Boy Scouts of America to vote to end ban on gay scouts

[downtown]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013...OY20130419?feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews

In the mother of all news dump stories...

(Reuters) - The Boy Scouts of America called to end a long-standing ban on openly gay members, a spokesman said on Friday, but the organization's board must still vote in May on whether to ratify the resolution.

If the vote is approved, "no youth may be denied membership in the Boy Scouts of America on the basis of sexual orientation or preference alone," Deron Smith, the organization's spokesman, told Reuters.

Smith noted that the decision drew from three months of research, surveys and discussions and was "among the most complex and challenging issues facing the BSA and society today."

The deliberations over whether to admit openly gay and lesbian members to the Boy Scouts has divided organizers, polarized its corporate and religious sponsors, and placed the group at the center of a nationwide debate over gay rights over the past two years.

"This is a historic change for the Boy Scouts," said Patrick Boyle, whose 1994 book "Scout's Honor" examined sexual abuse in the Boy Scouts of America.

"You have a more than hundred-year-old organization changing what it considered a fundamental belief just a decade ago. That says a lot about the Scouts and a lot about how far the gay rights movement has come in the United States."

It doesn't appear that this move extends towards gay scoutmasters, likely in a nod to BSA sponsors in the LDS and Catholic churches (who are likely afraid they'd have to admit gay leadership in their religion-only troops), but should this pass in May, and gay kid could participate in scouts, and even earn their highest honor, the Eagle Scout award.

I think it is *highly* unlikely that the LDS Church immediately breaks rank with the BSA over this, although there has been some rumblings that they may drop the program later (for lots of reasons that have nothing to do with gays).

Positive step? Half-hearted compromise that will annoy everybody? Will it get shot down in May when the membership votes? Does it change your opinion of scouting? What do you think?

 

[Smellincoffee]

This is exactly what I'd hoped for when I read that the LDS is backing down from its bigotry, or the start of it. It needs to apply to adult leaders as well, though. The values of the Scouts are so utterly opposed to the kind of prejudice the bars against gays constitute.

 

[warpus]

Good start! Any idea when this can extend to scoutmasters, or whatever?

Having said that though...

"among the most complex and challenging issues facing the BSA and society today."

Uhhh.. no, no it isn't. Get your heads out of your butts please

 

[downtown]

Good start! Any idea when this can extend to scoutmasters, or whatever?

Probably when it makes sense, math-wise. According to Buzzfeed, the BSA did polling and focus group testing and found that allowing gay-scouts would be a PR boon and attract between 10-20K kids into scouting. Allowing gay leaders though, would cause between 100-200K current troops to withdrawl.

 

[Farm Boy]

Good start! Any idea when this can extend to scoutmasters, or whatever?

Having said that though...



Uhhh.. no, no it isn't. Get your heads out of your butts please

Similar paranoia to allowing men to head up and take girl scout troops camping prolly. Or why men rarely successfully run day cares and weighing that along side religious objections and universal principles of justice seem to come off to me as a pretty complex problem for the BSA.

<obligatory joke about heads in butts>

 

[Ironsided]

There is something really creepy about boy scouts. Makes me think of Hitler Jugend. Do this - get a badge. Do that - get a badge. The more badges, the better you are. Might as well spoon whip them into little conformed yes-men.

 

[warpus]

Probably when it makes sense, math-wise. According to Buzzfeed, the BSA did polling and focus group testing and found that allowing gay-scouts would be a PR boon and attract between 10-20K kids into scouting. Allowing gay leaders though, would cause between 100-200K current troops to withdrawl.

Are there other organizations they could join instead? Where would they go?

 

[Joecoolyo]

There is something really creepy about boy scouts. Makes me think of Hitler Jugend. Do this - get a badge. Do that - get a badge. The more badges, the better you are. Might as well spoon whip them into little conformed yes-men.

Dunno, camping was pretty fun.

