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[BTS] BOTM 178: Thráin II, Immortal - Final Spoiler - Game Submitted

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Game of the Month' started by Noble Zarkon, Dec 19, 2019.

  1. Noble Zarkon

    Noble Zarkon Civ IV Emperor EQM Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    Use this thread to tell us what happened in your game, particularly anything after 1AD

    Did you win? How did you manage your economy? Was Mining Inc a help or a hindrance?

    Reading Requirements
    If you are participating in BOTM 178 then you MUST NOT read this thread unless
    • You have submitted your entry

    Posting Restrictions
    • Do not post any savegame file from the game. Discussions and screenshots are fine but not actual games.
     
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  2. MarleysGh0st

    MarleysGh0st Prince

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    I researched C.S. in 50 AD and switched to Bureacracy and O.R. In 200, I spread Mining, Inc. to my second city and converted to my own Confucianism, despite the three AI I've met all being Buddhist. At Immortal difficulty, that may have been a poor diplomatic decision.

    I went a bit crazy building wonders after that: Hanging Gardens, Parthenon and the Great Library in my capital, and the Great Lighthouse on the sea coast to the northwest. Given the lack of resources and the poor commerce on this map, I don't think any of these were excessive. Nor were Notre Dame, the Mausoleum, the U. of Sankore, and the Taj Mahal, which I built later in the game.

    At 475, I noticed Isabella was plotting, almost certainly against me. I got Construction in 500 and started building Ballista Elephants. These proved very handy when Isabella declared war in 620. She attacked Banteay Kdei (a city I'd just settled at the river mouth to the southeast of Holy Roman territory. Although I held off the initial attack and hurt her badly, I couldn't get enough reinforcements there in time. Isabella razed the city and then pulled back her army. Charlemagne immediately moved in and settled Pisa on the ruins of my city, which was not only annoying but rather odd, considering that he originally had a settler on the site before I did, but had inexplicably pulled it back.

    At this point, I started worrying about the A.P. uniting the Buddhist powers against me. I traded for Theology and used a GE to rush the A.P, myself, in 860. Charlemagne declared war in 900, but didn't invade with any significant army. I raze Pisa in 940 and resettle Banteay Kdea in 980. I destroy another of Isabella's invading armies and sign a peace treaty with her in 1130. My offensive against Charlemagne fails against his landsknechts, so I settle for some gold for peace in 1200.

    I've spread Confucianism to two English cities to the north of my territory, but that's not enough for Churchill to consider converting. He starts plotting against me and attacks in 1330. In the war that follows, I capture three of his cities (including the two I converted), but Churchill still won't capitulate. In the meantime, I've paid some gold in response to Isabella's demand, keeping the peace there. And in 1440, I finally make contact with Tokugawa! I had thoroughly explored the western mountain wall, even finding a potential entry into the land beyond it (which would only have required building a city on the lake in the far northwest corner, then ferrying units across the lake, then repeating that process once or twice more :rolleyes:) but I had only managed to glimpse the edge of his border. What finally established the diplomatic contact was the fact that he peace-vassaled to Isabella! Why he felt insecure in his hidden kingdom, I'll never know. :confused:

    In 1510, I notice that Charlemagne is plotting, so I take some gold from Churchill for peace. Charley declares war in 1570 and Isabella starts plotting. I push a stack forward to besiege Mainz. In 1580 I research Steel and start building/upgrading cannons. In 1635, I notice that Isabella is marching a stack down the same road my reinforcements are marching up and it's obvious she's ready to launch another attack against me. I capture Mainz and make peace with Charley. Then, to force the issue, I demand 1 gold from Isabella. To my surprise, she gives in to the demand, handing me 10 turns of peace with her!

    So, I use this opportunity to resume the attack on Churchill. I declare war in 1660, capture Coventry in 1670, and accept his capitulation in 1675.

    Charley agrees to open borders (extending the peace treaty with him). I declare war against Isabella in 1690. She takes Coventry from me, but I take it back and then take Santiago. In 1730 Tokugawa breaks free from her, which makes her willing to capitulate. I press on to take Salamanca and Cordoba, then let her bend the knee in 1735.

    In 1740, I declare war against Charlemagne. I take three more of his cities and he capitulates in 1775. All of this time, I was still at war with Tokugawa. He refused to capitulate during the war, because he was "afraid of my enemies". Once Charley gave up, he still refused, because "I must be joking". In 1785, border pops gave me a Domination Victory.

    I really wanted a Conquest in this game, but the evil mapmaker frustrated me there. I could have given back some cities to my vassals to keep under the domination threshold, then continued researching until Flight and Fascism allowed me to build Paratroopers, but I'm not even sure if my vassal cities were close enough to allow me to airdrop those in over the mountain range. Or maybe, if Tokugawa was willing to accept them, I could have gifted him a couple of cities, then captured them back to convince him that he was "losing" the war while his home city remained untouchable? In the end, I didn't think it was worth my time.

