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[BTS] BOTM 148, First Spoiler, to 1 AD

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Game of the Month' started by Deckhand, Feb 3, 2018.

  1. Deckhand

    Deckhand Procrastination at its finest GOTM Staff

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    BOTM 148: some guy on a big continent (will update later)

    Use this thread to tell us what happened in your game, up to 1AD!

    Have you met any AIs?
    How many cities?
    Anything interesting happen?
    edit, any trouble with barbs?
    huts? events?


    Stop! If you are participating in BOTM 148, then you MUST NOT read this thread unless EITHER
    • You have reached at least 1 AD in your game, OR
    • You have submitted your entry
    Posting Restrictions

    • Please do not disclose ANY events or information gained post 1 AD.
    • Please do not reveal your final result if that happened after 1 AD.
    • Please do not discuss the location of resources that may not show up before 1 AD. (Iron is OK, coal and oil are not)
    • Do not post any savegame file from the game. Discussions and screenshots are fine but not actual games
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2018
  2. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Allrighty then. Opened the game, hovered over the scoreboard. "Holy smokes, that's a lot of tiles!" :o The sheer size of the thing didn't sink in until we got Calendar though. The huge world I had uncovered was barely half the actual world. This one will take a while ;)

    The start was very unusual given we started with a worker. Excellent type of map to do that with btw (see above). Sent scouts and warrior off, and decided it was best to settle in place. Loads of food, but it should be a good location. Wasn't quite sure what to do with the worker and which tech to go for. Eventually I decided for Fishing while building a warrior. The worker roading until border expanded and he could start farming. AH next iirc. Think I also made the unusual move of building a settler at size 2, due to IMP. Sent him northwards for the pig, with the starting worker being ready on the spot after having improving two food sources in the capital.

    Hoped to get both the Great Lighthouse and Oracle -> Civil Service, and due to the map layout I went for GLH first. Never got time to start towards the Oracle as it went in 950BC (iirc), and somebody picked Theology (Christianity founded early). But the GLH helped a great deal, and break-even tech rate went from ~25% to 40%.

    Haven't killed a single AI unit, but have expanded to 15 cities by 1AD. But not without some barb issues, and the RNG hating me. You know how getting screwed by the RNG sometimes have more serious consequences than 'normally'?
    Spoiler :


    That's a city guardian archer, with various bonuses. Damn barb got two promotions from the kertuffle, and not only did he win an "impossible" fight, he barely got a scratch :mad: Also notice the last line, which is another smack in the face, when a Combat Chariot lost a 90% fight. That same chariot could have prevented this whole charade if he didn't pointlessly die. Thankfully I managed to take back the city a few turns later -- but not before getting screwed by the RNG again. A Chariot attacked the Axe (at full health now, but only 10% fortification) at 90%, and of course died. Thankfully he got badly injured this time, so a backup warrior could take the city at 99.5%.

    At least the city wasn't razed, as it got to size 2 the same turn the barb captured it. Overall, I think it's safe to say I've been unlucky with combat odds this game.


    In terms of events, I've barely seen anything. A "major" research setback, but it was only 13 :science: towards Math (I think it was). No luck with huts either, at least the starting ones. We came across five, but only got two maps and some gold (a good deal of gold tbf, over 200). But later we came across a few more, and finally got a good result, with free Compass (not terribly useful in itself, but still very nice). Some hostile barbs popped out too, and later a free warrior. Not great, but it could have been worse, and that gold early was quite nice.

    Tried to get Stonehenge too, as I figured it would be useful given the massive size of the map. Was 1-2 turns away, and got 95 :gold: from it. Annoying there and then, but perhaps it was a blessing in disguise as the economy was in a bad shape at the time, with barely making any profit at 0% research.

    Founded Confucianism and Taoism in the same turn, first from CoL and then a GS pop. Normally I'd use the first GS for an Academy, but it seemed a bit pointless here given the poor commerce-capital. Used another GS for part-bulbing Education, which was just completed in 1AD. Don't have Metal Casting yet, though. Sury has it, but won't trade, so think I need to tech it myself next. Have self-teched Calendar too, but got Monarchy for free. We needed happiness rather badly, and I had actually totally forgotten about the happy-boosting unique building at Math, so glad I self-teched that early-ish. Had to whip it in some places to increase happiness from 4. Later Monarchy helped, and especially Calendar when we could also start trading for some happies from other AIs.

