Bush's popularity outside the US

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by Patroklos
Liberals are most definetly the side that uses baiting and propoganda most. Any good liberal gets his rocks off by claiming anyone not with him is a either greedy, racist, facist or a combination of the three. Conservatives do it too with words like unpatriotic and traitor, but not nearly as much and not nearly for so long.

And as far as Dean getting support for bieng above the bull, all he does, day in a day out, is make outrageous verbal assaults on Bush using the words above, or derivatives. It is the fact that the Liberals don't realize their sick tactics that makes them worse.

-Pat

Dean is not allowed to attack Bush record.

To note you comment about liberals, look at the Republican party itself. What is it stronghold? The South. The South is the most racist region of the nation (I know this being Southerner). The party is also against helping minority and any way and loves to talk about how "the white man" is so oppressed. Who controls the business world? Who controls most of the money? White men. So how can white men be an oppress class? Conservatives are called greedy because they are greedy. They want to jack taxes sky-high on the lower and middle classes to practice wealth redistrubition to millionaries. I cant say that makes sense to me.

 

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by tomart109

Since I'm daring to suggest that America may be sliding blindly into fascism, here is a scholarly article with 14 characteristics of 20th century proto-fascist states. OK, class, how many can you spot in today's America? The answer may surprise you.

http://secularhumanism.org/library/fi/britt_23_2.htm

Read the article and 14 out of 14 apply to modern America.

 

[Patroklos]

I rest my case Archer, thank you for adhereing to steriotypes.

Anyways, Dean attacks Bush's record all the time and has every right to do so, it is just that perhaps he could site real problems instead of make them up or using the wrong descriptive words. Facist, the new liberal catch phrase, is much more offensive to me than unpatriotic. And I am from the South, and we are much less racist than the West of North (which I have lived), it is just that it is fun to play up steriotypes of anything racial happening in the South, and just glass over them in other places.

White men are not oppressed, but they certainly don't achieve any help either. The fact that even with all the legal and funding incentives that basically GIVES success to any minoity that wants to work for it (and alot do), the majority still want to blame someone else for their problems. Obviously the democratic view of simply throwing money at social problems doesn't work .Though the conservative view of just working hard despite the hand you are dealt has worked for all human history. You are using tired democratic propoganda cliches a la the "rich white man steping on the poor" war cry. No one believes it anymore.

Sorry if I didn't commute my point, but I refuse to take the silver spoon out of my mouth, god knows I would be in the gutter if I wans't a white male.

-Pat

 

[Patroklos]

4, 5, 6, 10, 11, 13, 14 do not apply unless you use a single year of occurances as indicative of the entire trend of American culture, or are just intentionally scewing explainable and understadable events to "cry witch." Not that that list is in any way accurate, or reflective of ANY facist regime that ever exisited. Some fool who reads a few biased books to produce his own biased site hardly warrents posting a link to as proof of anything.

Look at that referance list, it is ridiculous.

 

[Free Enterprise]

Originally posted by archer_007
Conservatives are called greedy because they are greedy. They want to jack taxes sky-high on the lower and middle classes to practice wealth redistrubition to millionaries. I cant say that makes sense to me.

True conservatives want an end to redistrubtion of income via taxation. Flat tax is not the same as a reverse income tax. Pure, undiluted slander continues to surface thus proving debates rarely can funciton normally anymore.

That would be like saying liberals want to redistribute all the property to enviromentalists. Although this is obviously a false statement.

It seems that having the South vote for a party must be a bad thing, so much for majority rule (not that majority rule is special).

 

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by Patroklos
I rest my case Archer, thank you for adhereing to steriotypes.

Anyways, Dean attacks Bush's record all the time and has every right to do so, it is just that perhaps he could site real problems instead of make them up or using the wrong descriptive words. Facist, the new liberal catch phrase, is much more offensive to me than unpatriotic. And I am from the South, and we are much less racist than the West of North (which I have lived), it is just that it is fun to play up steriotypes of anything racial happening in the South, and just glass over them in other places.
-Pat

Liberals calling conservative fascists is just the same as conservatives called liberal communists. Why the outcry against one, yet not the other?

I live in the South, and I have many relatives in the North. From my own personal experience, the South is overall more racist. I hear the "dumb black man" stereotype all the time, said in from of black people.

Racist in the South has gotten to the point we're blacks are just starting to take it. We dont of segrated proms in the North.

 

[Free Enterprise]

Originally posted by tomart109

Recently, I've seen the American political discourse poisoned by vitriolic conservative hate/fearmongers who vilify and attack anyone who disagrees, calling them every hateful name, use every trick to win at all costs, and routinely smear the other side.

Originally posted by tomart109

Don't bother flaming me or lashing out with the same old insults or Clinton comparisons; you'll notice i'm talking ONLY about the damage this moron is doing to our country.

Interesting that vilification is only applicable in some circumstances in others...........it MUST GO NOW.

 

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by Free Enterprise


True conservatives want an end to redistrubtion of income via taxation. Flat tax is not the same as a reverse income tax. Pure, undiluted slander continues to surface thus proving debates rarely can funciton normally anymore.

