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Can somebody explain how you read the culture victory screen?

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Archaelicos, Nov 9, 2016.

  1. Archaelicos

    Archaelicos Warlord

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    It doesn't make any sense to me. What are the numbers under "Visiting Tourists?" Why is the denominator in the same for all of these except me? Why is my # of tourists always exactly 1 less than the denominator for all the rest?
     
  2. Heklios

    Heklios Chieftain

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    The description for the Culture Victory is indeed hidious. Yet the requirements are quite simple. Lemme try to rephrase it simply:

    CULTURE generates DOMESTIC tourists from your own population.
    TOURISM generates VISITING tourists from your opponents' population.

    Once you draw to your land more VISITING tourists than any other opponents has DOMESTIC tourists, you win.

    Practical Example :
    - If your culture generates 100 Domestic Tourists, and nobody else has more Domestic Tourists than that, then an opponent must draw at least 101 Visiting Tourists to win.
    - For you to win the game, you must draw more Visiting Tourists than the highest Domestic Tourists value an opponent may have. So if you play against 3 AIs, they have respectively 90, 100, 110 Domestic Tourists, you must reach 111 Visiting Tourists to win the game.

    Final note : the values displayed in the middle row simply represent the breakdown of where your Visiting Tourists are coming from. They will add up to your Total Visiting Tourists count (ex: 30 Visiting Tourists = 10 Japanese + 10 American + 10 French).
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2016
  3. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

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    For the last question, it means that out of everyone you have discovered, you currently have the most domestic tourists.
     
  4. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Domestic tourists does not seem to be purely down to culture.
    I tried on all levels and it just does not gel that way.
    There is definitely a modifier for level, I am quite sure of that.
    I also think amenities count. it does hint to domestic tourists being happy.
    As does tourism itself. So getting relics/tourism seems to but its just the numbers are weird.

    I do not even know if prince is a 0 modifier anymore. Does anyone know what level all are equal on?
     
  5. Doviello

    Doviello Warlord

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    There are modifiers, like policies that give you "+50% tourism from civs you have a trade route with"m which is kinda how it worked on civ 5. So the power of your tourism value to attract visitors is different in each civ you met, i really wish the game was more transparent on this point. In Civ 5, i knew what i had to do to stop (or slow down) someone`s culture victory: close borders, stop trade routes, denounce, declare war, pick a different ideology, invest in tourism myself, etc. But in civ 6 i really don't know what im doing, and culture victory (or defeat) always seem to come out of nonwhere.
     
  6. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    This domestic tourism thing is annoying so I am looking into it. I just did this game below on settler with a single city.

    I just bought a monument and nothing else culture / amenity wise and just made the city grow and took note of the stats on each turn.
    At turn 100 I had lot of gold so bought settlers to reduce population to see effect
    At turn 103 I got a great general with a great work of art - more a being bored mistake.
    So it seems population has some significant effect as well as culture.
    It seems also at this stage like domestic tourism just grows indicating some accumulation or it could be a delayed drop I did not catch as it seems to be delayed or accumulated growth.
    It also seemed like being unhappy slowed this growth.

    One vaguely interesting thing was that the city had more culture at a population of 6 (4.8) than 7 (4.7) due to lack of amenities.That lack of amenity does dampen your cities output in lots of things.

    This is just purely a scientific approach to seeing what affects it how so please feel free to disagree with my conclusion.

    upload_2016-11-12_13-23-56.png
     
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  7. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    The graph makes sense for
    Accumulated culture=> domestic tourism....but it seems off slightly
    1-2 and 2-3 seem to be too fast...
    did you have an exploring warrior that got a lump sum of culture from tribal villages?
    Maybe actual civic count influences it.
    Or possibly there is some unusual rounding effect.
     
  8. Miravlix

    Miravlix King

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    That is because it's you, you don't beat yourself, so the number to beat for the AI's includes your values, but the value you need to beat is without yourself.
     
  9. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    So I have a saved start including the rain forest natural wonder which I avoid as well as goody huts and the culture Civs.
    I just did another one, will graph it and look at the cumulative, I remember someone saying 100 culture is a tourist but I did not think they were talking domestic.
     
  10. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    This was from an attempt where I ended up with 4 cities, I built 0 culture buildings and got 0 culture from anywhere else including goody huts, just purely from population * palace culture * amenity bonus.
    upload_2016-11-12_18-45-20.png
    It is damn close but does not fit 100%, nor does round down or up. There was the odd turn where it did not seem to update correctly and TBH it seems a pretty good match/
    I did have a holy relic in turn 6. The 8 tourism and the faith seem not to help.
    I guess its close enough to call as a fairly close thing... I guess it needs more testing with different variation. I guess I could build non eureka civics only.
    The times of classic and medieval did not seem to alter it either.
     