    Mining, Inc. worked out very well, given my slow expansion approach. By the end of the game, I had spread it to 13 of my 26 cities, where it generated 24 hammers in each, at the cost of 10 to 15 gold. Representation, combined with the AP and my other wonders, was generating a respectable number of beakers, even when running at 0% science.

    But that western map edge, that was not a Christmas gift. :sad:
     
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  3. Xcalibrator

    Xcalibrator Ultraviolet Catastrophe

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    Yay, I finished a game! Conquest 1750. I went with paratroopers for Toku, because although I never tested with a city in the far NW (because of fears of triggering Dom before Conquest), I don't think you can build ships on a lake, so there'd be no way to ferry units down the western edge. Anyway, paratroopers are more fun and I hardly ever get to use them.

    In keeping with my general caution, I didn't spread Mining until shortly before Corporations came in, in order to build courthouses and then the banks needed to build Wall Street. As I said in the 1st spoiler, I had hardly any units for a long time--just one warrior in each city and a few archers to deal with barbs. At some point, Churchill, who had one city up north on our side of the mountains, attacked me. I don't recall if we stayed at war or if there was an intervening peace, but at one point he took my city at the chokepoint on the northern shore of the sea to the SW. I wasted two inadequate stacks trying to retake that city and his northern one before I got grens to turn the tide and force peace and some gifts from him. I then turned on Isabella and took several of her cities before WW became a problem. Taking Izzy's northern cities was key because then I finally got access to horses to build cuirs and later cavalry.

    After peace with her, I took all but one of Charlie's cities, returned to finish off Isabella, who barely managed to tech to Gunpowder a few turns before her demise, and then wipe out Churchill. I then took Charlie's last city in the SW and founded my own next to the mountains so I could drop paratroopers on Toku. I was worried about triggering Domination, and recalled that the land fraction calculations have some lag, so I razed most of the AI cities I took. I'm still confused about those calcs--from the spread of blue on the map, I had well over half the total area but I only crossed 50% toward the very end. I know water doesn't count, but even so... Maybe mountains and/or ice don't count either?

    Anyway, I enjoyed this very much, so thanks, NZ. The wait for BOTM178 was worth it! :)
     
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  4. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    Got a fast conquest win after giving Toku 5 cities and then conquering them. (Only needed to do 4 I think)
    Could have won 2 turns faster with tighter play.

    Easiest Deity game in a long time.
    Without Iron, the AI can only build Siege, Longbows, and Horse Archers. :)

    I built a city on that lake not realizing galleys were impossible, heh.
     
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  5. MarleysGh0st

    MarleysGh0st Prince

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    1750? You must have had a tremendous tech rate to get paratroopers in action by then. For fun, I continued my game from my 1785 finish. I didn't get all the tech for paratroopers until 1874, after which I discovered that Charley's Vienna was just in range for a paradrop into Japanese territory. I captured Kyoto in 1890. After it fell, I got a glimpse at the one-city challenge that Tokugawa had been playing from his isolated position. Besides the Oracle and Shwedagon Paya, he had three different religious wonders: the Temple of Solomon, Kashi Viswanath, and Church of the Nativity, each of which were earning a pitiful 1 gpt. Plus he had a stack of missionaries with nowhere to go. :lol:
     
  6. MarleysGh0st

    MarleysGh0st Prince

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    Four or five cities, huh? In my "for fun" continuation, I tried giving away one city and retaking that, to no effect.

    Did you have to give away units, too, so that Tokugawa lost some real battles, or was capturing empty cities sufficient?
     
  7. Kaitzilla

    Kaitzilla Lord Croissant

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    Capturing 4 cities gives the needed 40 war success to make the AI willing to capitulate once they will speak to you.

    Then it is a check about having more population/land than the AI and the AI having low enough power to be under the world power average threshold.
    Then the AI will capitulate once all conditions are met.
     
  8. krikav

    krikav Theorycrafter

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    I played the normal immortal game. As this is a special map that doesn't correspond do regular gameplay, that makes perfect sense for me. :)
    Had a really fun game, and was set to get a AP victory since I'm lacking such a victory in my collection.
    That turned out to be problematic though... :/

    I couldn't handle mining inc at all. Not suprising since this is probably the first time I try out corporations. They seem quite powerful though!! Settled a whole bunch of filler cities (10 of them) toward the end, and just building a courthouse, forge and then wealth made them significant additions to the empire.