 

[downtown]

Are there other organizations they could join instead? Where would they go?

I guess it depends on what they want to do? Scouting is a lot more than just camping and outdoor stuff, they have merit badges for nearly everything, from music to law to metalworking to atomic science. They might be able to join Venture Scouts, which is a co-ed offshoot of Scouting, but it's much smaller, and they won't be able to find a troop in every city.

Dunno, camping was pretty fun.

Yeah, I really liked it. I still have my Eagle Scout award on my resume, and learned a lot about leadership and service from my project, which involved me building a library in Appalachia. I didn't get super into the camping stuff, but it was a great chance to get me exposed to a lot of things that I never would have tried if I wasn't in scouts, like archery and fishing (which I still enjoy).

 

[Joecoolyo]

Yeah, I really liked it. I still have my Eagle Scout award on my resume, and learned a lot about leadership and service from my project, which involved me building a library in Appalachia. I didn't get super into the camping stuff, but it was a great chance to get me exposed to a lot of things that I never would have tried if I wasn't in scouts, like archery and fishing (which I still enjoy).

I really wish I continued onto Boy scouts/Eagle Scouts, it looks like a ton of fun in hindsight. Instead, I quit along with my entire troop when we graduated (or whatever it's called) from cub scouts.

To make up for lost time, I'm picking up archery on my own time, and having a blast.

 

[bhsup]

Do you think this will lead to an increase in membership in the Y-Indian Guides and other alternative youth programs?

 

[Old Hippy]

I guess it depends on what they want to do? Scouting is a lot more than just camping and outdoor stuff, they have merit badges for nearly everything, from music to law to metalworking to atomic science. They might be able to join Venture Scouts, which is a co-ed offshoot of Scouting, but it's much smaller, and they won't be able to find a troop in every city.

it is not just the badges tho, at the annual jamboree (including girl guides) some 20,000 kids(up to 40,000 in Europe) get to set up and run a temporary city for 2 weeks, from scratch on some isolated property...
Main and secondary stage areas
Shopping Mall
Socialisation Areas
Hospital and First Aid posts
Internet Cafe
On-site radio station, which both Scouts and leaders contribute to
On-site newspaper
Transport Depot
Police and security
Temporary on-site fire station
Banking facilities including ATMs
Warehousing of food and consumables
Reliable communications infrastructure
Fresh water supply and grey water processing

this results in leaning a lot about negotiation,tolerance and plain hard work and then the nity grity of actually running it for 2 weeks, without decending into the lord of the flies

 

[hobbsyoyo]

So now can they stop forcing atheist scouts to pray?

Or bridge too far???

 

[AlpsStranger]

There is something really creepy about boy scouts. Makes me think of Hitler Jugend. Do this - get a badge. Do that - get a badge. The more badges, the better you are. Might as well spoon whip them into little conformed yes-men.

Uh, that's really not how I remember it. But w/e.

I do remember being in three and four person conversations where everyone else was a creationist, though.

 

[Old Hippy]

So now can they stop forcing atheist scouts to pray?

Or bridge too far???

I don't remember any prays, probably due to being forced to swear allegiance to the flag and queen...

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I don't remember any prays, probably due to being forced to swear allegiance to the flag and queen...

Can't speak for the UK but we most definitely do pray every meeting and there are many, many references to God in the literature and stuff. It is kind of like alcoholics anonymous where it technically isn't a religious institution but really it is (though non-denominational - jews and muslims were welcome)

 

[Joecoolyo]

I don't remember praying at all in my meetings.

 

[bhsup]

Seriously? Our den mother led us in prayer at the beginning of every scout meeting. Now, I do not remember that once in Webelos or Boy Scouts, but I definitely do in the cub scouts.

 

[Goodfella]

Plus, an atheist would have to pretend to believe in an active God to be a member.

 

[JollyRoger]

Den mother and cubs? What sort of pagan prayer was offered?