1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Call me completely crazy BUT: I think I nailed Celts as viable Civ

Discussion in 'Rhye's and Fall - Dawn of Civilization' started by Pavel Chichikov, Apr 23, 2014.

  1. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

    Joined:
    May 26, 2012
    Messages:
    657
    Okay I'm sure this has been asked about & debated a billion times before but I genuinely think I've gotten onto making it feasible.


    Here's my outline:

    - Spawn date 900 BC, 2 Settlers in Gaul, 1 independent city in Gaul and Northern Italy.
    - Spawn DoW with Greece, Rome & Vikings, weak tech/military. Only possible friend civ is Carthage, again historical and potentially fun.
    - Make a couple of European resources in the area spawn later too keep things balanced.

    UHV: The Power of Migration
    - Settle England, Wales, Scotland & Ireland by 1 AD
    - Build a Christian Cathedral by 850 AD
    - Conquer 5 European Cities (Important: this doesn't mean control)

    Unique Power

    - No Stability Penalty for losing a City (capitals still concur major penalty) [lame but necessary like Poland]
    - Alternatively: Free Flanking Promotion for all Units.

    Stability map
    - Core: Brettony, Ireland, Wales
    - Historical: Rest of France, England, Scotland
    - Contested: N.Italy, NE. Spain
    ________________________________________________________________

    - So the gameplan idea is that like Phoenicia in the Levant; the Celts would be born to lose in Gaul. The idea of them to spawn there is to give a race against time to settle the British isles before the Romans destroy them. Like Phoenicia with Carthage, the AI would probably need to get an auto-spawn London. This would also give AI Romans a chance to control Britain, & the human a challenge instead of un-historically settling it.

    - Throw in some Pictish barbarians to make it a challenge. (Picts weren't Celts & possibly didn't even speak a Indo-European language.)

    - Building a Christian cathedral requires control of at least 4 cities, they could be in Ireland, Scotland, Wales and Brettony. Despite all the modern pagan romanticization, Celts had the most vibrant Christian culture of Europe after the Romans collapsed.
    Again, I think this goal is timed well to make it very challenging but possible.

    - The Conquer cities goal gives the human player a fun non-timed but still challenging goal.

    ________________________________________________________________

    - Vikings and Pict barbarians keep up pressure during the dark ages. Swarms of barbs in Europe prevent Celts re-settling the mainland.

    - Later England spawn with a large stack outside London (whether Roman, indie or Celt), but no settlers.

    ________________________________________________________________
     
  2. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,199
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Indonesia
    Where should their capital be?
     
  3. Sanguivorant

    Sanguivorant Submitter

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,375
    Location:
    Calgary, Canada
    What five cities did they conquer in actual history?
     
  4. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

    Joined:
    May 26, 2012
    Messages:
    657
    - The starting capital would be Aquitane or possibly where Paris spawns, I think. But a human player who wanted to live would have to rebuild a palace in the Isles later.

    - They conquered, sacked & abandoned Rome & Delphi. A large tribe of marauding Celts somehow ended up in Anatolia and conquered Galatia from the Phrygians, Greeks or Lydians. They were also the major part of Hannibal's army that conquered Spain and Southern Italy. The Irish conquered Scotland from the indigenous Picts and the Britons fled from the Anglo-Saxons to retake Brettony, France.

    The no penalty allows the Celts to conquer cities, break everything in them, and then just abandon them again. I thought about simply razing, but I think this would be more interesting gameplay-wise.
    So the play can think over whether to just raze it and take a hefty penalty, or leave it to be retaken and get the extra stability from combat. This UP is fun because it allows the player to take much bigger risks with raiding but isn't OP because it's only a passive power.
    (to prevent abuse for empire building, could make it expire at the end of the Classical era)
     
  5. brett0007

    brett0007 Warlord

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2012
    Messages:
    132
    Location:
    somewhere
    Picts at the very least linguistically and culturally Celtic from 400 ad onward. From northern Scottish place names and a few personal names of Picts/Cealdonians recorded in Latin and Gaelic and a written record of the names of some of Pictish kingdoms. Pictish was definitely a P Celtic language related to Welsh and Cumbric.

    I don't object to them being barbs but they were most definitely Celtic.

    Wouldn't this require the English spawn pushing forward to stop the Celts from un-historically controlling England up until the current English spawn, not to mention a complete revamp of the British isles to stop London being choked by a city in Wales?

