[BTS] BOTM 213: Charlemagne, Emperor - Final Spoiler - Game Submitted

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Game of the Month' started by DynamicSpirit, May 17, 2021.

  1. DynamicSpirit

    DynamicSpirit Fear him of the pink tie Moderator GOTM Staff

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    BOTM 213: Charlemagne, Emperor - Final Spoiler - Game Submitted



    Use this thread to tell us what happened in your game, particularly anything after 1AD. How did your game go? Did you win?

    Reading Requirements
    If you are participating in BOTM 213 then you MUST NOT read this thread unless
    • You have submitted your entry

    Posting Restrictions
    • Do not post any savegame file from the game. Discussions and screenshots are fine but not actual games.
     
  2. kcd_swede

    kcd_swede Jag är Viking!½ GOTM Staff

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    Well, at best another Green Ambulance for me. I was kinda stunned how things worked out.

    Early game: Great Wall. Barbs slowed the AI considerably, and I over-expanded which slowed my own tech rate. The Dutch were eliminated before I even met them.

    Mid-Game: I helped Ethiopia eliminate Japan while finishing off Gligamesh with Cuirs (Mil Trad from Liberalism). Babylon and Ethiopia have Rifles, so with my land area of over 50%, I figure a nice easy race to space is best.

    End-game: Ethiopia, Babylon, and Inca form a Bhuddist Love-fest and are openly trading techs with each other. Babylon has the fist, so I make more units than I want (I can see a huge stack forming) and he is friendly to all but me. So I even accept falling back to Bureacracy to fill his demand and get 10 turns peace, and he then is pleased and the fist disappears. Babylon is slightly ahead in tech and beats me to fusion, but is slow to build so I am confident I will beat him to launch. With 2 turns remaining to launch, Ethiopia attacks at Pleased without having been in red fist mode! I didn't think he could do that. Moreover, he opens his attack with no less than 8 tactical nukes, and takes the city building one of the last parts. Now its going to be 5 turns to launch, and Babylon beat me to launch. I meanwhile lose about 5 border cities to Ethiopia before the UN puts stop to the war, which is enough for Ethiopia to be ahead in score when the Babs get to Alpha Centuri.

    This is how one snatches defeat from the jaws of victory! [pissed]

    Score about 7500. Any losers out there gonna beat that? Send the ambulance.:aargh:
     
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  3. nocho

    nocho Deity

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    After my suboptimal start in the BCs, at least the ADs saw rapid expansion and growth. Currency, HR and to some extent calendar saved the day, the rathaus isn't bad either. Built an enormous amount of cottages, especially on the rivers to the east. When buddhism spread to me decided to actively spread it myself, which later was nice to keep the AP under control. HC, Zara and Toku were all firm believers but I had enough budd pop to counter any nastiness from the AP. Zara being by far the most powerful was also good to have at pleased, later friendly. I also libbed MT and then began the onslaught on Toku, who was surpringly big, but rather backward. Zara declared on Sumeria and I joined the party, keeping all but 2 cities for myself. Hadn't noticed vassals were off anyway until quite late. Meanwhile also declared on the Dutch who were more advanced, but small. Babylon fell easily too and then just had to capture half of the land of my budd buddy HC and wait for cities to come out of revolt for a domination victory in 1640AD. Thanks for the game, DS.
     
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  4. MarleysGh0st

    MarleysGh0st Prince

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    My economy also suffered after my early expansion. When I met Tokugawa in 400, he was at war with Willem. Barbs did me a favor by capturing one of Hammy's cities on my border. I was immediately able to take that from the barbs before Hammy could react.

    Tokugawa and Willem made peace in 840, and Toku immediately began plotting again. I correctly guessed that was against me. He attacked in 980. Using a worker at bait, I drew his army into the open outside one of my cities, where I was able to destroy it. I was building my arm to begin an offensive when Gilgamesh declared against me in 1120. So, I captured only Nagoya before making peace with Toku and shifting my forces to the west.

    My conquest of the Sumerian Empire proceeded slowly. All through that time, I had a low-production city working on the Pyramids. Mostly, I had started it for some failgold, although the science boost from Representation should have made it more of a priority for me. Finally, in 1410, I earned 467 failgold when Gilgamesh completed the Pyramids in Nibru, his most remote city from me. Ah, well, my armies were working on liberating that city.