    Speaking of them, boy are they big, and far away. Sury and Zara have 24 cities between them, and the others aren't far behind. Still heaps of land to expand into as well. Technically I've seen all AIs due to map trading, but I've not made contact with a nutter yet. Got another shock when trading maps. First of all, it was unusually expensive, but when I saw the sheer massiveness of it, I can understand why! :crazyeye: With 15 cities and most of them having expanded borders already, we cover a measly 6% of the land.... :help:

    Not sure what victory to go for, had thought about domination pre-game, but the way this looks, it may actually be faster to go to space. I'll play on and see what happens. Jungle kinda sucks, but at least the ground is green underneath, while much of the land to the north is plains as far as the eye can see. Not pretty :sad:

    One potentially big coincidence is that Sury managed to steal a barb city nearby Zara, which was hilariously defended by two warriors (with two workers inside). Then they build an archer, which was promptly sent OUT of the city the turn before it got attacked. Smart barbs... Anyway, this is already causing border tension, so it's possible a war could break out at some point. Only Zara and Cyrus have the same religion, all others are different (not entirely sure about Shaka yet, could be he and Sitting Bull share Buddhism).

    As usual I made some stupid moves without thinking, like GS-bulbing into Education the turn before completing Hanging Gardens and gaining 11-12 pop. Not a big deal, only 33-ish :science: but still... stuff like that can annoy me.

    After founding two religions, I sent both missionaries to the capital. Confu got there first and of course spread. The Taoist failed. So I went with Confucianism, which has now spread to 6-7 cities (and I'm actually building a few missionaries myself now, an unusual move for me).

    Probably on the long side already, so a quick summary:
    15 cities, 12 workers (or was it 10?)
    Capital is size 13, 14 next turn
    Doing 320 :science: at 100%. Break-even is around 50% (again, iirc).

    Despite the huge map and barb troubles (some warriors attacked too, but died on the now-deceased archer at 0% odds), it's been a fun map so far, and I was "just one more turn"-ing until 10 last morning... Not good! :D
     
  3. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Awesome. Another city lost to the RNG hating me. This time it got razed.

    Fun Factor is scraping the floor now. Not sure if I'll bother finishing this mammoth. Not with crap like this routinely happening.
     
  4. Deckhand

    Deckhand Procrastination at its finest GOTM Staff

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    Thanks for a great writeup, meant to say so initially.

    I'm similar - I like to win, win, win and have trouble with setbacks.
    Sorry for city loss, and hope you play on.
    Also, regretfully there is no place for posts between 1AD and submission. I will wait a bit on creating final spoiler to give you a chance to consider how many cities you do have.
     
  5. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    True, that's why I was very brief and non-descriptive; just felt like a moan about losing yet another city to terrible odds.

    Am playing a 'normal' game now, with Buffy .005, and got absolutely mauled by barbs there too. Two rows of them coming in (without Great Wall built yet anywhere). Lost a city (razed). Whipped and chopped out chariots and managed to remove the threat (killed 11 barbs in 3-5 turns). But we had gems for research help, so I decided to go "all in" for HAs with two cities. Asoka in the process of dying now. Thankfully that capital happened to have many forests. But I digress, again, sorry :o

    Possible I pick up this BOTM again, but not now.
     
  6. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Civ IV Emperor EQM Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    I usually play with Barbs off so it was a bit of a shocker when the first one appeared!! I built the GW but totally forgot it only worked on your own continent, oops - luckily I had better RNG luck than Pangaea and didn't lose my city.

    Was planning a HA assault (popped HBR and Calendar from huts) and score milking but then realised how big the map is so plan is for the religious route. Have 5 cities and the AP has just been built in my capital.

    Remarkably few events triggered, something to do with the size of the map perhaps??
     
  7. MarleysGh0st

    MarleysGh0st Chieftain

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    Before starting this game, I thought the setup was well suited to my slow builder style. Given the large map and the extra units for the AI, it was unlikely any other players would score some early conquests.

    By 1 AD, I've settled 8 cities. Istanbul built the Oracle in 725 BC for the CS sling, then some chopping gave it the GLH in 625 BC. I've contacted Cyrus, Sury, and ZY. I have a tech lead, but Sury has an awful lot of land!

    Barbs weren't a notable problem, although a jaguar ate one of my scouts very early on, while it was defending on a jungle hill. I did fairly well with the huts, gaining a map, some gold, Hunting, Mysticism, and a warrior.

