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Cavaleiros Embassy & Intelligence

Discussion in 'Team Kazakhstan' started by Provolution, Jan 14, 2009.

  1. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd Rest in Peace Black Panther

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    :)OK Bolko, fair enough...

    I should have said:

    Instead of:

    Better?
     
  2. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    Unconquered Sun from Cav send me a message...in spoiler with my reply

    Spoiler :
    Thanks US,
    Niklas has told Donsig as well, we do realize sending axes is not an option.

    The open borders agreement is baffling indeed, as is their insistence on puting their espionaze points on us.

    BTW, we have not heard from you regarding military help in the war with Sancta. Is it something you feel is pointless at this stage?
     
  3. Kaleb

    Kaleb Deity

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    Thing is though do SANCTA have a visible route to MS? if so then they aren't benefiting from having from having OB with MS. I don't know if Sat or SANCTA have any trade back from MS.
     
  4. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    Hmm, do they not? I thought they had a boat scouting that way.
     
  5. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

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    I had a chat with Niklas about another game and took the opportunity to discuss Kaz/Cav relations for a few minutes. Here's the chat log:
    Spoiler :

    dinascosto7 (6:47:28 PM): Kaz has still not been able to come up with an official reply to Cav's treaty proposaldinascosto7 (6:47:46 PM): we haven't forgotten the proposal we just can't agree on anything as a team
    dinascosto7 (6:48:06 PM): also the SANCTA war distracts us from the proposal a bit
    "Niklas" (6:48:22 PM): Cav is rather low-staffed atm, with several prominent members on holidays
    dinascosto7 (6:48:38 PM): ko
    "Niklas" (6:49:00 PM): hopefully it should be better in a few weeks' time
    dinascosto7 (6:49:27 PM): what my team would really like to know is what (if any) help Cav can give us against SANCTA
    dinascosto7 (6:49:57 PM): We sent and admittedly short and curt message asking for military aid and we never got a reply
    "Niklas" (6:50:04 PM): oh - right
    dinascosto7 (6:50:18 PM): I thik it would help matters if your team clarified the status of our alliance
    dinascosto7 (6:50:45 PM): some of us are wondering what happned to the idea of putting the alliance first
    "Niklas" (6:51:09 PM): well, we would definitely not mind sending troops to your aid, the only question is whether they would be useful, since they would take so long to get there
    "Niklas" (6:51:28 PM): and the other issue is of course *what* troops to send, since we're both pretty much holding out for maces at the moment
    dinascosto7 (6:51:54 PM): ok - well hopefully when we have paper we'll have better maps
    "Niklas" (6:52:10 PM): speaking of which, we have a proposal in our team to send you money so you can get to machinery faster, if your research speed would be helped by that
    dinascosto7 (6:52:31 PM): I'll be posting this chat log and will be sure to bring that up
    "Niklas" (6:52:36 PM): if we don't do that, we can have paper in 9 turns iirc, but it's somewhat less priority
    dinascosto7 (6:53:07 PM): I can't tell if gold would help us shave turns or not but others on the team will figure that out and I'm sure Kaleb will let you know
    "Niklas" (6:53:15 PM): great
    dinascosto7 (6:53:20 PM): btw, I have resigned as foreign minister
    "Niklas" (6:53:35 PM): who's the new one then?
    dinascosto7 (6:53:35 PM): I will be active but not as foreign minister
    dinascosto7 (6:53:42 PM): we don't have one
    dinascosto7 (6:54:18 PM): we seem to be sliding back to individual members doing ad hoc chats with other teams and I resigned in protest knowing the trouble that sort of thing causes
    "Niklas" (6:54:31 PM): heh, alright
    "Niklas" (6:54:54 PM): that's what our team has been doing all along, since we really can't seem to do the concerted effort to be more organized...
    "Niklas" (6:55:16 PM): every team ought to have a General_W...
    dinascosto7 (6:55:23 PM): true
    dinascosto7 (6:55:51 PM): our trouble is we do not agree on much as a team and these individuals talk their own thoughts
    dinascosto7 (6:56:26 PM): and that can easily give the team the impression that is how the whole team feels, especially when they hear nothing else from the team
    "Niklas" (6:56:37 PM): I take it you mean Kaleb, since I'm not aware that we have spoken to anyone else
    dinascosto7 (6:56:45 PM): no, not Kaleb
    dinascosto7 (6:56:58 PM): and the teams being talked to are Saturn and SANCTA
    dinascosto7 (6:57:08 PM): which makes things even more divisive for us
    "Niklas" (6:57:11 PM): ah, I see, talking to the enemy is of course a worse problem
    dinascosto7 (6:57:16 PM): yes
    dinascosto7 (6:57:20 PM): last itme
    dinascosto7 (6:57:24 PM): last item
    dinascosto7 (6:57:48 PM): we need to know how your team feels about including Saturn in our alliance
    "Niklas" (6:58:39 PM): do we think that possibility still exists?
    dinascosto7 (6:58:50 PM): some in Kazakhstan do
    dinascosto7 (6:59:00 PM): but some also wonder if Saturn can be trusted
    "Niklas" (6:59:09 PM): I think we would be positive in general, but yes, that worry is definitely there
    "Niklas" (6:59:18 PM): especially after your botched trade
    dinascosto7 (6:59:20 PM): I can see about forwarding to Cav the notes we rec'd from Saturn
    "Niklas" (6:59:30 PM): ok
    "Niklas" (6:59:37 PM): we've had precious little communication with them
    "Niklas" (7:00:34 PM): at any rate, if your team wants some assurances about our general stance in the conflict, know that we have pretty much refused to say anything at all to SANCTA of late
    "Niklas" (7:01:06 PM): they are clearly trying to win our favor in various ways, but the general feeling on our team is that they are quite full of it
    dinascosto7 (7:01:22 PM): ok, thaks for the chat
    dinascosto7 (7:01:53 PM): it would be great if Team Cav could write us soon to clarify our alliance status and give us their thoguhts on Saturn
    "Niklas" (7:02:18 PM): yeah, well, as I said we're quite understaffed, but I'll see what we can do
    dinascosto7 (7:02:28 PM): ok thanks
    "Niklas" (7:02:33 PM): we definitely consider us fully allied
    "Niklas" (7:02:37 PM): even if nothing is signed
    "Niklas" (7:02:47 PM): and if military intervention from us is needed, it will come
    dinascosto7 (7:03:02 PM): Oh, and of course, we'd like to hear what military aid Cav can send
    dinascosto7 (7:03:12 PM): ok I will post this log
    "Niklas" (7:03:15 PM): great
    In response to a question Sommers asked in another thread, yes, I did resign as foreign minister. But since you (Sommers) have re-initiated the custom of individual Kazakhs conducting diplomacy with other teams I feel free to chat and propose notes. I have not resigned from the team.