    Before I got there, Tokugawa declared on me again, in 1500. His army recaptured Nagoya as I continued the conquest of Sumeria. Earlier on, I had converted to Buddhism to improve relations with Hammy and HC. Now, Hammy agreed to join the war against Tokugawa. In 1515, I captured Nibru, completing the conquest of Sumeria, and all of my forces could continue moving east, into Japanese territory.

    HC had built the AP and had been elected to lead it. My missionaries has spread the religion enough to control a majority of the vote. During the Japanese war, the "mutual struggle" bonus had Hammy friendly enough to vote for my victory, but HC wouldn't call the vote. Once I destroyed the Japanese Empire in 1595, Hammy dropped to pleased and would vote for me no longer. (Later, I had too many votes on my own, so a religious victory was off the table.) I'd have to continue my military path to victory.

    I attacked the Willem in 1600 and captured the Dutch Empire by 1645. HC was next to be conquered, in 1690. Then I turned on my old friend Hammy, bribing ZY to join the war. The Babylonians were conquered in 1755. Then I attacked ZY, taking two of his cities before I crossed the Domination threshold in 1765.
     
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  5. Conquistador 63

    Conquistador 63 Deity

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    Mine was yet another game that suffered from overexpansion. I guess my worst mistake was delaying the completion of the Pyramids for Rep until the 1100ADs.

    In the 840AD I had 12 self-founded cities and 5 captured from barbarians, with a small army pondering about which AI lands would be best suited for our next phase of expansion.

    But then Tokugawa spared me of this tough decision and chose (unwisely) to attack me.
    Five turns later Gilgamesh also (unwisely) joined the war on our empire.

    I wasn't exactly planning to fight on two fronts at the same time, but nevertheless I succeeded at conquering their lands, using mostly catapults, knights and the surprisingly useful landsknechts (at least in this game settings). Toku was eliminated in 1440AD and Gilga in 1600AD. That put me around 50% land (41 cities), safely below Domination threshold, and then I could finally focus on corporation expansion and cruised to a rather late (by GOTM standards) in 1808AD.

    Thanks for the game!
     
  6. krikav

    krikav Theorycrafter

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    Spoiler T143 Retire :


    Hard to tell... I enjoyed the excitement of the barbarian onslaught, but it was also abit tiring. :)
    I think I lost abit of motivation seeing that all the company went for TGW in the 1AD spoiler thread.

    Had a very enjoyable opening in this game though, thanks for hosting @DynamicSpirit !

    After getting the barbarian storms under wraps around 1AD I did a minor landgrab against Hammy.
    But with alot of spears running around, I had to sue for peace.
    Civ4ScreenShot0013.JPG
    My bribed in war buddies continue to hammer Hammy.
    Civ4ScreenShot0014.JPG

    Civ4ScreenShot0015.JPG



     
  7. NightOnEarth

    NightOnEarth Chieftain

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    My map report

    DynamicSpirit, first of all I would like to thank you very much for the wonderful map that you created with all its special features and challenges. I've had over 90 hours of gaming and learned a lot of new things. I actually won in my first BOTM participation, even though it was a tough fight - first against the opponents, and finally because of the deadline. I had to really speed up and yesterday after a long night the time had finally come: Winner of the space race in 1976.

    As I said, the map had some special aspects and therefore required an approach that deviated from the usual routine. The subject of angry barbarians and the benefits of the great wall has already been discussed in detail. But another aspect was that the barbarians had founded quite a number of cities, some in lucrative places. The AI always seems quite reluctant to attack such cities, and so I was able to conquer two barbarian cities in the center of the map with a lot of floodplains, which over time became my best cities. I was also able to conquer two other barbarian cities in the south without having to build a settler.

    Another very important setting was "no vassal states". I think that played into my cards because the opponents were constantly involved in wars without anyone being able to expand their position by vassaling the opponent. The luck of the battle often changed back and forth for a very long time, tied up resources without much progress for one of the other civilizations. By the way, wars: what exactly are the effects of "aggressive AI"?

