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Bugs3 - The Sid Virgin Sacrifice

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by Sir Bugsy, Oct 8, 2004.

  1. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    About 18months ago ChrTh sponsored CTR1 – Jump Without Looking (the Deity Virgin Sacrifice) You can find the thread here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=53266

    In that game the only requirement to joining the team was that you could never have won at Emperor or at Deity. We are going to relax those requirements for the

    Sid Virgin Sacrifice

    In order to join this game there is only one requirement, you can never have WON a Sid level game. I know there are plenty of those who have failed at Sid. Here’s your chance.

    Since we had started to discuss this over at GK2 - The Training Day Game, two people have PM'ed me expressing interest. One, Alerum, has since gone on a leave of absence from SGs.

    Variant – None
    Version: C3C – 1.22
    Civ – TBD
    Settings – TBD
    Rules: standard no exploits (LK & RBC apply)

    Roster:
    grs
    Ankka
    Gyathaar
    Doc T
    Gator
    Bugs

    This is going to require a lot of commitment and discussion, the faint of heart need not apply.
     
  2. grs

    grs nameless one

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    Signing in, I just was about to pm you as you told in the training game thread I just read the last pages of.
     
  3. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    Welcome to the queue for the virgin sacrifice, we'll need to think about that civilization we shall be when we are thrown into the volcano.
     
  4. DJMGator13

    DJMGator13 Wondering why Builders can't build Roads

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    Until Bugs 2.0 I had never played a full DG game. I'm up for my first try at SID.
     
  5. grs

    grs nameless one

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    Ok, I'll make my proposition. The idea is taken from Bamspeedy's "Beyond Sid" game. Though I don't think we should replay it (and it was not C3C), I do think the starting idea is even more promising in conquests.

    France, standard size, archipelago 80%, wet, temperate, 4 billion

    France is commercial and industrious starting with masonry and alphabet.

    Commercial will allow us to research faster, especially later in the game. Industrious was lowered in c3c, but is still good for faster workers and a little more shields later on.

    Alphabet will enable us to build curraghs immediately and brings us one tech closer to literature, which we should go for asap. Masonry will allow us to start a palace pre-build for The Great Library in our second town.

    The musketeer is probably the most price effective defender since c3c. I would even consider it better than the hoplite, because of the later golden age and the defensive bombard. It will help us defend vs. one or another oponent we can't stop from declaring later on, and could be an exellent pillaging menace.
     
  6. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    I like the idea of France's traits. Is it even possible to get an AA wonder in Sid?

    Welcome aboard Gator. There are now four virgins to sacrifice.
     
  7. grs

    grs nameless one

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    Well, it depends on the map, but if possible I think of a farmers gambit at the start. We would need to get as many towns fast and start a prebuild in our 2nd town soon, while growing fast enough to keep the palace big enough. With an archipelago and the AI often ignoring literature it should be possible to get the library around 1000BC or sooner.

    But I am up for any other plan too - for sure.
     
  8. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    Well, that's what this game will be all about, the sharing of ideas, learning new lessons, and hopefully not getting our butts kicked. I think I need to review what advantages the AI gets at Sid.
     
  9. Gyathaar

    Gyathaar Warlock Retired Moderator GOTM Staff

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    I would like to join if there is still room :)

    France sounds interesting.. I havent played them at all in c3c I think.

    Have never won a sid game, nor have I lost one.. the few attempts I have had at that level I have abandoned while still in the BCs.
     
  10. akots

    akots Poet

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    Good luck, guys! Hope you can pull it off. :)
     
  11. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    Gyathaar - welcome.

    Akots - I think we'll need a lot of luck

    So what does everyone think about civ and map. I like Bamspeedy's map characteristics.

    GRS has made a strong point for France. I think a good arguement could be made for Greece as well with the Scientific and Commerial traits.

    As for roster line up, I think we'll follow the sun. I know Germany is on CET. If memory serves, Norway is on CET as well. Is Finland on CET also? Gator is on Eastern and I'm on Pacific. We should be able to have some timely handoffs.
     
  12. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

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    The critical thing about the prebuild is: Without an insanely good start (2+ Grasland Cows) or being AGR, you won't bebig enough to reach a 300spt Palace. Even with maximizing 'The Big Picture', that's about 10 turns of demands...
    But in general, that part of Sid is doable. Even managed to build MoM and GLib in the same city. The real insane part comes later IMHO; Ancient and Medieval isn't that different from Deity. But the Cavalry stacks that sneak attack you later :rolleyes:

    Would be interested, if you want one more player. But would not feel offended if you say '5 is enough'.

    Doc
     
  13. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    I would be honored to have Doc on the team. Given the last three SGs I've completed, the roster has been the same from beginning to end.

    What time zone is Yumbo in? :D
     
  14. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

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    CET as well. Should really get a new line some time...
     
  15. Gyathaar

    Gyathaar Warlock Retired Moderator GOTM Staff

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    If reading Sir Pleb's Sid game for HOF you see that with the settings he had then he usually could get GLib first. The first 2 posts descibes the beginning game strats he used. Ofcourse he used an agr civ, so would not work quite the same if playing the french.

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=81424
     
  16. DJMGator13

    DJMGator13 Wondering why Builders can't build Roads

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    How important will scientific be (free tech)? Are we going to be able to research at all, or will we be trading for techs almost exclusively. The agri trait can be overcome with a "good" starting map.

    I have not even attempted a SID game. However I have read thru the completion of SirPleb's HOF game, his gifting of the GL before learning Education was big, as well as the discoveries concerning armies and his FODs.

    I almost always go farmers Gambit at beginning of my games. Being able to establish a productive core will be important.
     
  17. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    Agricultural is another great trait.

    Options there:

    1. Iroquois - Agricultural & Commercial
    2. Maya - Industious & Agricultural
    3. Sumerian - Scientific & Agricultural


    I'll have to read SirPleb's account tonight.
     
  18. Sir Bugsy

    Sir Bugsy Civ.D.

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    I think Gator has a very good point about scientific. I guess we'll need to think about that.
     
  19. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

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    Scientific is pretty pointless. Most of my Sid attempts so far were with Byzantium (love Dromons), but the only benefit is cheaper border expansion.
    Free Tech? The first one will come in with the GLib anyway. The Industrial one can be helpful, but on Sid you simply get less gold for techs, unless you can sell to that Civ that has all the cash.

    AGR was my next choice, really helpful in the beginning, but not that important later.

    IMHO COM is a must-have. Iros are out, they are always played. So, look at the UUs.
     
  20. grs

    grs nameless one

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    I agree with doc that commercial is very important. If we do an archipelago map I would not overestimate agricultural. It is awesome for settling a lot of land fast, but if we have an island where we could fit in maybe 10 cities it is not that strong.

    Just in case there is anyone who has not already read it: Beyond Sid
     

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