[NFP] Byzantium First Look

[Inhalaattori]

Quick response:
https://twitter.com/FXS_MisterKevin/status/1306679954059522050?s=19

Units continue to be resource-maintenance free after upgrading. They will incur gold-maintenance after upgrading though.

They are not actually maintenance free to begin with. You can see from the first look video that they cost gold maintenance just like regular knights. This is also clear from the leader screen text. There is nothing about them being maintenance free. They dont require resources, but they do have normal maintenance costs.

 

[Sostratus]

Nah, 'cause most of a war (I find) happens after you've already destroyed their units, and you're mainly just fighting against the city defenses.

It'll be a short war though- Basil brought the siege cavalry.

 

[Kmart_Elvis]

Come to think of it, Byzantium can do a Religious Victory without religious unit, as all their military units function like apostles.

If you build Stonehenge to get the free Great Prophet, you could do a total No Apostle or Missionary Religious Victory with them.

Edit: Also No Holy Site!

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

If you build Stonehenge to get the free Great Prophet, you could do a total No Apostle or Missionary Religious Victory with them.

Edit: Also No Holy Site!

Mvemba is intrigued.

 

[CivLuvah]

Mvemba is intrigued.

I see your avatar just changed!

 

[Goodenuf]

tl;dr
Convert your enemies, then wipe them out.

 

[Zaarin]

Mvemba is intrigued.

"I welcome the weapons of your cavalry. We learn so much from their murderous rampages."

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

"I welcome the weapons of your cavalry. We learn so much from their murderous rampages."

Yes! Yes! Send your missionaries. Um, wait. They're awfully well armed for missionaries. And, um. Shouldn't they have holy books?

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

I just watched the video one more time and I think a lot of us (including me) made a mistake when equating killing a unit to killing a missionary/apostle when it comes to religious pressure. We are not sure if killing a unit removes that unit's religion or not, we only know that it adds 250 religious pressure, which is only slightly stronger than a missionary spread at full HP (220 pressure). Personally I don't think killing a regular unit will remove religious pressure, only spreads Byz's religion. I think we all know that using missionaries only is depressingly slow if we want to convert civs with religion in place, especially holy city, so this ability is kinda cool but not as strong as we all estimated.

 

[Galvatron]

Yes! Yes! Send your missionaries. Um, wait. They're awfully well armed for missionaries. And, um. Shouldn't they have holy books?

I say the whole world must learn of our peaceful ways. By force.

 

[AriochIV]

I just watched the video one more time and I think a lot of us (including me) made a mistake when equating killing a unit to killing a missionary/apostle when it comes to religious pressure. We are not sure if killing a unit removes that unit's religion or not, we only know that it adds 250 religious pressure, which is only slightly stronger than a missionary spread at full HP (220 pressure). Personally I don't think killing a regular unit will remove religious pressure, only spreads Byz's religion. I think we all know that using missionaries only is depressingly slow if we want to convert civs with religion in place, especially holy city, so this ability is kinda cool but not as strong as we all estimated.

I think it probably works the same way as Religious unit combat currently does, with both a positive and negative pressure, though we can't see in the video as the event is obscured by the historic moment popup. It would be pretty cheesy if it automatically flips the city majority religion, so I hope that's not the case.

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

I think it probably works the same way as Religious unit combat currently does, with both a positive and negative pressure, though we can't see in the video as the event is obscured by the historic moment popup. It would be pretty cheesy if it automatically flips the city majority religion, so I hope that's not the case.

I just checked, it will not give negative pressure. You can see it yourself at 1:30, when an Apostle dies, negative pressure applies first, then positive pressure. When a military unit dies, only positive pressure applies. I mean, it makes sense, since if they want military units to apply negative pressure, they will probably make a banner under their icon representing their religions, but then there will be a question whether it should carry the religion of its city or the majority the religion of the civ, and what if that unit is created in a city that already has Byzantium's religion.

All in all, good ability for sure, not as strong as we all estimated.

 

[Sostratus]

Is the Tagma faster than the standard knight? I think we see it have 48 base strength booster to 60, and 6 movement. There’s a nearby GG so that would make it 5 base. But maybe logistics or something is in play.
If this Civ was nothing but “faster super knight” it would already be a great choice.

 

[comatosedragon]

Well, as someone who never plays Religion or domination -- guess how I feel about this civ?.

 

[AriochIV]

Well, as someone who never plays Religion or domination -- guess how I feel about this civ?.

Religion and military power are useful for other victory types as well. I almost never go for a Domination victory, but that doesn't stop me from taking other peoples' territory and adding it to my own.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Religion and military power are useful for other victory types as well. I almost never go for a Domination victory, but that doesn't stop me from taking other peoples' territory and adding it to my own.

I never won dimination victory but if someone declares war first it means he will lose one o two cities or his vassals will be conquered as well.
I did won Culture and Science though.

 

[Ezumiyr]

Tagma is a terrible choice of a name.
It's like if all countries' UU were just called "army" or "regiment" in their own language. It would be a nice name for a special ability or an early corps/army, but for a unit... They could at least have used the name of a specific one, like the optimatoi or something.

 

[Republic of San Montuoso]

I have a small question (because of Firaxis' bad wording): does Byzantium have to found a religion, or would it be like a Tamar-like thing where it's ok if it's your majority religion? I suppose, when it's never precised, that you have to found it but I'm not sure.

 

[LoneRebel]

So, I just opened up Steam, and guess what greeted me?

 

[Victoria]

Ranged Dromon, screw the rest, this alone is scary. Often you can only get one quad to target a city per turn. This makes them rather nasty early if there is a cupful of water anywhere. Also popping one in a city for defence with that +10... yikes. An admiral will make em fast enough to own the coast... and one tile in.
The fact the AI is so bad with religion makes this civ even more OP.