    Another issue that played an important role in this game was health. The jungle played a subordinate role. Without sea food and a harbour, without wheat and sheep, important building blocks for the usual approach were missing. Despite an oversupply of food, cities had reached the limit of growth at some point. Interestingly enough, the AI tried to solve this problem in the end through environmentalism. I myself had chosen the approach of first maintaining the size and health of the cities via the buildings grocer, supermarket, hospital, public transport (and recycling plant for the cities with factories) and then via genetics, while at the same time retaining state property in order to be keep my production high for the space race. I think state property has been a game changer more than ever.

    The jungle everywhere was of course a challenge at first, but later to the advantage of civilizations, because underneath was grassland. Pigs, bananas and rice were plentiful, as were rivers and access to fresh water through lakes. This made farms and the technology of biology almost superfluous, and levees became effective. The lake next to the starting point was a little mean: it was salty.
    In the absence of the ocean, technologies as compass, optics, and ultimately astronomy became worthless. The remaining (calendar) resources were distributed quite unevenly. For example, I did not manage to get access to corn until shortly before the end, not even through trade because the owners were hostile to me.

    A very special challenge for my space race was the lack of aluminum. Every other civilization had at least one resource, none in my quadrant. DynamicSpirit, could it be that you intended it that way?

    For me, production was another central theme of this map. There were hardly any hills for mining, so the approach of slavery - the whip was almost inevitable, and this for a long time. Only with communism and democracy was it possible to switch to emancipation and state property with many workshops and water mills. In contrast to my other games, I kept the mines until the end and built almost no windmills.

    Unique Building: I just couldn't ignore the Rathaus and used it excessively to raise my research slider. Otherwise I would have got into trouble because of the long-term nature of my approach.
    Unique Unit: When I was able to build the Landsknecht, the opponents often already had longbows or crossbows. At that time I was too weak to get involved in a real war, so I posted the Landsknecht as protection in my cities. Probably the better players could have made more of the opportunities.

    One more word about the imperialistic trait with its + 100% great general emergence in connection with aggressive AI: I think I equipped five or six cities with a military academy, generated my Super Medic unit and could power-up two or three other units with an additional 20xp. So all of this shows that even the presumably weakest leader, Charlemagne, has its positive aspects that can be used.

    It was a very exciting and instructive game with many requirements to develop your own approaches. It also showed me my current limits, because I don't trust myself to play at higher difficulty than Emperor at the moment. But I would like to take part in this wonderful BOTM challenge again at the next opportunity and look forward to being able to play another of these great maps from dynamicSpirit or kcd_swede.
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2021
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  8. NightOnEarth

    NightOnEarth Chieftain

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    My game report


    I had already reported on my game up to 1 A.D. I had just founded my fourth and fifth city and was in last place, two civilizations were still missing. The main challenge was to find a balance between expansion, growth and research.

    I met the two missing opponents very late (t137), Wilhelm in the extreme NE and Zara Yakob in the extreme SE. The barbarians must have worked hard on Wilhelm because he only had two cities. Zara Yakob only had five, but was leading together with Huayna Capac. A short time later I was able to take two potent barbarian cities in the middle of the map at the floodplains (the second city was taken one turn before Zara Yakob did it, who had advanced with eight units) and founded another city in the SW. I was the first with the alphabet and later with theology. At that time, still no religion had spread to me. I had founded Christianity and one turn later Confucianism came to me. Now the religious blocks began to form, and I joined the Confucians Hammurabi and Zara Yakob, but sent my Christian missionary to Gilgamesh, who also had no religion, to alienate him from Tokugawa. In the meantime, unnoticed, Gilgamesh had conquered a barbarian city behind me. I still had the feeling that I was slow in terms of growth, expansion and production, and now I also had problems with health in my cities, but had moved up into the middle of the ranking.

    The Great Spy I got through the Great Wall had revealed much of the map before I sacrificed him at Zara Yakob. This brought me philosophy and feudalism. Shortly before t200 two things happened: for the first time I moved up to the top and Gilgamesh declared war on me completely unnecessarily, but did not attack from his heartland in the north, but with two poor units from the lonely city in the south. I myself was also weak and now stood with only one trebuchet and two Landsknecht in front of his city, which I absolutely wanted to have in order to open up the hinterland to me. The city was defended with two longbows.