    This is how I did mid-game economy wise:
    Spoiler :

    Yepp, thats me losing 20GPT at 0% research rate in a golden age. >_<
    Overexpansion...? Never heard of it!
    Civ4ScreenShot0004.JPG




    The AP resolutions came and went, and I never got to trigger the ellection, untill I realized that this is because Toku (the last AI) was lacking buddhism.
    Just reaching him was problematic, as Charlys culture had pushed him toward his side of the mountains, so I had to tech to physics to find him with airships.

    Then I realized I couldn't just gift him a city with buddhism, as that would give me a severe penalty with the other AIs, as he was universially hated.
    So I promply declared war on him, planning to give him a buddhist city in a peacedeal, but he never talked... So I had to close borders with all other civs to teleport over to his side:

    Spoiler :


    A knight killed an axe, and that was all bloodshed I was involved in this game. :)
    Didn't even manage to get a lvl4 guy for heroic epic.
    Civ4ScreenShot0006.JPG

    Civ4ScreenShot0007.JPG



    The final turns...
    Spoiler :

    Civ4ScreenShot0008.JPG

    Techpace is very sluggish now, have swapped to nationalism to further cozy up with Churchill, and I have farmed over all riverside towns in the capital to gain population for votes/score. :)

    The city in the picture was what I settled to try block of the AIs, and it was equipped quite early with Statue of Zeus, sistine, MoM (all artist wonders basically) and the hermitrage.
    Capital built most wonders in the game, but I missed out on TGW and Pyramids.
    Civ4ScreenShot0011.JPG




    Thank you SO much for the map!
    The fun challenge with a corporation in the beginning was very educational for me, as I see so little of this aspect in my regular games.
     
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  9. zbgayumn

    zbgayumn Emperor

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    The Dwarves were a peaceful people obsessed with their mines. They found Silver and Coal at the birth of their civilization, but they craved to mine more resources. They spread across the land finding Gems, Copper, and Iron. They even took to the quarrying of marble. But one thing eluded them, the thing they most desired: GOLD

    They spread across the land, met humans and surveyed their land. Still, they found no Gold. As the Dwarves explored, they found a wall of mountains to the west. They thought, surely behind these mountains we will find the gold we have sought! The mountain wall defeated their ambitions, but the Dwarves decided to take to the air to achieve their goal. Along the way, they discovered they could mine Uranium, and this made them wonder what else they might be able to mine. Dwarven airships surveyed the hidden kingdom of Japan and found it unimpressive. Not a scrap of gold to be mined!

    Having explored every corner of this world without discovering the Gold they desired, the Dwarves determined that they had no choice but to seek Gold on other worlds. Along the way they discovered the mining of Aluminum and this pleased them greatly. They toiled long and hard in the tundra, straining to reach tech rates of 1500 bpt. Finally, in 1931 AD, their spaceship launched with a crack team of gold-seeking miners. Upon arrival in 1941 AD, the Dwarves rejoiced that their craft had reached a new planet. Satellite scans indicated numerous sources of GOLD!
     
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  10. zbgayumn

    zbgayumn Emperor

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    Actually, I had a very difficult time choosing a VC in this game. I thought culture would be the most obvious, so I should stay away from that one (of course, maybe everybody though that). I found the two breaks in the mid-map barrier and decided to plug them early on. I kept my borders closed for a long while. I thought maybe I could REX my way to domination, but I only got to 45% land area or so. From there, I thought maybe I would go with Diplo, but I wasn't sure I could actually make contact with Toku. I should've realized airships would be able to do it. By the time I did contact Toku, I had pretty much made up my mind to go for Space.

    Btw, I caught myself before I fully fell into the trap of going for Space Elevator on a Boreal map. I wasted 2 turns researching Robotics before I realized it would do me no good.
     
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  11. WastinTime

    WastinTime Deity Supporter

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    I ended up figuring out the peace vassaling and Isabella would agree to join at Pleased instead of the usual Friendly.
    I couldn't quite pull off my plan of zero-combat domination, but I learned from my mistake. I needed to get the largest civ to peace vassal first.
    So I got 2 peace vassals and then gifted 4 cities to Churchill to get capitulation in 1 turn.
    It's still hard to get 68% land when your vassals only give half of their tile count. I had to scramble some settlers and use Caste/artists to pop borders.
     
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  12. socralynnek

    socralynnek Civ & Hattrick addict

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    That was fun, but I chose the Adventurer save...

    That was more easy than I thought, the AIs didn't do well in the adventurer save

    Because I made my expansion rather slow but steady at first and I went to war rather later than I could have, I chose to go for space then.

    The AIs were not much help there, so space win was in 1903 AD.

    I had spread confucianism and Mining Inc to every city except Tokyo...
     
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