California School Bans American Flag?

The US flag is a symbol of Imperial rule over the Mexican one?
US flag is a symbol used in the context of Californian teenage ethnic and gang violence. No symbol has an absolute meaning decontextualized from where and how it's being used. Even Unionist paraphanalia is, in various contexts, a legitimate show of pluralistic patriotism, a show of resistance against England, and a show of support for the O'Neils against proud Meath and those upstarts in Connacht.


We shouldn't be judging about how some abstract person should react to some abstract person wearing the flag. The question is how a principal should react to those particular students, in that particular time and that particular place.
 
Right right, and biting your thumb is/was murder-worthy at some point too. You make a compelling argument, if what you say is true, for banning all flags, both Mexican and Murican from that school if Californian teenage ethic and gang violence is the only messages those symbols convey. So, why is this specific day different? Why would use of either get a pass on any day, much less some asinine principle where one is appropriate on some days and the other on other days?
 
The question is how a principal should react to those particular students, in that particular time and that particular place.
And there it is.

This is not about any flag. This is not about historical significance. All this is about is prevention.

If the principal would have cause to believe that wearing bunny-slippers to school would offend other students for some reason, he could have asked those students to remove the bunny-slippers.

The silliness of why other students would be offended, or the silliness why students would wear bunny-slippers is of less importance at that, as Park mentioned, particular time and that particular place. The principle is trying to keep the peace, and made the decision with that motivation.

I myself think it's way, way, over-sensitive and really ridiculous to be offended by something as tacky and distasteful as a t-shirt with an American flag. But then again, I am Dutch, I don't go to that school, I don't know the environment or the past events that made that principle make that decision.

Or, they hate America and want to ban flags. (And rape Lady Liberty, who is French and has been asking for it really)
 
And there it is.

It's also a sad statement on how compelled we feel, rightly or wrongly, that we need to protect and control the environment for our brown southern <snip>. Kinda like making sure you don't let black males spend any time around white women, since you know, they are incapable of controlling their African rape-genes.

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It's also a sad statement on how compelled we feel, rightly or wrongly, that we need to protect and control the environment for our brown southern <snip>. Kinda like making sure you don't let black males spend any time around white women, since you know, they are incapable of controlling their African rape-genes.
Yeah, that's exactly what I said.

Well paraphrased. Or should I say distilled?

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I myself think it's way, way, over-sensitive and really ridiculous to be offended by something as tacky and distasteful as a t-shirt with an American flag.
Here's my point, though. If you were in a context where you know a tacky and distasteful T-shirt was a good indicator that you maybe subjected to violence, you wouldn't think it oversensitive to react to it, no matter how tacky and distasteful.

Farm Boy said:
So, why is this specific day different? Why would use of either get a pass on any day, much less some asinine principle where one is appropriate on some days and the other on other days?
Probably a day when tensions are already running high. It's a holiday, so already people are inclined to ignore the normal rules of behavior (which to an extent is what a holiday is) and you know, it's a Mexican nationalist holiday. That seems to have provoked a semi-organized push-back from the "nativist" students on that day. Hopefully, everyone comes back the sixth feeling a little more reasonable and the school can operate under normal conditions.
 
Here's my point, though. If you were in a context where you know a tacky and distasteful T-shirt was a good indicator that you maybe subjected to violence, you wouldn't think it oversensitive to react to it, no matter how tacky and distasteful.
That was what I was tunneling at with my following sentence.
 
Yeah, that's exactly what I said.

Well paraphrased. Or should I say distilled?

I know you didn't say that Ziggs, and your approach is reasonable. Those words were my statement. One I was hoping would capture how tremendously depressing it is to me that this could actually be the reasonable solution. Since our kids are inclined to be, and probably are, so uncontrollably and violently stupid in this instance. They learned it somewhere.
 
I know you didn't say that Ziggs, and your approach is reasonable. Those words were my statement. One I was hoping would capture how tremendously depressing it is to me that this could actually be the reasonable solution. Since our kids are inclined to be, and probably are, so uncontrollably and violently stupid in this instance. They learned it somewhere.
Kids are unreasonable, stupid, temperamental, and more. As were we. And what a great time it was.