    Now Gilgamesh did something very clever that I would only have thought a human player could do. He converted to Cofucianism on the same turn as a resolution by the Apostolic Palace was up for voting. It promptly read "stop the war against Gilgamesh". I voted no, but I feared it would be accepted. So I risked a lot by attacking the city despite only slightly better chances and luckily succeeded. It came as expected, the resolution was passed, but I had the city.

    Now I thought I was on the road to victory, even when Togukawa destroyed the Dutch. The AI were constantly at war with one another, and when Gilgamesh seriously attacked me a short time later, his campaign was ironically stopped again by a resolution from Hammurabi's Apostolic Palace. However, I was shocked when Tokugawa suddenly marched with a huge army. I wasn't up to it, at least not right away. But I was lucky, he declared war on Ethiopia. Finally I settled near the cow NE of Aachen and in the extreme SW tip I discovered four ivory, where I founded my 13th city.

    I had been very focused on research and was able to research liberalism (>printing press) first and both physics (Great Scientist) and communism (Great Spy) just before Zara Yakob because I could see his research. I used both of the great people for a golden age so that I could move smoothly to emancipation and state property. I built my second wonder of the world, the Statue of Liberty (great for defending and expanding my cultural boundaries along with free speech) and finished railroad just in time when Tokugawa had put two huge stacks on the border and attacked me.

    My military strength was 0.5 to him and I would probably have been lost if he had pinned me, although he was trailing in (military) research. Instead, he only attacked one city and gradually sent the other stack afterwards. In a very short time I was able to build a railway network across my empire, upgrade units by converting the slider to 100% gold and produce supplies, especially cannons, cavalry and machine guns. I was able to completely destroy his first stack (mostly grenadiers) with the loss of only six cannons, one turn before the second, larger stack arrived, which fared no better. The city of Sirpula, which had already changed hands several times, fell in a counterattack, and later two other cities in southern Japan.

    In the meantime I have fallen completely behind when it comes to espionage, which backfired. In one and the same turn, the technology military science was stolen (Hammurabi) and the world wonder Broadway was destroyed shortly before completion (Gilgamesh). Only later did I learn what counter-espionage is good for, and I carried it out against the other civilizations for the rest of the game. Another attack by Tokugawa ran into my counterattack, which costed him three more cities.

    It had now become clear to me that I could only win by a space race, even though I was leading by a huge margin. That's why I chose six cities with the highest production, build a factory and a recycling plant there (and later university, observatory, laboratory), in one of them ironworks and 3-gorge-dam, and started the Apollo project, which I completed eight turns after Zara Yakob. My research was fast and I focussed first on health technologies (ecology (recycling center) and genetics) to take full profit from my production cities. Even without aluminum I was by far the fastest in production and in 1976 (t396) I finally won the space race. At that time I had 22 cities, 12 of them founded myself, 6 taken from Japan, 3 barbarian cities and one originally barbarian, but taken from Gilgamesch. My first cities were not the strongest. Shining were the two cities with all the floodplains and the two cities east of Aachen, NE at the cow and SE at the iron.

    In the meantime, all opponents had dogged each other and left me alone. Was that the curse of the "aggressive AI"? Diplomacy towards Gilgamesh paid off. He could have caused me difficulties militarily, but chose Babylon as his target because Hammurabi was diplomatically worse off than me. These stupid AI wars: you conquer a city in enemy territory, keep several turns occupied during the revolt and then have no production tile outside.

    Even I have won the game, I know that I made a number of mistakes and, overall, I don't know enough about the game and its strategies, tactics and techniques. I think it was perfectly reasonable here to build a multitude of buildings because of the specifics of the map. The focus on research appears reasonable, too. But I probably should have expanded faster in the beginning and then should have concentrated more on the military later. As it was during the game, it felt like gambling.

    It was noticeable that the civilizations with a few cities were in the lead at the beginning (Huayna, Zara Yakob), but were later overtaken by the others.

    Perhaps this belongs to my map report: "Know your enemy" was very helpful in one aspect. The only civilization with "can plot war at pleased = no" was Babylon, my neighbor, with whom I shared the same religion. This was a strategic life insurance.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2021
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