It seems that having the South vote for a party must be a bad thing, so much for majority rule (not that majority rule is special).

How did the Republicans start gaining votes in the South? Flaming racial tensions.

It is slander to say the Republicans are giving from the middle and pushing money to the wealthy. How much did the middle class get from Bush's "across the board" tax cuts? A negative number. They pay more now then ever.

A flax tax would never work, since it would either be too low and the government couldnt function or too high and the poor wouldnt have enough money to have food.

 

[Free Enterprise]

Originally posted by archer_007


It is slander to say the Republicans are giving from the middle and pushing money to the wealthy. How much did the middle class get from Bush's "across the board" tax cuts? A negative number. They pay more now then ever.

The rich still pay more...... Following this logic, any tax increase must be viewed as raw hatred of those upon which such a burden is layed! That means quite a few Presidents must have had a secret loathing of many people.

A flax tax would never work, since it would either be too low and the government couldnt function or too high and the poor wouldnt have enough money to have food.

A lot of ideas on the other side of the political spectrum would never work. That does not seem to stop them from advocating them.

 

[Sims2789]

delete post.

 

[Vancouver 2010]

I'm Canadian, I can't stand Bush, and I equally can't stand the United States (especially when it comes to their apparent free-trade-if-it-works-to-our-advantage policy concerning softwood lumber ... but that is drifting from the thread topic a little).

 

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by Free Enterprise

A lot of ideas on the other side of the political spectrum would never work. That does not seem to stop them from advocating them. [/B]

Examples please?

 

[Free Enterprise]

The immigration policies (earned amensty) of some in the Democratic (more than Republicans though) party and the Republican party would result in making impossible the task of preventing terrorist attacks within the United States. Although technically not impossible to do this neither is it technically impossible to have a flat tax. It would result in negative consequence eventually and inevitably although it also carries positive benefits.

 

[Mr. Cackle]

Originally posted by Free Enterprise
The immigration policies (earned amensty) of some in the Democratic (more than Republicans though) party and the Republican party would result in making impossible the task of preventing terrorist attacks within the United States. Although technically not impossible to do this neither is it technically impossible to have a flat tax. It would result in negative consequence eventually and inevitably although it also carries positive benefits.

Errm, have you looked at the newspaper today? Bush just announced he would press for amnesty for all immigrants with jobs.

Amnesty is an excellent idea. Without it, illegal immigrants would remain in their indentured servitude, unable to get even MINIMUM WAGE because they are not citizens. They can't go to hospitals, police stations, or any government place because they don't count as people in the eyes of the law.

As for stopping terrorism, how about spending that money that SHOULD be going to intelligence work ON intelligence work RATHER than going on wars of conquest in Iraq? If national security is an issue, then why do you Republicans put the safety of a foreign people ABOVE the safety of the American people?

 

[Free Enterprise]

Originally posted by Mr. Cackle

Errm, have you looked at the newspaper today? Bush just announced he would press for amnesty for all immigrants with jobs.

That is why I put Republicans too.............. Bush, some Republicans, and some Democrats support this. I am totally aware that Bush has announced such a plan. Some Democrats have supported this proposal therefore I posted as a relative consideration for Archer's claims.

Amnesty is an excellent idea. Without it, illegal immigrants would remain in their indentured servitude, unable to get even MINIMUM WAGE because they are not citizens. They can't go to hospitals, police stations, or any government place because they don't count as people in the eyes of the law.

In fact, most of them broke the law getting in..... However this seems not to matter to some. The rule of law is supposed to be an important tradition. Why even have immigration laws if you don't enforce them in every circumstance? Obviously, illegal immigrants are people however they are not U.S. citizens can only become them through legal means. The law cannot recognize them as legal citizens otherwise there is a immense risk of anarchy emerging.

As for stopping terrorism, how about spending that money that SHOULD be going to intelligence work ON intelligence work RATHER than going on wars of conquest in Iraq? If national security is an issue, then why do you Republicans put the safety of a foreign people ABOVE the safety of the American people? [/B]

The fact is terrorists could quite possibly now benefit from the Amensty plan Bush is going to offer. When would a wannabe terrorist try to get in the U.S.? Yes, after the realize they can become legal citizens by illegally breaking in. There is a window of time they can enter before the amensty occurs if it is actually passed. I am not a Republican btw (I am definitely not a Democrat though; I am not part of any party nor do I support every action taken by the big two parties).

This is starting to get off-topic. This all began because I was trying to explain the flat tax is not a policy ignited by hatred. Which then led to having to cite an example of something the other side supports which is impossible. I did not say this is impossible to technically implement by the way.

 

[Portuguese]

16 Vs 92 > Yeah, perhaps you're right...

 

[Archer 007]

Originally posted by Free Enterprise
The immigration policies (earned amensty) of some in the Democratic (more than Republicans though) party and the Republican party would result in making impossible the task of preventing terrorist attacks within the United States.

In an ideal world, I agree a flat tax would be best. We arent in a fantasy land though.

Looks like earned rights are going into effect:

US to Overhaul Immigration Law