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Best Civ for Dramatic Age

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by CORNELIUS RUBSAMEN, Oct 7, 2020.

  1. 8housesofelixir

    8housesofelixir Emperor

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    Probably because Cree is one of the best generalist civ while people tend to view "super-specialist" as "overpowered" (with the exception of Nubia).
     
  2. DrCron

    DrCron Prince

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    Civs that have mounted units that can move fast will help a lot, since you want to exploit the abundance of free cities (bonus everything from pillaging, also farming experience for promotions that give era points, also capturing their builders ad nauseam).

    I think Scythia or Gran Colombia are good examples.

    You will definitely not be able to repeat more than 2 golden ages in a row if you play peacefully (at least on Deity, because the AI will get many wonders and great people before you), so either be super aggressive or be ready to re-conquer your cities quickly, so you don't fall behind (I tried to start very peaceful on this mode because of a semi-isolated spawn, and it was a huge mistake).
     
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  3. iammaxhailme

    iammaxhailme Emperor

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    I got so rich pillaging those free cities with light cav + privateers in my last game. I've got to try a dramatic ages game as Norway or Mapuche sometime.
     
  4. Abaxial

    Abaxial King

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    I sailed through peacefully as Maya, but admittedly it was on Prince, not Deity.
     
  5. iammaxhailme

    iammaxhailme Emperor

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    In my last game I was Eleanor's France, on Emperor. I got a classical dark age, but every era after that was golden. I never went to war except once when somebody declared war on me, did nothing, then signed a peace deal as soon as they could.

    Of course, being Eleanor I got a lot of golden age points from cities flipping to me, so that's a bit different.
     
  6. Kmart_Elvis

    Kmart_Elvis King

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    I'm finally getting around to trying Dramatic Ages and your mention of Mapuche inspired me, so I'm going to give them a go. (And last time I won as them was in the R+F era before the Hall of Fame and I need to get Lautaro on there.) Not only are Malón Raiders perfect to pillage the free cities, but they can chip away at loyalty through pillaging and killing units. And then the bonus +10CS against civs in golden ages seem like it would be better in this mode. A civ is either in a golden age (where the bonus is active) or they are in a dark age and losing cities. Seems like a win-win to me.
     
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  7. Sostratus

    Sostratus Deity

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    I keep meaning to try this to verify the behavior...

    I might suggest Byzantium because of hippodromes. Hear me out- all we want to do is put Hippodromes+arenas in all our cities, okay? Farm up that free heavy cavalry.
    When a dark age hits, we use our wonderful horde of Free heavy cav to go beat up the free cities (if they flip from us, they will have our religion already) and thus capture a city with an entertainment complex and arena.
    AFAIK free cities don’t get uniques- see the complaint about tsikhe- so the Hippodrome will convert into an EC when the city flips to free.

    This means when you recapture it, the EC reconverts to a Hippodrome and you get more free heavy cav. (This works on AI cities with ECs, unsure about free cities.)
    You may even be able to farm this, not that anyone needs that many heavy cav. But Byzantium seems in a unique position to at least be able to take free cities back super fast with their cavalry.
    Killing free city units does not spread religion, though.
     
  8. Koljar

    Koljar Chieftain

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    Wouldn't you need to ensure enough money income in order to supply all those heavy cavs? So hippodromes/EC + financial district and/or harbor.

    Main difficulty in this case could be getting to the UU.
     
  9. Muskie

    Muskie Warlord

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    Aren't Byzantiums free heavy cavalry maintenance free? Heavy Cav isn't the best for taking cities I like the Manpuche suggestion above too. I am trying all four modes on at once and it is hard. Apocolypse is my least favourite mode, why would you choose more disasters and global warming? It is a lot more random, random tech tree means you basically take what you can get rather than doing a lot of long term planning. I am Pericles and I like him/Greece as a good all around civ, extra culture and I am Hermatic Order so I am in contact with a lot of City States. Usually I do better at science than culture especially early on. Later on too, but that is by choice, I'm trying to focus on culture more this game. I'm also going to build two holy sites because one could flip or I just find some AI go so hard on religion they try to convert my one city with a holy site.

    Some AI definitely seem to do better and go hard for religion or culture. I usually end up winning diplomatically it is my fall back and I find it quicker than a lot of the other victory conditions though eventually people vote you down so getting the last 2-3 points is hardest getting to the teens is usually pretty quick and then I just make it my focus regardless of what my original plan was.
     
  10. Sostratus

    Sostratus Deity

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    They are resource free, meaning they don’t cost any resource upkeep. IE oil for tanks.
    Still gotta pay gold to upkeep them.

    However, Basil’s leader ability gives Heavy (and light) cavalry the ability to deal full damage to walls, making them premier city slayers.
     
