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Branch "Challenge" - Candidate for Release 2.8.1. - for testing

Discussion in 'Civ4Col - We The People' started by raystuttgart, Aug 17, 2020.

  1. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    If you are talking about Europe Harbour, AI sorts the queue by highest "Unit Buy value".
    I did not change that again to put Settlers on first spot. (I origninally considered that though.)

    Since AIs however spawn a "Settler" in a Ship, once they lose all their "Settlers" and "Cities", it still works this way though.
    Thus it was not necessary to change the Unit sorting in Europe. (Human can sort and decide himself.)

    In DLL source code. You need to be able to programm C++ to change that.
    Since Settler is a "Profession" you can not simply change any "Unit Buy value" in XML.

    By the way:

    Please make sure that you actually have the most recent DLL. (Last DLL update was last Tuesday.)
    It is attached to the starting post of this thread - it was updated several times after this thread was started.

    The DLL is the most important file of the mod!
    It contains all the actual feature and AI logic.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2020
  2. Schmiddie

    Schmiddie Emperor

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    As far as I remember a change in unit sorting in Europe triggers issues when asking the king for troops.
     
  3. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    I think you are talking about something else.
    (e.g. sorting of UnitClasses in XML which affects e.g. the "Buy Menu order" in Europe or "WorldBuilder Unit order")

    I was talking about the sorting logic of the queue of Units waiting in Europe harbour (of Player AI).
    That is handled in DLL and completely unrelated to e.g. "Buy Menu" order", "World Builder order" or "Requests for King Reinforcement Troops".

    AI already does sort queue of Units waiting in Europe. (To ensure that it will always transport the most valuable Units to the New World first.)
    But it does that by pure "Unit Buy value" (considering Europe Buy Price) and does not directly consider "Profession Euipment value" additionally.

    I was considering to change that logic (for AI only) to have sorting always prioritize Units with "Profession Settler" to be placed first in the queue.
    But as I said, it is not necessary anymore, because AI will spawn Settlers in a Ship (in the New World) once it loses all Cities and Settlers.

    It is absolutely impossible to change that behaviour to have AI sort "Units in Profession Settler" to first place in queue by XML - because "Settler" is not a Unit but a "Profession".
    It can only be changed in DLL (source code) by programming.

    To avoid confusion in this discussion:
    "Profession Settler" (PROFESSION_SETTLER) is called "Siedlungsgründer" in German ingame in 2.8.1 (currently branch "Challenge").
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2020
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  4. Nenos

    Nenos Chieftain

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    05.09.2020 12:38

    By the way. I can't play anymore as the difficulty Governour. It is to heavy to survive. But the AI is indeed better.

    In the game which I posted. The English AI doesn't build any cities since more than 60 rounds. Before the year 1600 they lose in a war against the native's. Around 1630 I hand over them 10000 buckets. They bought something from it. But they don't build anymore cities until September 1667.

    I guess following happened. They lost theire last city in the war against the natives. Receive the settler unit in their ship and unload them in the enemy teretory or a Pirat attack the ship with the settler.

    I would ad an "If" rule for the AI ships to load the Profession_Settler unit at first.
     
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  5. nci

    nci Chieftain

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    @raystuttgart do you prefer issues being reported here, or submitted on github (alongside fixes when applicable)?
     
  6. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    AI receives a New "Settler" (in a Ship) every single time they lost all Cities and all Settlers.
    So even if they would have lost that Settler, they would have gotten another one.
    (Unless they are already declared "dead" of course - but then they would be completely out of the game with a big notification.)

    The main problem was probably that the map was already too cramped / crowded. - But that is "just guessing" as well.
    If they do not find a place to settle or get killed over and over again, they have to keep searching then until they finally find a place to settle ...

    If AI is too stupid to find a place to settle or gets killed all the time trying to do so, then that is another story.
    (But it would not be related to the feature "Profession Settler".)

    Guessing does not really help.
    Somebody would need to analyse it.

    That sounds like they did settle again.
    So where is the problem? :confused:
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2020
  7. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Guys, I am retired from Civ4Col modding again - as I had already announced weeks ago, when I started this thread. :thumbsup:
    I had just wanted to give this release some fine tuning so it could be published. (Which I now feel is the case.)

    Writing to me personally does not make any sense - and actually it never did because WTP is and always was a team project. :)
    Currently however I do not know the plans of the rest of the team and I also can not speak for them.

    ------

    All I really still do is to help to get some minor stuff finished and commited.
    (E.g. the "Domestic Advisor Screen" from @Raubwuerger because he had put effort in it and it deserved to get published.)

    I will also still be available if WTP team members - whoever continues - still have questions about my old features.
    (So I am still willing to be a supporter in the background.)

    ------

    WTP belongs to the WTP team and community. :thumbsup:

    I currently just do not know for sure who is still an active part of the "WTP team". :sad:
    But I really do hope that the rest of the WTP team will continue and will find more team members as well. :thumbsup:
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2020
  8. nci

    nci Chieftain

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    @raystuttgart RaR Americas - Gigantic needs further fixes. I am not good with github, so here goes the fixed file.
     

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  9. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Thanks. :thumbsup:
    I commited it now.

    By the way:
    I also corrected the UnitAIs.
    To be sure that the "Settler" is also used as Settler by AI.

    You would currently not have write access to the WTP GIT repository directly anyways.
    (You could of course branch it for creating your own repository - e.g. for a "modmod" project that could later be merged into WTP core again.)

    Only team members and supporters we know very well and trust (considering skills and experience) are given write access.
    (We needed to prevent that people accidently mess up WTP core mod because of not knowing what they do or commiting unapproved changes.)

