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Brexit Thread VIII: Taking a penalty kick-ing

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by tjs282, Nov 1, 2019.

  1. Takhisis

    Takhisis Jinping, wer fragt uns?

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    up yours.
    Did we just catch Mr. anti-oligarch celebrating how withdrawal of workers' protections means higher investment from unrestrained capitalism?
     
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  2. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    Apparently the details of the Christmas deal allows tariff wise trade on cars in both directions with conditions that can be handled. UK manufactured batteries important for EV to meet the percentage needed.

    But I would not be too optimistic about future car manufacturing in the UK, it all does force less scale size suppliers for all the components needed. Price competition driven by consumers is a cruel master.

    And cars like from the article below... the below 5,000 Euro cars... if you still can call that a car in current terminology... will gain a lot of market:
    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-56178802

    Whereby I personally like such cars very much... like a modern version of the old Fiat 500, or Citroen 2CV.
     
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  3. mitsho

    mitsho Deity

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    Just for Clarification: These batteries would have been produced in the British factories anyways since that is where the expertise was. With Brexit, they thought about moving it into the European Union because of tariffs. As there was a deal reached before Christmas between London and Brussels, they can now do it in the UK anyways. Big win?

    PS: Also, the car is not a technology of the future.
     
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  4. Gorbles

    Gorbles Load Balanced

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    Your praise would ring truer if you didn't seek to undermine and dismiss all the negative consequences any time somebody posts them. As it stands, you're just being selective in what you choose to "mention" yourself.

    Every time you came up against something inarguable, you've always trotted out "yes but at least you can now do this out from under the EU". A noble sentiment that is now in turn undermined by your own glee that you can stick it to the people upset over Brexit because one thing nominally came up positively for a single factory in England.
     
  5. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    Certainly with the EV simplifying the components needed the mechanial-electrical content of car components is getting fully matured, like commodity products as fridges etc.
    Only the battery and software are really left. That companies like Google show interest for their own car manufacturing showing that development.
    And yes, there will always be a market for the rich, the hobbyists and the company lease cars needed for frequent travelling and (more so) to show seniority in the picking order of the company.
    The car as citizen's status object for the male family provider is losing ground. Status is shifting to other life style choices as status priorities and the percentage of families as percentage of total population is going down also because of ageing. We are simply on average a much longer part of our life a single whether a youngster in the parental household or living single with some kind of a partnership or not.
    And yes, this will be a major transformation of the metal industry the coming years, first 1-2 decades also affecting traditional car manufacturing strongholds as Germany with China-Asia attacking the traditional position of "the car", the holy cow, as also very much sold to the public by car manufacturers.
     
  6. EnglishEdward

    EnglishEdward Deity

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    Remainers claimed that if the UK left the EU, manufacturing
    capacity would transfer to the EU, and close down in the UK.

    But in the near 50 year history of the UK in the EEC/EC/EU, there
    were numerous examples of exactly that transfer/closure happening.

    I expect that process may continue for a variety of reasons, e.g. the
    failure of the UK government to have a proper industrial strategy.

    But the question is, is that process accelerating or slowing?

    The Nissan decision implies that it is not automatic or inevitable.
     
  7. really

    really Deity

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    Getting the batteries included was a good deal for the UK.

    But the whole thing still sounds like 'Factory doesn't shut down' as a Brexit win.
     
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  8. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    It kind of is.
     
  9. Gorbles

    Gorbles Load Balanced

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    Remainers claiming that it would happen is not the same as Remainers claiming it would happen in 100% of circumstances and in every case. But hey, you've got to beat your drum.
     
  10. EnglishEdward

    EnglishEdward Deity

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    I have never said that Remainers claimed it would happen in 100% of circumstances and in every case.
     
  11. Gorbles

    Gorbles Load Balanced

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    So why raise the implication that such a process is not therefore automatic or inevitable? The Nissan decision could well be an outlier.
     
  12. EnglishEdward

    EnglishEdward Deity

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    Well if you want to believe that the Nissan decision is an outlier and that
    the rest of the UK manufacturing may move to the EU, that is up to you.

    We shall see.
     
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  13. Gorbles

    Gorbles Load Balanced

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    I go on what I see. So far I've seen more individuals and companies negatively-affected by Brexit, and indeed in various examples (that have been raised in the past already) resulted in moving jobs to EU countries (from the UK) than I have the reverse.
     
  14. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    Yes... many factors at play... time will tell more... but even analysing backward is difficult because management info at government level on all the complex supply chains of international travelling components or service components are not part well enough of standard reportings.
    Some challenge there as well when CO2 footprints become mandatory for international trade with CO2 taxes attached.
    Backward analysing over the first decades since 1973 very difficult and not solid. Everybody in the richer parts of Europe lost over time domestic economy from completed products and later increasingly components to first Italy and Japan, then lower cost Europe and Turkey and again later as cherry on the cake to the joining East Europe, massively China and the other emerging Asian tigers. The outsourcing in domestic economy of service components in industry like transport, payroll, IT, etc from manufacturing (statistic reportin) to the general service sector (statistic reporting) further complicating.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2021
  15. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    Meanwhile the free port zones are getting attention more and were mentioned by Sunak in the presented budget today:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/mar/03/eight-free-ports-low-tax-zones-created-england

    Another economical effect of this Brexit-Tory government that will be difficult to judge in consequences.
    The first effect tax breaks... the intended effect more FDI (Foreign Direct Investments)... the imo likely intention as well to have zones outside the UK-EU agreement.
     
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  16. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    The budget of tax breaks for business, increases (if small) for everyone else.
     
  17. Takhisis

    Takhisis Jinping, wer fragt uns?

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    up yours.
    You don't need free ports when you're in a free trade area… for a bunch of libertarians to abolish existing free trade on a whim does sound like a contradiction, eh?
     
  18. Samson

    Samson Deity

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    It gives you a way to give tax cuts to businesses without saying you are giving tax cuts to businesses.
     
  19. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    SoftBrexit ? not likely as car exports are not tariff
    But as the UK continues to bend the trade agreement it currently has to suit its own ends eventually something will have to give.
     
  20. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    Whatever the causes, many people seem to leave the UK.

    Covid or Brexit ?
    This Tory government ?
    intended or not ?

     
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