Brainstorming a better Unique Ability for Brasilia

[Skorpios]

After watching the second livestream and reading various discussions here and elsewhere, the general consensus seems to be that Brasilia's UA is pretty underwhelming. As it was stated that everything we saw may change as they progress with balancing the game I thought I'd throw out some ideas to add some flavour to Brasilia and hopefully make their UA more appealing.

The initial spark for these ideas came from the background lore from the Civilization website for Commander Bolivar where he is addressing candidates for the Seeding Project:

You represent our most capable, flexible, and disciplined people. Brasilia is going to the stars before every other nation of the planet because of what you can do, together. In a very real sense, you are the most elite soldiers that humanity has ever developed. Now you are being asked to go on the most important mission ever assigned: Survive, grow and thrive on an alien world. Others may come after you, but if you accept, you are the immortal first.

Every one of you began with potential, and we refined you through training. No force in history has ever possessed the range of capabilities that you now have. You’ve learned things about manufacturing and production that no military force ever needed to – because if you go, you will be on your own. That last exercise, in Antarctica, you never hesitated, never balked, never despaired, and you crossed that continent without leaving anyone behind. You know what you are capable of doing now, and you will not falter, come planetfall.

For me, that describes a military force that is not simply stronger than their opponents, but soldiers who have been specifically trained to travel and fight in extreme environments. So it seems to me that the most obvious ability to apply to Brasilia is some sort of movement or maneuverability bonus for their units.

The first thing to spring to mind was Altitude Training, a free promotion from CiV's Mt Kilimanjaro: double movement in hills and 10% bonus strength in them. This even matches Brasilia's history as there are multiple high altitude locations in South America where such training could have become a core part of Brasilia's military traditions even before the Seeding Project. Other possibilities are variations or combinations of the Inca's Great Andean Road ability or the Great Warpath of the Iroquois.

This has the obvious effect of making Brasilian units more effective soldiers for the entire game but also makes Brasilia the prime 'exploration' faction in the early game, giving them an alternative focus apart from pure military might. More movement lets them scout faster, makes their civilian units more secure and gives them flexibility in alien encounters where a tactical retreat could preserve their forces as well as keep alien provocation to a minimum.

Another idea is a version of the CiV Carthaginian ability to cross mountains that I call "Combat Engineering". Basically it gives Brasilian units the ability to cross both Mountain and Canyon tiles but they take damage if they end their turn there. Again, this gives them tactical advantages in both offense and defense as well as aiding exploration, enabling them to take shortcuts or avoid dangerous bottlenecks near alien nests or miasma clouds.

What do you think? Are there any more ideas out there that might give Commander Bolivar's brave men and women the edge they need to conquer an entire alien world?

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I think a slightly better idea would be a promotion for rough terrain, (since you also have the Amazon for them to train in)

so perhaps

+20% melee strength in rough terrain in general,
and x2 move in rough terrain

...probably not "ignore terrain move cost" since I think that may be one of the possible Affinity perqs

It would make their early soldiers more like explorers (although unable to build expeditions)

 

[Nyon]

I think that a good improvement for their UA would be giving all of their units the first promotion free. It wouldn't be a dramatic departure from their current UA but it would come with the extra utility of a free promotion (i.e being able to get the highest level promotions upon creation with enough XP buildings, or getting your third promotion from only fighting aliens, assuming that there will be some sort of XP cap on attacking aliens similar to how it was with barbarians).

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I think that a good improvement for their UA would be giving all of their units the first promotion free. It wouldn't be a dramatic departure from their current UA but it would come with the extra utility of a free promotion (i.e being able to get the highest level promotions upon creation with enough XP buildings, or getting your third promotion from only fighting aliens, assuming that there will be some sort of XP cap on attacking aliens similar to how it was with barbarians).

The promotions in BE are All just straight Strength bonuses. There aren't any 'high level promotions' those are gained through affinities.

 

[Nyon]

The promotions in BE are All just straight Strength bonuses. There aren't any 'high level promotions' those are gained through affinities.

Has this been confirmed somewhere? I was under the impression that there would still be a similar promotion system to Civ V, but with the affinity perks as an added bonus and drill/shock being combined into a general bonus.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Has this been confirmed somewhere? I was under the impression that there would still be a similar promotion system to Civ V, but with the affinity perks as an added bonus and drill/shock being combined into a general bonus.

Well the promotions are displayed on the unit icon, and they are only chevrons. It seems they wanted the units to be more disposable, and avoid the 'grind' of leveling up experience to get the unit you wanted (for things like range, logistics, march)

 

[Epic Eric]

I personally think "+20% resistance against Alien units" (or maybe 15%, if it's too high) would be a pretty powerful bonus, specially early game – strong enough to be compared to the FI and KP ones – and still be useful for any Affinity.

 

[Lord Shadow]

Well the promotions are displayed on the unit icon, and they are only chevrons. It seems they wanted the units to be more disposable, and avoid the 'grind' of leveling up experience to get the unit you wanted (for things like range, logistics, march)

That's a rather huge assumption. I very much doubt promotions will be that plain.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I personally think "+20% resistance against Alien units" (or maybe 15%, if it's too high) would be a pretty powerful bonus, specially early game – strong enough to be compared to the FI and KP ones – and still be useful for any Affinity.

