best economic model for max happiness and sustainablity?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Narz, Jul 25, 2020.

  1. Denkt

    Denkt Left Forever

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    I'm not sure, many in those countries think that western europe and USA is doing better than they are.
     
  2. Cokolwiek

    Cokolwiek Prince

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    Hard to compare such diverse, global economy as US or even France to Denmark for example. Also, with all their socialist (I don't use as an invective) policies, they are extremely entrepreneurship focused and generally right-wingy on some parts of economic policies. Denmark had better ease of doing business score than US, Norway and Sweden in top ten also, far ahead of Germany, China, Ireland, Netherlands (I was shocked). In some way they are the best of BOTH world's, not only nanny-state but also wet dream of any libertarian.
     
  3. Denkt

    Denkt Left Forever

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    Keep in mind that ease of doing business is not the same as ease to exploit labor or things like that. China don't really allow foreign business at all, except if they are sponsored by a chinese business or something like that so obviously they are going to score poorly.

    Much of the criticism in scandinavia would be something like high taxes for poor social services, poor pension and that education is not worth it since wages are not really much or better at all.

    It seems to be the same with every western country, the biggest criticism come from the inside and other countries are seen as superior to your own.
     
  4. Cokolwiek

    Cokolwiek Prince

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    Are living in XIX century predatory capitalism to mention things like that? :D Exploit labor sound like something that doesn't happen in OECD countries anymore (unless you ask a extreme leftist without college degree who consider good job at a workhouse, the only one he aspired to, exploitation) Of course it means mostly low initial costs of setting up a firm and low burden of bureaucracy inefficiency.
    Oh I know, I had a Swedish girlfriend who came to UK and Poland to study medicine because its free and better. In her opinion high schools or tertiary education were very bad in Sweden, which was a shock to me as Polish, because it is us who were supposed to be worst in everything in EU, not them, highly advanced, rich, clean Scandinavian country we always immigrate to! We are still miles behind, pensions are abysmal, but healthcare is getting better slightly for example we had more respirator than UK.
     
  5. Denkt

    Denkt Left Forever

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    Wealth inequallity may actually be a sign of good times: https://voxeu.org/article/europe-s-rich-1300

    Here the only times it drop is due to devestating events, saying that world wars or black death would be good or stuff got better don't make all that much sense. The time period when inequallity is growing was pretty much the golden age for Europe in terms of political and technological dominance.

    Keep in mind that wealth inequallity is not the same thing as income inequallity, countries like Sweden have high wealth inequallity but low income inequallity. Stability allow wealth to grow and thus lead to larger and larger wealth inequallity but that is not the same thing is stuff is getting worse and worse, in fact it may be the sign of the opposite since stability encourage economic and technologial developement because there is less risk of losing your investment. WW1 and WW2 maybe set Europe behind decades in terms of economic development which is not good for anyone really.

    People have the idea that wealth is fininte and the rich is hoarding it which is not true, wealthy socities will have high wealth inequallity because of their value of their industries compared to an society just built on something on farming. Income inequallity is however a problem but in many cases it actually seems to go down, even as wealth inequallity increase.

    https://www.ifs.org.uk/conferences/bob_gordon.pdf
    Here to get an idea how bad ww1 and ww2 was for European economies, the relative productivity between Europe and USA reached the bottom level just after ww2 and it took several decades to reach back to similar level seen in 1800s and only in 2000s when Europe start to surpass USA in terms of productivity per worked hour.
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
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  6. Mise

    Mise isle of lucy

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    Yeah, I'm perfectly ok with this. They couple a free market with a strong social safety net, which in the broadest of terms has always been my favoured economic set-up. It's been about a decade since I've really looked at this though so it's possible that my thinking is out of date, given, you know, everything.

    I don't know enough about the US to say whether it can be replicated there at a federal level, btw. I was speaking as someone living in the UK. I think we can and should emulate those nations.
     
  7. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    If you start to think about emulating Scandinavian countries... it does no harm to understand "hygge" and the connected "law of Jante".

    Shopping what you like ?
    It's I think more like having a relation with someone: you get the package with some room for tweaks.

    By which I do not intend to say that there is not much to learn from hygge and Jante.
    I like those elements up to a certain level... you get more trust and social at the price of stronger in-group repression on cheating and antisocial.... it also means giving up some things more related to free individuality at the expense of your group.

    Our Northern Provinces in NL are a bit like the Northern countries.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
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