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  11. Xger

    Xger Prince

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    I believe it depends on map size (or number of civs). On a small map, 900 tourism with another generates one visiting tourist. It should be 100 culture generated across the empire means 1 domestic tourist.

    If you want a lot more specifics, look here. The gauntlet is culture, so people figured out what it all means, and I may not be describing it accurately. Turn 110 culture wins are doable with a lot of luck.
     
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  12. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Thats great xger TX! I have something to work with and lots more... A lot of threads have bit and this is the most useful and likely a source for a lot of the others.

    I say I have something to work with because its not 100% clear. It seems there is a 100 cum culture per domestic tourist as a base in globalparameters.xml but on settler it was roughly 50. So there is a difficulty modifier, or maybe its map size (I was playing standard) but I think its more likely a difficulty, makes more sense.

    Also there does seem to be these big jumps (turn 73 of above graph) but it settled itself out like some self resolving bug in the math.

    The turn 110/107 victory with relieous is just one strat. I was thinking more of getting a full detailed "how to" guide with all the strats and problems faced.

    The trouble is real life gets in the way as I have family and commitments :(... damn real life. I need a time modification civic I can put in my spouse slot.
     
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  13. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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  14. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I have been reading a lot of threads on this, mostly old.
    One thing that seems to be making sense to me now that they have missed is this difficulty modifier.
    I have scanned the xml files and cannot find one.
    However as we know the global parameters show TOURISM_CULTURE_PER_CITIZEN = 100 and on settler I am getting TOURISM_CULTURE_PER_CITIZEN = 50 I am going to make the assumption that

    Prince is 0 Modifier from base
    Settler is a 50% modifier
    Diety is 150% or 200% modifier from base

    I'll also post a question on this and test it now with a prince game... maybe this is an easy way to work out the difficulty modifier as it seems to only be reliant on cumulative culture.

    (anyone else feel free to join in and help with this, I am limited in testing time and do not know how to auto run through collecting values.
     
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  15. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I tried this on cheftain, IF it is linked directly and only to culture it does not seem to quite match but is somewhere around the 60-65% if it does. The trouble is I found out something really weird.
    On turn 65 my domestic tourism suddenly jumped like it has before and others have seen. I restored to turn 56 and found that if I got the Feudalism Eureka I jumped 2 DT (maybe it was a bonus of culture) If I did not plough that 6th farm I did not get it.
    So what the test has shown is there is some very weird stuff going on and also that there is a modifier making the Domestic Tourism different from settler to cheftain.
    The test was on continents and a standard speed standard size game at cheftain level. I did have Pericles next to me. No goody hut gave me anything and neither CS was culture bound. The 3 spikes in culture were down to 3 monuments being built.
    I'll see if I can find time to run a warlord one tomorrow and see if the feudalism hit happens again, I suspect so as he previous graph in this post also shows the jump at around turn 75.
    I am also fairly certain that neither tourism nor faith affects this figure.
    Another possible cause is I often do not correct close the culture victory screen between moves and perhaps that refresh is not that good.

    upload_2016-11-14_0-53-21.png
     
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  16. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Am working ATM but just had a thought on the Feudalism civic boost that would answer the oddity.

    When you get a Civic boost perhaps you get that amount of culture added to your cumulative culture?
    It would be a neat answer and also perhaps answer why my graphs do not quite match up.
    Will give it a try when I can.
     
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  17. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    This makes more sense now and the graph is showing culture very close to tourism
    So my theory of difficulty levels being a modifier is wrong.
    Its damn close to cumulative culture divided by 100 but cumulative culture also includes the eureka culture. In the game below I had to clear a barbarian outpost which boosts military tradition (worth 50 Culture) so I added the eureka boost of 25 culture to the graph and it is very close.
    Maybe there are other culture modifiers or I just missed a turn of manually writing this down.
    I guess tonight I will try and do one on settler again making note of the eureka costs.

    upload_2016-11-14_12-38-23.png
     
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  18. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    Really good info, there are a number of civic boosts that would occur with minimal player involvement (6 pop)
     
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  19. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Good point KrikkitTwo
    I avoided all cultural ones apart from killing a barb nest. I researched the 6 pop one before I got to 6 pop for instance.
    However I did not factor in that I was China! This meant the bonus I got was a 60% boost, not 50. An additional 5 culture
    Adjusting the above graph there is a slight difference at turn 75 that could well be down to me messing up what I was writing down.
    This graph is way too close to discard

    I did enter the classical age at turn 60, built hanging gardens at turn 68 and a theater district at turn 81 but none of that adds culture. I have also used Faith in other games which also seems not to affect it.

    upload_2016-11-14_15-18-1.png
     
  20. sonicmyst

    sonicmyst Emperor

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    You also need to factor in tourism the shared religions, trade routes, and open borders. I also think holy cites contribute to tourism.
     

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