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Bowman or knight

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by [GR]Ishtari, Oct 15, 2002.

  1. The Last Conformist

    The Last Conformist Irresistibly Attractive

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    gugalpm: If you've read the thread a little more attentatively, or indeed played the game a bit more attentatively, you'd noticed that Longbowmen don't cost much more that half the cost of Knights, so certainly there's room for discussion. That said, I do prefer Knights, for the reasons detailed above.
     
  2. Zachriel

    Zachriel Kaiser

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    Techs don't always come in a specific order as I frequently buy them on the open market once they become available. I might pick up Invention, make a few longbow, and take a quick city or two. They are remarkable effective at destroying the defenders of your rival's border cities, especially when backed up with spear, sword or pike.

    Sometimes it's nice to grab a little war before the Age of Chivalry.
     
  3. Koronin

    Koronin Chieftain

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    I always go with the more mobile attack unit. I don't like attacking with movement 1 units.
     
  4. island007

    island007 Warlord

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    The Middle Ages are fantastic almost constant war.

    Knights are your better unit in most cases; however I do build both. My longbowmen are normally for defense to attack out of border cities or choke points at enemy STACKS.

    I'm your typical warmonger. When I enter the middle ages my reseach normally follows this order. Before I start I would like to add I will almost always buy any tech I can from the AI, so this is only MY research path.
    Feudalism-Chivary (Upgrade grade stacks of horseman to knights. If not already in a war start one.)
    Engineering-Military Tradition (Upgrade grade knights to cavalry, continue your wars, unless you control the your own continent)

    My top roll of techs are gain mostly from war concessions.
     
  5. GOLD NUKE:)

    GOLD NUKE:) Chieftain

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    It all depends. If you have large cities with high production, then go to knight and cavs. But, if you have a bunch of small cities with low production, then stick with the bow-pike/musket combo
     
  6. GOLD NUKE:)

    GOLD NUKE:) Chieftain

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    also, If you go to get longbows, and have no Iron, (if cavs need Iron, Tell me. Can't remember) then forgo knights, and get cavs.
     
  7. Ancient Grudge

    Ancient Grudge Its all in this life

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    cav only require saltpeter and horses
     
  8. GOLD NUKE:)

    GOLD NUKE:) Chieftain

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    good. I wasn't sure. do that, and you could have a VERY good military advantage, assuming ou have saltpeter-horses
     
  9. troytheface

    troytheface Deity

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    longbowman have a small time frame when they are lethal when attacking cities.
    I like the theory of the 4 pike 4 long vs 4 kn.
    The guy that wrote of a 12 knight stack is right though. I play monarch and get always tech behind.
    I have no horses-i'll try the longbowman/pike against knight in an invasion against the aztecs -if i can get an alliance- and see what happens....
     
  10. Allemand

    Allemand Chief

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    The knight is the best unit until cavalry comes along, and my philosophy is to always have the best units, no matter what the cost. Makes war a lot easier. If the other side has better units, then I like to get my allies to fight them until I catch up. The AI is a sucker when it comes to alliances.
     
  11. anarres

    anarres anarchist revolutionary

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    If you are a builder and don't like fighting offensive campaigns then ignore this post.

    Warmongers: I expect to get flamed for this, but how can anyone prefer a unit that has only 1 move per turn?

    If you have the resources and don't fight with horsemen, then knights then cavalry then don't expect to win as fast. Civ3 AI is stupid enough to beat with any map on any difficulty level, but we are meant to be discussing the sensible option here.

    I challenge anyone who prefers slow units to explain how they perform better at global domination than fast units that can withdraw and move 2 or 3 squares in one turn. If you are a capable general then fighting a war with slow units is just that. SLOW.

    And I know about the advantages of the Pikemen/Longbow units. They are good for garrisons. That's it. The cost of knights is cheap at 70 shields, and I'd rather have 1 knight than 3 pikemen or longbows.

    The only exception I can think of to this is if you are defending your nation, but seriously, who ever has to do that in earnest?
     
  12. Clown2TheLeft

    Clown2TheLeft Prince

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    <<Warmongers: I expect to get flamed for this, but how can anyone prefer a unit that has only 1 move per turn?>>

    I won't flame you, but here's my $0.02:--

    A) Cheap.

    B) Require no resources to build.

    C) Attack at 4.

    With pikeman or musketman defending, these make good units to keep in a city under seige, or to smack the AI around in the mountains.

    True, the knight is definitely better with its higher mobility and defense, but sometimes you're playing against America, and they always have all the resources. Longbowmen can get that for you...


    Later!

    --The Clown to the Left
     
  13. anarres

    anarres anarchist revolutionary

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    Yeah, but for me value for money beats low cost any day. Moving your force around is so slow with longbows, and Knights retreat.

    If I had no resources I would build them too, but I hope that by this time resources are not an issue. Early wars should gain enough territory to get everything you need.

    I take your point. I still think that Knights are so versatile because they can fight in the mountains, survive more often than longbowmen, and then nip over to the other side of your empire.

    Each to their own I suppose.
     
  14. Gothmog

    Gothmog Dread Enforcer

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    Anarres, I would agree with you that in general Knights are better - I like mobile units too - and I will _almost_ never go on an offensive war with pikers and longbows (pillaging raids on the other hand ...) But Clown2TheLeft has valid points, there are times when one does not have the resource that one needs. There are also times when one needs cheap units - quick! If you have never run into these problems then maybe you need to start playing on a harder level.
     
  15. anarres

    anarres anarchist revolutionary

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    LOL, I will when they invent one above Deity. :D (I won the tourney leader div last season)
     
  16. Gothmog

    Gothmog Dread Enforcer

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    Well... :blush:

    You must be the master of resources then, I find myself without something I need at some point in about 30% of my games.

    I must admit though that I have only built longbows once or twice in all my games.
     
  17. [GR]Ishtari

    [GR]Ishtari Grim Reaper

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    Im guessing by most posts. that most poeple play on small or medium maps. Well for me , I go for Knights. "regardless". If i don't have any iron, fight my way to it. and build knights, or build the light house to fine countrys who are willing to trade for iron. I only play on Huge maps. and all the nations are playing. then i go strait for the money. Wall street, banks and tradeing smith. "allso" with nations on other islands. you can trade techs with them to get gunpowder. nothin beats upgradeing Knights to Cav.

    opps i've said enought laf.
     
  18. Pembroke

    Pembroke Tribune

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    There is now a level above Deity. It's called "human opponent". :)
     
  19. [GR]Ishtari

    [GR]Ishtari Grim Reaper

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    Yep... i wonder how that will play out. how evil can we become?.
     
  20. anarres

    anarres anarchist revolutionary

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    Well, if civ3 was thought to take a long time to play imagine with 16 human players!

    I will be trying to play the simultaneous version (haven't tried yet - not here in uk for another 3 weeks), hopefully another tournament-style competition will come out of it...

    I think playing each other will rock. Unless it's just too flakey, it should mean _real_ challenges, without the stupid AI reasoning.
     

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