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Can the AI start plotting on you while you have a peace treaty?

Pengu

Prince
Joined
Apr 9, 2011
Messages
460
So I am in a game with Spain and Korea on either side of me. I played nice and both liked me. Wang sent his missionaries so I went with his religion. Izzy dropped down to catious and made a demand. I gave her what she
wanted and it created a 10 turn peace treaty. Then 6 turns into that treaty she started plotting and has a big stack in her city outside my border.
I now don't know if she will attack me so I have to build up an army. Did she start plotting on me even while in a peace treaty?
 
As far as I recall an AI cannot start randomly plotting war on you while you have a peace treaty - the game basically doesn't see you as a valid target during the war calculations. An AI may be able to start plotting war on you during a peace treaty if you refuse a demand, I'm not sure, but if it can it cannot declare such a war while the peace treaty is still ongoing.
 
It cannot START to plot ON YOU.

It can:
-start plotting on you BEFORE a treaty is in force and stay plotting until it ends, then DoW (only if it could possibly DoW someone else in the meantime)
-start plotting on another valid target AFTER a treaty is already in force, then switch targets to you after until it ends, then DoW.

and btw, Peace Treaties outside the forced 10turns are not enforceable for blocking DoWs. The AI just sometimes refuses to cancel them immediately after 10 turns, but it still can at any point after the enforcement period.

Both scenarios are pretty common, the latter case especially with warmongering AIs with lots of punching bags on the map to choose from. And Izzy counts since she'll behave this way toward anyone that's an infidel to her religion.

An AI may be able to start plotting war on you during a peace treaty if you refuse a demand, I'm not sure
Nah. It can however start plotting over a refused demand even if it's already at war with another target, which normally locks out all other war plotting. It can't ever start to plot wars on targets it already has a (10t forced) treaty with, they're never on the list of valid targets and they can't violate any treaty during the 10 turn lockout except through exceptional means like Vassaling or AP holy war.

It can, in some very rare and hard to reproduce cases, persecute a war it has been plotting before a peace treaty is up even during a 10 turn enforcement window. This comes from layering peace treaties -- if the AI can break one of the "expired" treaties that's outside that particular treaty's 10 turn enforcement window (because you gained that treaty when the AI was already plotting on you, and it waited you out, and then you say, beg something a few turns after that initial 10 turn enforcement window), it can break ALL peace treaties you have with it and DoW you.

I've had it happen twice in the 8 years or so I've played this game, no surprise that one of them was Monty being Monty. This also could've only happened because I wasn't isolated with him -- he has to continue to plot through the first enforcement window, meaning he has to have another valid target to think about and ultimately ignore. Given that it seemed to be due to having an ongoing peace treaty that was never cancelled willfully at the same time, my take away is to make sure you cancel them yourself just to ensure the AI can't accidentally do this to you.



The AI tends to keep its stack close to home (even in the actual capitol) unless it is planning to hit a target. Them moving it around in general is a red flag for war though it's not always obvious against who as the determination for who to hit has nothing to do with where any of its units are, and it can change its mind mid-plot...(DoW only requires having a free unit to cross the enemy border, not their stack with Attack package in particular).

If you are not using BUG mod already I'd recommend it as it helps you more immediately identify this behavior by showing red fists on the scoreboard instantly when the AI goes WHEOORN mode so you can surmise when the AI may have been eligible to plot on you and thus whether you are at reasonable threat -- for instance, if you had denied Izzy's demand and she immediately goes red fist, that's 100% her plotting on you.



In any case, you are mostly safe from Izzy -- giving her what she demanded while she was NOT already plotting ensured the treaty was in place before she started plotting 6 turns later, so she can't be plotting on you. Just continue to be cautious though, as she can still swap her target to you AFTER that treaty is up, if she continues to plot and doesn't enter a war by then!
 
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