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Can Anyone Provide A List Of Common Historical Administrative Offices? Europe/Roman

Discussion in 'World History' started by AltarofScience, Nov 29, 2016.

  1. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    As part of my current game development project I am designing a system of province/population integration to replace the kind of stuff seen in 4X or Grand Strategy games.

    Part of that involves a sort of caste/bureaucracy system. Essentially a population's happiness and opinion of provincial and nations leaders is based in part on their integration into civil life, specifically their appointments to civil administrative offices.

    I am attempting to compile a list of such offices, and I suppose religious and military offices as well. Obviously a good supply of military combat ranks and religious ritual offices exists but I've yet to locate a source of good administrative titles/offices.

    There will be a couple tiers of offices and per my goal of sort of time based acceptance culture/politics/religion other populations with disparate characteristics will slowly become more accepting of such appointments over time. The benefits derived from appointed populations are of course immediate.

    The goal is to create a balance of equality and integration verses hierarchy and subjugation as part of a functioning system of internal politics to more effectively simulate the limitations of empire.

    This is also tied strongly into the propaganda system and such integrations can be reversed as well.

    Seeing as this is the world history forum for a massive civilization fan site I figured I'd be able to find plenty of people educated on the topic of historical administration.

    I'm aware of things like chanceries, bailiffs and reeves, scribes/notaries/clerks, etc but I'd like to broaden that out a bit.
     
  2. schlaufuchs

    schlaufuchs La Femme Moderne

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  3. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    Yeah I've seen that, but its only a few offices with obviously roman names. I was more wondering if anyone had any knowledge beyond what can be found in a wikipedia article. I can use Google just fine.
     
  4. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    I'm afraid you'll have to do a proper search. You can try that online, of course, but some advice from a professional might put you in the right direction. I'd visit the nearest academic history department (again, you can try this online). 'Cursus honorum' is a step in the right direction, but only covers the Roman period. 'Court' might be search term, but for instance in ancient Egypt scribes and priests, as well as the military could be a start for a public career. Unfortunately such things tend to differ per region, so I doubt a general work on this exists. There may be articles though.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2016
  5. schlaufuchs

    schlaufuchs La Femme Moderne

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    If you want a more specific answer you're going to have to give a more specific query. "Can you give me some office titles from Europe and Rome for game because *vague reasons*" doesn't really give me anything to work with. What sort of offices? From what time period? In what sort of way? Remember that offices and office hierarchy seldom sprung, fully formed from day one (à la the US), but instead usually developed organically as the land and responsibilities of a ruler or ruling class expanded. For example: King has to formulate legal documents. King has lots of other responsibilities and doesn't have time to sit down and compose and sign off on all these documents. King creates the Office of the Chancery to do this for him, and delegates to the Lord Chancellor the legal power to bestow the great seal on documents, i.e. to authorize them in his name. Kings rarely cede or delegate power willingly. Usually there is some demand (time, distance, money) that requires them to cede authority.
     
  6. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    Late Antiquity to the Middle Ages, civil administrative, religious administrative, military administrative.
     
  7. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    Any specific area or just 'worldwide'?

    Administrative office seems rather clear to me. The problem is such offices vary widely over time and place.
     
  8. Flying Pig

    Flying Pig Utrinque Paratus Retired Moderator

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    Are you trying to find something that works across different countries and cultures (presumably within the post-Roman world)? If so, you may run into difficulty. A 'prince' in Wales in 1280 was a different beast to a 'prince' there in 1302, to say nothing of the difference between the princeps of the Late Roman Empire versus the princeps of any number of tiny German statelets. In 1596, the Prince of Wales was the subject of a monarch and the head of no state, while the Prince of Lichtenstein was a monarch and a head of state in his own right. In 1500, the Duke of York was a relatively minor English noble, while the Duke of Moscow was the head of a major European power.
     
  9. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    A specific title with specific duties isn't really necessary if that's a sticking point. This isn't a historical game or anything. Stuff like scribe/notary/clerk/etc would work. Like the Romans had a public works director essentially and a public entertainment director. Europe had castellans which were not feudal vassals but had a decent amount of authority over a castle.
     
  10. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    Well, sort of. But for instance England had shire-reeves (sheriffs), a term which is exclusive to England, as you won't find any shires elsewhere. France had 'parlements', which were more like courts of law. So ti might be useful to limit the search somewhat, as it really is a massive subject.
     
  11. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    Shire reeves/sheriffs are pretty much like the Saxon term for the Norman/Continental bailiff. So I'd go with bailiff over reeve. Parlements are basically composed of magistrates, in this case high magistrates as they were the court of final appeal.
     
  12. Agent327

    Agent327 Observer

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    OK. So do you want to limit the search to Western Europe or cover the whole of Europe?
     
  13. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    Rome, Byzantium, Greece, Carthage, and Western and Eastern Europe are all fine.
     
  14. Flying Pig

    Flying Pig Utrinque Paratus Retired Moderator

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    'Greece' is going to make your life difficult - Classical Greece didn't really have 'bureaucracy' (even the Athenian public records are a bit fast-and-loose, put mildly, and suggest that people cared more about the fact that official business was put into writing than what that writing actually said) as we'd understand it, nor really any sense of 'government' as something with a structure linking the centre with 'the provinces' - which no Greek state had, with the possible exception of Sparta, which as far as we know had an essentially nonexistent state beyond the legal system and the army. You could probably pick one of the Hellenistic systems, but then you'll soon hit the very vague Roman systems, where local and imperial systems only vaguely joined up. Then you get the Byzantine period, and - well, there's a reason why the word 'Byzantine' means what it does.

    I mean, if you just want Greek words for believable in-game offices, you could do worse than calling your generals 'strategoi (singular strategos)', your city-governors 'archontes' (singular archon)', your provincial governors 'episkopoi' (sing. episkopos), and your overall ruler the 'basileus'. Those would translate roughly into Latin as 'duces (dux)', 'praefecti (praefectus)', 'proconsules (proconsul)' and 'imperator'. However, you'd be doing that on the understanding that you're no longer doing history once you try to simplify how government actually worked, even in any given 'country' at any given moment, into a neat hierarchy. The Romans tried it, incidentally, and came up with this monstrosity, and even that is better thought of as a work of propaganda than a useful guide to the imperial government.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2016
  15. AltarofScience

    AltarofScience The Brain

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    Actually that would be pretty useful if I could find a version that was annotated a bit to provide a description and/or translation of each title.

    Which I just did through Google. Cool beans.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2016
  16. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

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    There was also the "strategos autokrator", ie a strategos (military ruler) who was (usually by voting of some council) granted total power for a brief period of time to act without having to consult with political rulers. Autokrator just means wielding power by oneself. The term later was used for Emperor, cause that was the only rank which would do that in the byzantine system, that tended to invent new offices as intermediates between the real emperor and those ceremoniously named in power as first-ranking non-emperor, eg Sebastokrator, Protosebastos, and the cooler Panyperprotopansebastohypertatos- he still was just below the actual emperor :D
     
  17. JohannaK

    JohannaK Heroically Clueless

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    I heard about Megadukes, and that sounds funny.
     

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