And then sometimes they/we grow up. Ever watch the crowd at a football match? Or better yet, have you read some of the threads here? It's not just kids. And it's not always about race. To be fair, the same characteristics cause us to make great art, to be madly in love, to have passion for a hobby.
 
Not officially. Not in America. It's a Mexican holiday, not an American holiday. And it's not even a cultural one like Thanksgiving or St Patrick's Day or Day of the Dead. It's a holiday celebrating a very specific event. That of Mexican forces prevailing over French forces. Again, it makes as much sense for that to be celebrated in America as it does for Sri Lanka to celebrate November 10th, 1775 (birth of the U.S.M.C.)

That said, I've no objection to ex-pats from Mexico celebrating it. More power to them. What I do object to is any celebration of this clearly Mexican national holiday resulting in Americans having to be afraid of displaying the FLAG THAT REPRESENTS THE NATION THEY LIVE IN for fear of persecution.

So again, I ask if students at this school are allowed to wear shirts depicting the US flag on any other day of the school year. If they are not, fine and dandy. That's just school policy and I'm not inclined to gripe about that. If they are, and they were just persecuted on this one day because someone wanting to celebrate a foreign national holiday might be offended by it, well that's just not right.

Bolding things makes them more relevant.
 
Yes it is. This isn't even a subject of political disagreement. Cinco de Mayo is a holiday that occurs on the 5th of May.
It isn't a holiday in the US at all. Why would this incident have occurred during school hours or would able to conduct banking on those days if it were a holiday?
 
That said, I've no objection to ex-pats from Mexico celebrating it. More power to them. What I do object to is any celebration of this clearly Mexican national holiday resulting in Americans having to be afraid of displaying the FLAG THAT REPRESENTS THE NATION THEY LIVE IN for fear of persecution.
I'm sorry I've been dismissive. I wasn't aware you were afraid and feared of persecution.

People should not live in fear.
 
Not officially. Not in America. It's a Mexican holiday, not an American holiday.
If it's a Mexican holiday it's still a holiday. Saying it's "not a holiday" just makes the whole matter confusing. If it's not a holiday how can it be Mexican :crazyeye:

So again, I ask if students at this school are allowed to wear shirts depicting the US flag on any other day of the school year. If they are not, fine and dandy. That's just school policy and I'm not inclined to gripe about that. If they are, and they were just persecuted on this one day because someone wanting to celebrate a foreign national holiday might be offended by it, well that's just not right.
See that's where I disagree with you. Because by the article, and what Owen says, this isn't about some abstract school policy. This is about these students, in this school, were using it as a symbol to escalate gang/ethnic violence, exploiting a day when tensions were running high.

This isn't about what Cinco De Mayo means, or what the American Flag Means in some transcultural perspective. It's about what these kids were using the American Flag for, in this particular context.

As people have pointed out, the school didn't take down their own American flags, so it's not about that.
 
And what a great time it was.

That is subject to debate. I, for one, absolutely loathed much of those parts of being a child.

To be fair, the same characteristics cause us to make great art, to be madly in love, to have passion for a hobby.

Any tertiary benefit to "art," infatuation, or hobbies is not worth that type of idiocy. We'd be better off without it.
 
Perhaps we're talking different types of childlike idiocy? Wonderment is amazing. To dream is amazing. The ape-like testoserone fueled crap that drives people to form gangs or watch football(either type) or fight wars can die the ignoble death it deserves. Maybe I'd muster up some good old fashioned sports-like cheer for that one.
 
Perhaps we're talking different types of childlike idiocy? Wonderment is amazing. To dream is amazing. The ape-like testoserone fueled crap that drives people to form gangs or watch football(either type) or fight wars can die the ignoble death it deserves. Maybe I'd muster up some good old fashioned sports-like cheer for that one.
Maybe we should be talking about moderation. Support your club, but don't punch the guy supporting the other one. Dream, but don't get lost in them. Be passionate about something, not obsessed Be irritated that on the day you're celebrating your independence someone wants to be a jerk, but don't act on it. Be irritated that people who live in a country are celebrating the independence of another country, but don't act on it.
 
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