    As for the events, one thing was clear: the gods want their wild animals to run free! My pastures were destroyed three different times. :rolleyes:
     
  8. Alquest

    Alquest Chieftain

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    Being a total noob most GOTM are beyond me, but this one had 'prince'' written. That's my level. Got AH from a hut, and tried to take advantage of that. So showed up with some 6 (later 10) chariots at Persopolis and wow.. was i broke.. and confronted with some 5 archers to defend.. Useless.. So peace, and 10- turns later I decided to sacrifice the 6 chariots and 4 archers to get some money going. Persepolis was defended by 2 units, keeping city would cost me 19 gold. So raze the city. And then got killed. Not at all prince...
    Normally I then go make a few mined gold-hills-oasis but buffy removed worldbuilder from the menu....
    My big friend is Khan, we share juduism and he gives me somethimes tech. The big blue (mongolia) is the natural enemy of Khan. If they get into an all-out war it might go MAD. Still waiting...
    Oh and I have to report Bull. He played under anarchy (or strike) for millennia.
    Plan is to get tanks, have all the ai kill eachother and take citys for free.
    I just got a few (10 or so) pathetic city, many cottages. Given the shape of the map, my empire looks like a clown's hat, bells included.
     
  9. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Civ IV Emperor EQM Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    To be precise that's not Buffy that's the selection of "Locked Modified Assets" when the game is set up, I select that even for non-HOF / GOTM games as it means you don't have the temptation to alter things like you suggested!
     
  10. georgjorge

    georgjorge Deity Wannabe

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    It's good to play another BOTM after more than a year!

    1AD: 19 cities - a bit above 100 BPT at break-even (goal: space)

    I knew from the start that I wanted Great Lighthouse as fast as possible, since Tectonics maps tend to favor that. I got it after my third city I think, rather early, and it allowed me to settle the vast land without slowing research to a crawl. Settler production was crazy with Imperialistic and a Worker from the start. I wanted to enhance the Great Lighthouse by Seraiel's wonder economy (putting overflow from whips into wonders for failgold), which failed miserably because at 19 cities I still don't have Marble or Stone (!!!). And with Paper in, I now know that I wasn't supposed to get those at all. So I didn't put that plan into action, slowing down my research considerably. I plan to build the Mausoleum, then go to Constitution for Representation (Pyramids were built too far away to conquer), probably Democracy as well, and then towards Sushi as fast as I can.

    The AI expand rather well with the second Settler, they all have about 10 cities. Have met all of them and got trade routes with everyone except Zara (barb city blocking the coast). I am about to attack Darius with Horse Archers, then Cats and Maces for Zara or Sury. They even traded me some techs (not so usual on Prince).

    No events for me at all so far, and huts were not spectacular - two maps, two huts with gold, a Warrior, and Horseback Riding (yay!).
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2018
  11. georgjorge

    georgjorge Deity Wannabe

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    @Alquest: if there is a map totally not suitable for a Chariot rush, I think this is it ;) AI starts with Archers, is very far away, and there's so much land to settle with Imperialistic Settlers. I hope your tank plan works!

    @Pangaea: that's some really harsh luck! But at least you were able to restrain yourself from going all-out on cities, and your research is ahead of mine because of that. I also got Hanging Gardens (with already 19 cities), probably the second-strongest wonder on this map before the Modern era (after Great Lighthouse). Oracle was gone for me as well, around 1200BC...
     
  12. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    Have forgot the details from this game now, as I haven't played after that double-kick in the face from the RNG devils. Looks like my top research rate was pretty decent (from the text above), but sounds like you have a more developed plan, and ready to start kicking AI butt. Got my arse handed to me by the RNG instead, which isn't so much fun :sad:

    Good luck. Sushi on a map like this may be strong, as I seem to recall a fair bit of fish etc around. And with so much land, you could milk score something silly if going that route.
     
  13. babybluepants

    babybluepants Chieftain Supporter GOTM Staff

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    It's not often that an early rush doesn't make sense on Prince, but this is definitely it. :D

    Capital site was amazing. The rest of the land we got was very expansive, but slightly awkward to settle. Lots of early border pops needed, and lots of duplicate resources. I started by building a settler, and it felt a little bit off. Like it was too early, and I wasn't quite ready for it. My second city went to the NE for the pigs, third to the SW for corn/cow. I didn't read the announcement thread very carefully, and was shocked to find out that the AI's had more cities than me by the time I met them! TGW went very early in my game (2400BC), which was disconcerting, as well. :eek:

    The lack of happiness was a real challenge early, and continues to be at 1AD. I researched Math early for the CS sling and that helped get my top two cities going a bit with the UB. Also self-teched Monarchy right after the Oracle, which is a rarity for me. I've been delaying Hunting until now, so that I can keep pumping out warriors, but now I am ready to hook up ivory.

