Faustmouse
Deity
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No, it was a common strategy to surround a city to starve it... but what about making buildings like well or granary a city more immune against S&D?
C2C - You Tube
- Thread starter Hydromancerx
- Start date
No, it was a common strategy to surround a city to starve it... but what about making buildings like well or granary a city more immune against S&D?
+10000 to this. Cities were always surrounded and sieged up until modern times, so removing the SAD bonus against cities would be a horrible idea.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
I don't mind adding a tag for defensive buildings later to help cities to counter some S&D benefit being applied against them though.
Would be very easily accomplished now that I understand the S&D code quite well. But we should never go overboard with its use because under some new strategic functions the combat mod introduces, application of S&D may become a fairly necessary counterbalance for the attacker in some situations.
In the second phase of the Combat Mod design, I can safely add this while retaining balance because siege weapons should be used to actually destroy buildings like walls rather than just knocking down the cultural defense.
Would be very easily accomplished now that I understand the S&D code quite well. But we should never go overboard with its use because under some new strategic functions the combat mod introduces, application of S&D may become a fairly necessary counterbalance for the attacker in some situations.
In the second phase of the Combat Mod design, I can safely add this while retaining balance because siege weapons should be used to actually destroy buildings like walls rather than just knocking down the cultural defense.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Yes, totally. I think there's something wrong when anyone but a small elite can be competative on diety
What is need is for players who have situations in which the AI makes a clear mistake (vague strategic errors don't count - a definate tactical mistake you observe I mean) to post save games of the previous turn's autosave, and descriptions (and ideally BBAI logs too, but saves where it reproduces are the main thing). Those with BBAI logs running who are play-testing and active here could also check the AI stats periodically and see if they can see things going awry.
Acularius
King
I always found that vanilla CIV, that Noble was competitive enough for a relaxing game for me.
Now I'm playing the higher difficulties with the same strategies and I'm still finding the game to be at a 'relaxing' state.
I'm not saying to make it 'Magni Mundi Masochistic loving' difficult (I loved that mod, it was a one sided love.
). Just at the point where 'Noble' is 'normal' difficulty again. 
@Koshling:
What on earth is going on at about 12:04 in the first vid? I've had the same problem for about the past three months, and I think it has something to do with Viewports. It almost looks like BT, except it goes away on a reload.
What on earth is going on at about 12:04 in the first vid? I've had the same problem for about the past three months, and I think it has something to do with Viewports. It almost looks like BT, except it goes away on a reload.
@Koshling:
What on earth is going on at about 12:04 in the first vid? I've had the same problem for about the past three months, and I think it has something to do with Viewports. It almost looks like BT, except it goes away on a reload.
I don't know. I've seen it happen on occasion too, but never repeatably to investigate yet. I am also 99.99% sure it is a viewport issue.
I probably can get it to crash from there, I seem to remember an issue with that. I'll see if I can get a minidump from it.
Edit: Yay, it crashed! Minidump is in the bugs/crashes thread.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
I've no idea how Shen got so lucky when attacking a lot of these cities, in my games on deity, cities can have 30+ units defending, anything lower than 5 is virtually non existent.
* I think having the map so cramped really screws up the AI - having now thought about it. They can't figure out what to do with there army very well and other problems too.
* I think having the map so cramped really screws up the AI - having now thought about it. They can't figure out what to do with there army very well and other problems too.
shenryyr
serval
Well, the beginning game savefile is provided by a link in the first video's description, it may be worth playing a few times on the current SVN to see if it changes the way the AI gets going in the early game stages. the game was begun under v26 with the same-day patch, which I know is a little out of date by now.
On the other hand, there is -tons- of room the AI could be using, but they simply do not. The Tupi, for example, completely ignore all the peninsula between us. It is a lot of land, and there are several barbarian cities... They could be rushing to tribalism and settling the area, but instead they just kind of linger back and do nothing.
The Uzbeks went to war early with the Malagasy, which is good because neighboring civs probably should do that, but that also slowed them down in the long run because they didn't finish the deal until thousands of years later. After taking out Malagasy, the Uzbeks became a powerhouse, expanding everywhere quickly. But until then, they were ******ed(slow to grow)
I'm about 8,000 years forward in time from those videos, and we've just blown the AI's away by being peaceful... 500+ gold per turn in classical era has brought us up to date by buying techs from our "friendly" neighbors, and now we actually have a tech advantage on them by prioritizing literature and astrology. And we can even buy wonders with the spare cash. All the while, the AI's have big armies on our borders. I can save a lot of cash by agreeing to the AI's demands when they want some gold or a tech, and that gives us more years of peace to continue teching...
The biggest surprise was those first guys you conquered on the left taking those 2 awesome cities. He had what 2 or 3 dudes defending and virtually no other army? I've never seen this before. Usually early prehistoric they have at least 10+ units defending capital, probably more like 25+ in a lot of cases. Anyway, it worked out great in terms of your game.
In the game im playing now congo is my neighbour and on two cities he had over 50 units i'd say. I've had to reload about 4 or 5 times to survive this massive push that he is doing at the end of prehistoric with horseman and atl-atl.
In the game im playing now congo is my neighbour and on two cities he had over 50 units i'd say. I've had to reload about 4 or 5 times to survive this massive push that he is doing at the end of prehistoric with horseman and atl-atl.
The hugs stacks defending cities were due to a bug that was corrected in V26. Might be that it over-compensated. Might also be good to modify things slightly in that the AIs should harden their defensive stance in response to the player they are hardening them against having a different difficulty setting to them (that is, a neighbor playing on a higher difficulty settings would be seen as a bigger threat and so encourage stronger defense of that border). Since typically only humans play at higher difficulty levels the result would be the AIs all taking a stringer defensive stance in areas where they contact the (high difficulty) human player.
That should be an easy enough change...
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@Koshling, another thing I noticed with shen's recent video is his 1 gold diplomacy for peace exploit. This obviously needs to be patched. To force peace for 80 turns by demanding 1 gold.
The AI is inclined to accept the deal because its only 1 gold, but the implication is obviously the 80 turn peace which they don't factor in.
The AI is inclined to accept the deal because its only 1 gold, but the implication is obviously the 80 turn peace which they don't factor in.
shenryyr
serval
yea it's a bit silly. however I have seen the AI break the peace treaty a few times.
in fact they just did a bit ago, the navajo deced us even though we had like 30 turns of peace treaty remaining
Maybe a fix would be to have a minimum demand amount per era.
Although, all those resources that are basically useless would count too wouldn't they? Like you could just demand a resource that has literally 0 value and the AI would accept. They would need to be excluded as well.
Maybe just say anything with a value under $100 per era x3. So 300 ancient, 900 classical.. is excluded (not allowed to be demanded).
Although, all those resources that are basically useless would count too wouldn't they? Like you could just demand a resource that has literally 0 value and the AI would accept. They would need to be excluded as well.
Maybe just say anything with a value under $100 per era x3. So 300 ancient, 900 classical.. is excluded (not allowed to be demanded).
Well, if the AI properly values the peace treaty time then that kind of "fix" won't be needed.
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