I think that might be a bit specific, the usefulness will fade when aliens are a minor threat compared to other players (they will still be a threat, but less)

 

[Louis XXIV]

It is underwhelming. More importantly, it is quite boring. My preference would be gaining experience quicker. That way you could use it how you want through the promotion system.

I will say the faction abilities are supposed to be small because your loadout customization is a much bigger thing. But 10% barely registers at the beginning and is easily obtained by others anyway.

 

[Lord Shadow]

There's a number of more interesting ways to bolster the effectiveness of a militaristic faction than straight up strength bonuses:

• Cheaper military unit production
• Faster XP earnings
• Units start with extra XP (barracks-like effect)
• Higher mobility: all land military units ignore terrain costs (like the Explorer)
• Units always fight at full strength (though that's likely too much like Civ5 Japan)
• Lower military unit maintenance
• Garrisoned units provide Culture (?)

 

[JokerJace]

The initial spark for these ideas came from the background lore from the Civilization website for Commander Bolivar where he is addressing candidates for the Seeding Project

I actually think his speech represents the UA quite niceley. Maneuverability and other things that have been mentioned - that some people say rather sound like the strengths adressed by the speech - can be summed up by a general combat bonus. Especially since we don't know if the whole combat strength in relation to terrain thing hasn't been scrapped yet. So a general combat bonus right from the start can be pretty strong when compared to the other promotions we already know. I think it's it's best to be more general in a UA and less specialised. I would extend the bonus to ranged combat though.

For me, that describes a military force that is not simply stronger than their opponents, but soldiers who have been specifically trained to travel and fight in extreme environments. So it seems to me that the most obvious ability to apply to Brasilia is some sort of movement or maneuverability bonus for their units.

But that circumstances are omnipresent on an alien planet. That's why I say a general combat bonus is perfectly fitting. Exactly for the stated reasons.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

[*]Garrisoned units provide Culture (?)[/list]

I like this one because it is like Franco Iberias... doing X gets you some Y
All of the others (except SF) are only .. You are better at X

(I think that one specifically is not a good idea since it is basically just a +culture per city)
I also don't think it is a bad idea to steal something from CivV

Perhaps borrowing the Aztec idea, killing units gets culture.

Or maybe you get a culture bonus each time a unit gains enough experience from combat to earn a promotion. (and highly promoted units get culture from kills directly)

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I say, play the game first and see how well or poorly the current one before trying to brainstorm a replacement.

 

[aguliondew]

All of the high end normal civ 5 promotion are gained from affinities. Example: heal at the end of turn, increase movement, double attack. The veteracy(promotion) that has been shown was a simple damage increase to melee/range by 10%. Hum similar to the Brasilia UA.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I say, play the game first and see how well or poorly the current one before trying to brainstorm a replacement.

Its not the poweredness, its the interestingness (although that also is affected by gameplay)

 

[BrotherAriman]

It may seem like a small boost but I think melee units may have more of a place in beyond earth compared to Civ 5. For instance navel strategies might run into issues if multiple krakens appear during a siege of a coastal city. Also if it appears that at least purity and harmony will have heavy hitting special units which are melee with purity's mechs and what appears to be a space marine like unit between the regular soldier and the mech in the art below or the harmony's biotitan which I'm going to assume is a melee godzilla sized unit.

If you want a more specialized bonus then it could be possible to have something like this:
Adaptive tactics: Brasilia muilitary units receive a +X% bonus against the first type of unit they kill in battle: Categories include: alien(large) krakens and siege worms, alien(small) everything else, infantry, light vehicles (calvalry equivalent), heavy vehicles (tanks/mechs), watercraft, aircraft, titankillers (biotitans, lev-destroyers, ANGELs)

 

[Liex]

Another way to explore these "adaptive tactics" is to give them an Ikanda-like UA that grants unique promotions. These promotions don't even need to be particularly strong, but they would be quite interesting, specially if the standard promotions are just plain bonuses or instant heal.

Example of unique promotions:

• +x% strength against aliens;
• Improved combat and/or movement in a certain type of terrain;
• Improved flanking;
• Reduced maintenance.

Unlike the Ikanda, your units wouldn't start with any of these promotions, and you could select one of them just once on level up.

Another idea: A bonus that changes according to your affinity levels:

• Neutral: +10% combat strength in melee combat;
• Purity: +10% combat strength in melee combat, +x% against aliens;
• Harmony: Improved combat and/or movement in miasma;
• Supremacy: Improved flanking.

 

[DarkestOnion]

An easy change would be +20% for all Combat (not 10% and not just Melee.)

 

[KrikkitTwo]

An easy change would be +20% for all Combat (not 10% and not just Melee.)

That's if it was underpowered.

The issue is not that it is underpowered, it is that it is boring.. ie it doesn't change the way you play the game.


The fact that it only applies to melee units helps that slightly (ie Brasillia's army will be more heavily melee than someone else's)