    Capital got GLH, Colossus, TGL and NE, as well as an early academy. Another city got the Oracle, to avoid the GP pollution and free up the capital for some settlers at that time. I want to settle the stone that's between Sury and Cyrus, but I am running late. Started on HG without, and Education could be in 3-4t... Otherwise, I have 13 cities, 59 pop, 13 workers, 3 settlers on route. Doing about 300bpt at 100% and 175bpt at break-even. Research went something like Oracle CS - Monarchy - Currency - MC - Lit - Calendar - Philosophy - Paper - Education (part bulb). I got Pottery and Aesthetics from goody huts. Never play with huts, so this was a nice surprise, especially the very early Pottery.

    No clear plans for the rest of the game yet. I still have sites to settle and basic infrastructure to whip. I just got Paper a couple of turns ago and traded for maps, revealing the extents of the massive continent. (I edited out the map in the attached screenshot to not spoil). This would be a fun map for galleon conquest/dom, but I am scared of the size and the associated time commitment. Taking a planning break...
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  14. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Chieftain GOTM Staff

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    wuck suck suck I suck
     
  15. Pangaea

    Pangaea Rock N Roller

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    How have you done so far kcd?

    If you finish the game, you're probably doing better than I have at least. Not looking too promising on that front as I'm playing other games instead, and don't feel very motivated to pick up this after all the jokes the rng pulled on me. Plus, it's a pretty big map which will take time to finish, with mostly ugly land. But we'll see. A decent while to the deadline still.
     
  16. LinkDinkin

    LinkDinkin Chieftain

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    Finally picking this game up after a couple weeks off. By 1 AD I had a nice tech rate and decent tech advantage. Modest 12 cities, which is in line with the AI. I missed Pyramids by a few turns and Hanging Gardens by 1 turn, which was frustrating. Prob should have skipped that without stone. I did manage to get GLH, GL (without marble), and Colossus (without copper), and squeak out MoM, which will be very nice one day. I should be able to win the Lib race pretty easily and might go after Suryavarman with Cuirassiers or Cavalry. He's leading in score and I can leave Cyrus around to trade with. It'll be a long game still, but sometimes it's fun to manage a lot of cities when the tide of war keeps rolling.
     
  17. DynamicSpirit

    DynamicSpirit Fear him of the pink tie Moderator GOTM Staff

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    I settled in-place and ended up - somewhat unusually - building a settler first, after I realised that doing so would only take about 15 turns, not much slower than building a worker. And of course we already started with one worker. Two workers for one city seemed like overkill, and I have to say that - unlike babybluepants - I felt that settler-first worked out really well.

    2nd city NE for the pigs+fish, and 3rd (if I recall correctly) up North to get the ivory – the only source of happiness.

    I’m not quite sure how I did it, but I somehow managed to expand a lot faster than I normally do while still building wonders. I quickly figured that the capital was probably useless as a typical high-science city, but would make a great wonder-factory. I also figured the AI were all too far away for early warring to be worthwhile, so economic wonders would be more useful than in most games. In fact I still haven’t even met 2 of the AI.

    I started with the great lighthouse (self-evidently very useful on this kind of map. Then the Oracle – for that I took advantage of the philosophical trait giving me an early great scientist to bulb mathematics while researching Code of Laws – enabling me to Oracle civil service – if I recall correctly, around 900 BC. By 1AD I’d also picked up the hanging gardens and the colossus, all in the capital.

    With the starting spot being used for wonders, I had the inevitable search for a better spot to move the capital to get a high-science bureaucracy capital. That search proved a bit frustrating. For ages, the only good place I could see was in the middle of the island to the South, where a river was flowing through luscious grassland, and a city could give me sheep plus nine riverside cottages, albeit at a cost of orphaning the iron, and not having the extra great-lighthouse trade routes in the capital. Was it worth it? Fortunately I remembered just in time that this was on an island, so if I moved my capital there, I’d probably end up crippled by colonial costs from my umpteen mainland cities. So I didn’t!

    Eventually, I discovered a great spot on the peninsula to our East, south of the Khmer lands. Clams, great lighthouse trade routes, and 11 – yes, 11 – riverside tiles (plus four non-riverside grasslands). So, as at 1AD, Malatya has been recently founded, and I even have a great scientist on his way. Unfortunately, the Khmer have got to the vicinity first, and Malatya (size = 1) is sitting half buried in Khmer culture. I think for a while the shortly-to-be-founded academy will have more use as a culture-pusher than a science centre! This is seriously long-term planning… And guess who I’m probably going to go to war with first.

    Anyway, vital stats: 12 cities, all self-founded (!!!!) and all coastal, 46 total pop, sustainable science 112 at 50%. Currently researching construction.

    Overall I'm pretty happy at this stage - although seeing georgjorge's write-up makes me realise I still have a lot of learning to do in the art of early expansion.

    botm148-1ad.jpg
     

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