  11. Abaxial

    Abaxial King

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    Apart from the exploit to get masses of faith in Apocalypse mode via the great Bath. I see no great appeal in Apocalypse mode. The main feature - soothsayers - is just dumb, and the "Appease the Gods" event utterly ridiculous, even in a game not known for its fidelity to real life.
     
  12. blackbutterfly

    blackbutterfly Emperor

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    Although the Malon Raider is great and the +10 vs. GA civs, Swift Hawks ability is useless even with Dramatic Ages.

    I think Firaxis should consider buffing it.
     
  13. RealHuhn

    RealHuhn Emperor

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    I've tried to use this ability with the help of cultists but it was impossible to flip a city unless it had negative loyalty per turn to begin with. Even when I pushed loyalty below zero by pillaging tiles or killing units it didn't work. So yeah, it's even more useless than before.
     
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  14. Abaxial

    Abaxial King

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    So, I had this idea. Play as Maori on a terra map, the idea being that Kupe can sail to the New World tout suite and expand happily there, while the other civs are stuck in the Old World (they never seem to reach the New World) fighting like cats in a sack. Then hopefully, after a few dark ages, there should be a critical mass of free cities that will just absorb everything, wiping out the AI civs one after another. Which would be fun to watch.

    It didn't turn out that way, though. The free cities invariably petitioned for readmission to some empire, not necessarily the one that founded them. Generally only half the AI civs had a dark age at any one time. So none of them really got into much trouble.
     
  15. Deadly Dog

    Deadly Dog Prince

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    Interesting I've done this exact same thing and found about what you expected would happen: about half the civs disappeared entirely into a black hole of free cities in the old world. Only one other civ managed to get cities on the New world part of the map, and those never flipped as loyalty pressure (and city density) overall in the New World was much lower.

    It was a weird game as I handicapped myself severely, mainly by not settling my first city until 930 AD. I think that's the only reason the AI eventually discovered the New World (Harald had found us but lost all his cities before he could settle alongside me), the game went on really long and eventually I had to settle for a diplomatic victory or lose a diplo victory to Japan.
     
  16. blackbutterfly

    blackbutterfly Emperor

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    I'm playing now Maori on Terra.

    What you want is play on TSL Earth. Play as any non European vs. Europe.
     
  17. The Civs 6

    The Civs 6 King

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    I'm an NFP skeptic, but let me present you my argument for why apocalypse mode is good. In a normal game without it, you will probably suffer one to two impactful natural disasters. In other words, it just isn't really a factor in the game at all.

    First, is that really true to real life? As I understand history, various natural disasters have significantly changed the course of history. And at the scale that Civ 6 operates at, the frequency of natural disasters in this mode is more realistic than what happens in a normal game.

    Second, it makes the map more dynamic and chaotic. This is an improvement on the normal game, because it reduces the power of careful planning. And unlike the other NFP game modes, this doesn't simply add another feature (which inevitably the AI is inferior at dealing with, which in practice results in the mode making the game easier for humans who can exploit it).

    To qualify my argument, I don't use soothsayers because they don't have any flavor.

    To conclude, of all the NFP game modes, I actually return to apocalypse as the best one. Aside from the arguments I presented already, let me ask this - what sounds more flavorful: "I got a lot of 'faith points' because I joined some weird cult 4000 years ago and built monuments, and I was able to use those to buy great people 3000 years later" OR "a big flood miraculously came in and destroyed the enemy invasion/my own invasion." To me, it's obviously the second one.
     
  18. greenOak

    greenOak Warlord

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    Despite possibly being more realistic, I don’t want more RNG I have no control over in my games.
     
  19. Kotofei

    Kotofei Chieftain

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    Tried Eleanor on Immortal. Lost and re-captured one city during the classical dark age, but after that between GWAMs, flipping cities, and blasting through the civic tree it's non-stop golden ages.

    Flipping a free city isn't any different than flipping an AI city for Eleanor, so I felt like Dramatic Ages are kind of moot.
     
  20. Taefin

    Taefin Chieftain

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    I’m itching to try a game of dramatic ages with some new settings I’ve been trying out with Firetuner autoplay. Got the AI to finally invade each other by setting the their risk tolerance for city invasion way up, and then 50% of cities breaking away on dark ages and then switching to whoever has GA with ~5 turns. Paired with Zees pacing and climate mods, I’ve been seeing AI civs completely conquer one another through some epic modern/atomic wars, and then loose half their empire which is absorbed by the survivors of the conquest. Had one of those survivors build up an army and do an info age conquest of that earlier empire, taking over their entire continent. Definitely would want to bring a little diplomatic balance back in, but it really feels like DA can achieve some of the actual rise and fall dynamics that make the Pax Americana look more like a fluke than the inevitable course of history.
     
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