    Other than that I can't wait to reconquer Prydain and Gâl from the Sacsons and Ffrangeg!
     
  6. citis

    citis Deity

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2011
    Messages:
    2,480
    It could be like:

    UP: the power of druids
    forests produce culture

    Core area: Ireland
    Histrorical: France, England

    They will spawn in France. This is strange, but it will be an unstable civ all the time, which is right. Human will found a city in Ireland to survive. Dublinn will be autosettled for the AI to represent Ireland in later game. Vikings spawn at war with them.

    They should start knowing only farming, mysticism, wheel, pottery (animal husbandry is the first tech they should discover). Gallic warrior is enabled by animal husbandry.
     
  7. merijn_v1

    merijn_v1 Black Belt

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2008
    Messages:
    5,726
    Location:
    The city of the original vlaai
    But what will happen if France or England spawns and the Celts are still alive. I think that could lead to tons of problems. You can script a few thing to manage this a bit, but too much scripting is no fun.
     
  8. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,199
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Indonesia
    Brest should be excluded from French Core Area. Just like Ireland is outside England.
    When France and England spawn, well.... Ireland and Brittany is still culturally a Celtic nation to date :)

    The idea of Celts contesting Roman domination sounds fun. Ancient Europe could have more attention, and the ancient world lacks the color Green (which I associate with Celts somehow)
    Moreover, the Roman game itself could be more lively, with an active AI Celts with all their AI intelligence... compared to what is scripted here and there right now.
     
  9. soul-breathing

    soul-breathing King

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2011
    Messages:
    983
    Location:
    Hangzhou,China PR
    I think it's not a bad idea, and the respawn could be Republic of Ireland
     
  10. Tomorrow's Dawn

    Tomorrow's Dawn Heroes Never Die

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2009
    Messages:
    3,618
    Location:
    SF Bay Area
    lol. I see all someone changed their mind about Celts:

    Anyways, Celts should start even earlier, 1200 BC.
    They should NOT start in France.
    However, there are few references to named Celtic settlements.
    The closest we can get that would also be good for the setting is an anachronistic start in Vindobona (Vienna).

    Celtic migrations into Greece and Asia Minor:


    and to answer some questions,
    I think people are forgetting the Celts were contemporaries of the Greeks before their famous clashes with the Romans:

    Troy, Miletos, Ephesos, Rome, Londinium.
    Sack of Delphi is a myth.

    http://historum.com/ancient-history/22133-galatia-celtic-state-ancient-turkey.html

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boudica

    http://books.google.com/books?id=6o...0CDMQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=galatea celts&f=false

    We can always steal the stablity map from RFC Civs in Abundance, but otherwise:

    Core: Ireland.
    Historical: Illyria, Central Europe.
    Contested: Britain, France, Iberia, Western Turkey.
     
  11. Rorgloin

    Rorgloin Warlord

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2013
    Messages:
    132
    I like this idea. It could also provide a more realistic starting situation for Rome with the Celts owning Cisalpine Gaul (Milan basically)-- the Romans didn't even consider that part of Italy for a while once they had conquered it, which makes the current flip seem wrong.
     
  12. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,199
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Indonesia
    Flip system would have a re-design in the next version, if I remember correctly.

    I would use Central Europe as the Core area instead, which was known as Halstatt at that time (Yellow)
     
  13. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

    Joined:
    May 26, 2012
    Messages:
    657
    Ireland respawn? I guess. Can't see how it could be fun for a human though.

     
  14. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    33,735
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Leblanc
    :rolleyes:
     
  15. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,199
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Indonesia
    Maya is more interesting now. Have you played the redesign? There's Zapotec now.
     
  16. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

    Joined:
    May 26, 2012
    Messages:
    657

    Some people just can't be pleased, I know. :mischief:

    I didn't notice the Maya redesign? I'll check it out when work gives me some time..
     
  17. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    33,735
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Leblanc
    I'm just tired of hearing that. Even if A is objectively superior to B, it doesn't mean that the inclusion of B obligates me to include A.
     
  18. ales_

    ales_ Heir

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2012
    Messages:
    5,639
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Toulouse, France
    What do you think about this idea?
     
  19. BenZL43

    BenZL43 awkward cat

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,199
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Indonesia
    By the way, I think we should really focus on Polynesia first.. else we won't have new civilization at all -_-
     
  20. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    33,735
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Leblanc
    I have no opinion so far.
     

Share This Page