BBC has evidence of Georgian war crimes in S. Ossetia

[RedRalph]

President Mikhail Saakashvili has denied that Georgia's armed forces committed war crimes during their attack on South Ossetia in August.

Evidence obtained by the BBC in the breakaway region suggests Georgia used indiscriminate force, and may have targeted civilians.

Witnesses said tanks had fired on an apartment block, and civilians were shot at as they fled the fighting.

UK Foreign Secretary David Miliband has raised the issue with Tbilisi.

Mr Saakashvili said: "We strongly deny any of this - any accusation of war crimes - but of course, we are very open for any kind of comments, we are very open for any kind of investigation.

"We called indeed for international investigation into [the] conduct of this war, into conditions leading to this war, into circumstances leading to this invasion."

There were certainly war crimes committed, certainly not by us

Mikhail Saakashvili


The claims against Georgia

He added: "Those areas which were under Georgian control - and they were not Georgian villages, they were basically villages mostly predominantly populated by ethnic Ossetians but they were affiliated with the Georgian government - were 100% destroyed.

"So, you know, there were certainly war crimes committed, certainly not by us."

'Without favour'

Mr Miliband - normally a strong supporter of Georgia - told the BBC: "I think the Georgian action was reckless, I think the Russian response was disproportionate and wrong. And that is the series of events that have landed us where we are.

"On my visit to Tbilisi of course I raised at the highest level in Georgia, the questions that have been asked and raised about war crimes and other military actions by the Georgian authorities. We have acted in this without fear, without favour."

South Ossetia and another region, Abkhazia, broke away from Georgia in the early 1990s, in the aftermath of the collapse of the Soviet Union.

Georgia's attempt to re-conquer South Ossetia triggered a Russian invasion and the most serious crisis in relations between the Kremlin and the West since the Cold War.

From BBC... thoughts, comments?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_depth/7692751.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7696119.stm

 

[Yoda Power]

I'm not surprised if it's true. Saakashvili has never been an angel, you know. But that doesn't justify the way Russia intervened, which was very unacceptable.

 

[Shekwan]

I believe they opened the attack with rocket attacks similar to the ones Hezbollah regularily do but on a larger scale, not exactly precision stuff. If they're willing to do that I then I wouldn't be at all surprised if these reports are true.

 

[woody60707]

Georgia used indiscriminate force,

Sure, I believe that. But I would also expect it.

and may have targeted civilians.

This I am iffy on. Are you saying some grunts on the ground did? Or are you saying higher command ordered them to?

Also this is a new age of warfare. The line of civilian and combatant is blurred sometimes.

 

[Abaddon]

I'm not surprised if it's true. Saakashvili has never been an angel, you know. But that doesn't justify the way Russia intervened, which was very unacceptable.

What would it take to justify it?

 

[Yoda Power]

What would it take to justify it?

They should have went through the UN.

 

[RedRalph]

They should have went through the UN.

would you want Denmark to go through the UN if for some bizarre reason Sweden began commiting war crimes against Danish citizens within sight of Copenhagen?

 

[Yeekim]

These "news stories" contain no news whatsoever...

 

[h4ppy]

Not if the Danish citizens were trying to break away from Sweden.

 

[Yeekim]

would you want Denmark to go through the UN if for some bizarre reason Sweden began commiting war crimes against Danish citizens within sight of Copenhagen?

What do you think UN is there for?

 

[RedRalph]

What do you think UN is there for?

Well its definitely not there for rapid response now is it? Its had years to deal with Darfur, form a Russian POV are you going to sit there and wait while Russians are being butchered just across the border? If Russia invaded Estonia I presume you wouldnt want anyone else to get involved but instead wait for the UN???

 

[philippe]

this isn't a surprise, georgia is a rogue state run by criminals.

 

[innonimatu]

What do you think UN is there for?

They tried to go through the UN. I seem to recall that in the very day of the georgian attack the US delayed a draft resolution presented by Russia to the Security Council, demanding a cease fire and the return to the status quo ante.

Now that we know the georgian plan was a mini-blitzkrieg with the goal of capturing and closing the tunnel linking South Ossetia to the Northern Caucasus, that early action seem at least suspicious.

 

[ComradeDavo]

I'm not surprised if it's true. Saakashvili has never been an angel, you know. But that doesn't justify the way Russia intervened, which was very unacceptable.

Yeah, agreed.

 

[Rashiminos]

I was never particularly in doubt of this fact. Hence my less condemnatory position on Russia, unlike other forum members.

 

[Berzerker]

well, what can you expect from a bunch of hypocrites? Georgia claims the moral authority to secede from Russia (and I agree they have it) but then attacks a province for seceding from that arrangement. And McCain criticizes Russia? WTH?

 

[Gooblah]

It's not that Russian actions were unjustified, since Georgia did attack Russian civilians and attacked an area under a UN-mandated Russian peacekeeper control. However, it it is the severity of Russian actions (bombing and invading Georgia proper and blockading the nation) and the lack of Russian actions (no prevention of South Ossetian gangs from pillaging/burning Georgian villages) that Senator McCain (and I) criticize.

Mr Saakashvalli may be no angel, but he is a damn sight better than Putin or Medvedev.

 

[LesCanadiens]

It's not that Russian actions were unjustified, since Georgia did attack Russian civilians and attacked an area under a UN-mandated Russian peacekeeper control. However, it it is the severity of Russian actions (bombing and invading Georgia proper and blockading the nation) and the lack of Russian actions (no prevention of South Ossetian gangs from pillaging/burning Georgian villages) that Senator McCain (and I) criticize.

Mr Saakashvalli may be no angel, but he is a damn sight better than Putin or Medvedev.

That's stupid. When another nation massacres your citizens, you do everything you can to not only stop them now, but prevent them from doing it again. That means raping their infrastructure. Russian actions were 100% justified.

 

[Arwon]

That's stupid. When another nation massacres your citizens, you do everything you can to not only stop them now, but prevent them from doing it again. That means raping their infrastructure. Russian actions were 100% justified.

You heard it here first folks! Rape = justified!

 

[Mandeville]

I agree, Russia was 100% justified. What Georgia did was behind everyones back but NATOs and our leaders told us nothing.