature spirits (Vodnik and Poludnica), a priest of old pagan religion. Ability to actually summon them (on farm/swamp only maybe?) might be flavorful, but won't be very powerful that late in game. It's a good start though.
Palatinate seem very defensive, so maybe +% defense bonus (again, on farms and swamps only). He would be great defender than. I also thought about unlimited move on farm/swamps, something like double move elves and dwarves get, just unlimited. This way, if you build many farms and don't drain your swamps (flavorwise it would be preserving/providing homes of those nature spirits) you can have both powerful and very mobile defender. Those abilities can be limited by working only in cultural borders.
 

A Golden Dragon

Golden Dragon
Joined
Dec 20, 2008
Messages
232
don't really agree on the palatinate being defensive, and i don't have the all swampy nature feeling with them either. Played over 4 games with them.

I mainly used their raubritter units which combined with some trebuchet made for excellent mid game assaulting army, and when reïnforced with greatswords and landknechts i just marched over cities like nothing.

The Vodnik and poludnica that spawned over my farms, didn't make the difference ( though the waterwalking came in handy XD)

so for me the nature aspect ain't really that important. So how to improve Jesemir. Personal oppion, remove him, and replace him with a guild/millitary hero

improving:
add hero promotion, this will let him get to his current potential much earlier
his spells, are like that of any other druid, and not really that strong, the summons are not that strong, water walking is gained easily by any vodnik you come across. treetop defense aint that usefull either.
 

Jarrema

Master Voter
Joined
Jun 30, 2009
Messages
4,250
Location
At home
I would like rather that Palatinate take more "nature/pagan" feeling.
First step towar that could be remaking Jesemir.
What Kalina says is not bad, but I do not know if unlimited movement on farms and swamps is not OP. Maybe let him move on swamps like they are railroads when the swams are insight cultural borders.
I was also thinking, that adding some more creatures like vodnik and poludnica could increase that feeling (there are lots of them). Then, You will have a lot and differentiated units - so it must go with a price. I feel that something that emulates conflict between pagan ways and "new religion" would be appropriate. Like, for example, halving chance of "land spirits" spawning near the cities with any religious buildings
 

mcwill123

Pretender to the Throne
Joined
Apr 24, 2009
Messages
1,379
Location
Austin Texas, USA
I find Jesemir pretty much useless. Have been playing Palantines a lot and find he is so weak as to not be worth bothering. Vodniks do rock though. Put 5-6 of them in your battle group and after a few battles, you can easily have 50 or more drown to help batter down city defenses. Then possibly convert the beat up enemy to more drown.
 

Skeet66

Chieftain
Joined
Apr 21, 2010
Messages
37
Hi guys, I too think founded a possible bug..

The "Infernal Pact" tech might be broken.

As It never summons Hyborem, I get no errors or anything possible to hint-
me If there's a problem..just doesn't appear.

On the other hand Mercurians are fine.

I'm pretty good with XML so I added In Magisters Ideas of affinity for mana.

I thought that was the problem so I reinstalled..still nothing.
 

Kalina

Just lurking...
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Messages
514
Location
Łódź, Poland
Hi guys, I too think founded a possible bug..

The "Infernal Pact" tech might be broken.

As It never summons Hyborem, I get no errors or anything possible to hint-
me If there's a problem..just doesn't appear.

On the other hand Mercurians are fine.

I'm pretty good with XML so I added In Magisters Ideas of affinity for mana.

I thought that was the problem so I reinstalled..still nothing.

I had no problems with summoning Infernals. But they are created in different way then in base FFH - instead of being given free city in unsettled part of the map, they take control of existing AV city. They also can't take over city of your civ. So they are only spawned if AV city of civ different then yours exist.
 
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