    Changes of all other people need to be checked by a team member first that then also commits them into a branch of WTP core mod development.
    (It is a kind of quality control to prevent errors and uncontroled changes.)
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2020
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  10. Mr. ZorG

    Mr. ZorG Chieftain

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    Hello)

    Yesterday my friends and I tried to play multiplayer and we failed - desync at the very beginning of the game, at the very first turn.

    we had to play version 2.8. there is also desynchronization, but at least not immediately, but starting in 1545.
     
  11. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Sorry for that. :sad:

    But I have no way myself to design or test for mutliplayer - simply because I do not even fully understand how MP games are synchronized and what causes desyncs.
    Thus I do not know how to avoid or identify potential desyncs in my technical design and my implementations. :undecide:

    I design, program, implement and test only with singleplayer in mind - because that is what I fully understand technically and play myself.
    Multiplayer feature design (considering synchronisation) is simply not part of my modding knowledge. :dunno:

    I will not be of any real help solving this.

    ----------

    If it instantly and reliably happens at turn 1 with 2.8.1 it is most likely related to the new "Profession Settler".
    But I am really just guessing. I do not have any technical explanation and do not know at all how I could analyze or fix it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020
  12. Mr. ZorG

    Mr. ZorG Chieftain

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    maybe someone on the team can figure it out. multiplayer is interesting)
     
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  13. Cruiser76

    Cruiser76 Chieftain

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    I am enjoying the new challenges with building up colonies. Health and happiness are now legitimate issues. Good job!
     
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  14. Totte

    Totte Chieftain

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    I guess that there is no stupied question regarding testing 2.8.1 ;)

    Regarding Goodies inte the ocean plots. Is it possible that the AI is more active and gather them, clean them on the map in 2.8.1? Or maybe I´m the only one that manually explore the map to gather experiences to update the naval forces. For example Navigation 1 and 2 to secure the distance between the New World and the Old World. Or using the heavy warhips to gather more experiences, while exploring, to secure the colonies.

    I´ve tried different kind of options for maps but mainly size as the Gigantic. Somehow the Goddies are no longer there on unknown Oceans plots after a some turns when I enter 1600. Has someone had the same "problem"? Or is it so that AI is now smarter then me and I have to change strategy? ;)
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020
  15. Tugboatspotter

    Tugboatspotter Warlord

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    Are you playing at a higher level than you did before? I know the AI ignores goodies at lower levels.

    I think the sea goodies need to be reworked.

    1) There seems to be a high chance of the free caravel very early. This makes a massive difference in the early game and is far too much for a RNG early game bonus. It should be removed.

    2) Most of the early goodies will be found by the first caravel and there is a high chance every time that it gives experience. You always end up with a caravel with ridiculously high promotions, but for what point? As a solution it could check if the ship already has more than a certain amount of experience (10 for example), and if it does then don't give more XP bonuses from goodies.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2020
  16. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    Yes, it is. :)
    But it should not be smart enough to get them all.

    Just remember:
    You are only 1 out of 8 players.
    There is competition out there.

    Smarter AI is a problem now? :confused:
    We thought that is a good thing ...

    That is not true anymore if I remember the discussions I had with @devolution correctly AI Ships can now purposely explore Water Goodies.

    I also increased AI priority for exploration a bit.
    (It was intended for exploration on land but may also affect exploration on water.)

    I have seen AI Ships exploring Water quite well in my test games.
    I have also encountered some ships (e.g. Pirate Fregates) that had become really strong that way.

    AI also puts more focus on Scouts thus explores more on Land as well.

    Summary:

    AI ships will also explore Ocean a bit and also are smarter considering "Water Goodies".
    AI will put more focus on Scouts on land will thus explore faster and get more "Land Goodies".

    I really like it. :)

    ---------

    @Tugboatspotter

    Please do not use this thread for feature change requests - especially of really old RaR features. ;)
    They will get lost in Nirvana this way and just clutter the thread for feedback or bugs for the specific Test Release for 2.8.1.

    Ideally start a new thread for your ideas considering "Water Goody Huts". :thumbsup:
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2020
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  17. Totte

    Totte Chieftain

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    Smarter AI is a problem now? :confused:
    We thought that is a good thing ...


    I don´t have any problems that AI is now more active to find Goodies on both water and land. As I said before, the version 2.8.1, force you to become one real Colonist and change your strategy, Thank you for the answers :)

    Still a problem with Treasures disappearing without me clicking outside the window to accept or deny what the King asks for regarding raising taxes. But there I need to gather some examples and saves.
     
  18. Mr. ZorG

    Mr. ZorG Chieftain

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    while testing 2.8.1 noticed a bug. when an event occurs, when the king asks to send a native to Europe, the unit is not always highlighted correctly. in my games the hardy pioneer and someone else were highlighted)), unfortunately, there are no saves / screenshots. but if necessary, I will start a new game and they will be done.
     
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  19. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder

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    I noticed it too. :thumbsup:
    It also happens for other Python events that are checking for a Unit on the Map.

    It is very easy to reproduce, so a save is not necessary.
    When I find time and motivation I will look into it. :)

    But currently I consider it a small annoyance only. The events still work.
    (The correct Unit is used/removed. - The sceen simply centers on a wrong plot.)

    As explanation:

    @devolution told me about Asserts being triggered for these events.
    I changed some events (with Units on Plot) in XML so they will not trigger an Assert anymore.
    The thing you mentioned seems to be a side effect of that.
     
  20. Mr. ZorG

    Mr. ZorG Chieftain

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    yes, there is no rush until release 2.9 is ready for publication) just a note. it's good that not only me noticed this))
     

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