    Niklas said their team is willing to send us gold if it will help us get machinery faster. Can some one figure out how much we'd need to speed research so we can let Team Cav know if this idea is feasible. Niklas thinks Team Cav is nine turns from learning paper though that would probably be delayed if they send us gold.
     
  6. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    Received this from Unconquered Sun..in spoiler with my reply

    Spoiler :
    Originally Posted by Unconquered Sun
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Indiansmoke
    BTW, we have not heard from you regarding military help in the war with Sancta. Is it something you feel is pointless at this stage?

    Do you mean team Cav or me in particular?

    well both... I realize you might have seperate views from the majority of the team... I know I do in some issues...so I would like to hear both your opinion and Cav's opinion.



    Nothing special, just seems like us they have different opinions on certain issues
     
  7. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    From Nicflas/Donsig chatlog, it seems that Cav are willing to send military as well as gold to accelerate our teching of machinery...both good news.

    So what we need to dop now is decide on a military plan and present this to Cavaleiros. When will we attack with what units how many etc...will we wait for better units or attack with maces is what needs to be decided..or even if we wil attack at all and instead wait for rifles!

    In any case the gold is needed to get machinery faster... If we get 4-5 turns machinery before they get construction then we can do some serious harasement..a plan would be to make a few more axes and then if allies gives us gold to upgrade them all to maces and go for that city...with 6-7 maces and 3-4 catas we will get the city for sure.
     
  8. Kaleb

    Kaleb Deity

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    Interesting. SANCTA have also been trying to win our favour via chatting with Sommers and whispering in our ear that Cav aren't really our friends.

    Will it help if we played along with SANCTA so they got the idea we aren't as close as we are?
     
  9. Bolkonski

    Bolkonski Prince Bolkonsky

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    I would like more intelligence from our spies before deciding on military tactics. It depends what we are up against.

    For the present our priority will be defending our northern city and capital.
     
  10. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

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    Is it ok with everyone if we forward Saturn's last message to Team Cav?
     
  11. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

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    We should reply to their e-mail. Here is is again for reference:
    Spoiler :
    Mad Kaz Friends,

    We salute you!

    ... Kazakstan's patience with the swindling enemy.

    ... Mad Scientists' resilience through troubled times.

    Team Cavaleiros wishes to research Paper, we would then suggest
    researching Engineering. We believe Engineering and Machinery should
    take precedence over Feudalism. Pikemen would make a great defense
    against any Horse-based attacking unit. Not to mention the many other
    benefits of this technology.

    It has be suggested that with Currency researched, Team MS could
    maximize gold and support the research activities of Kaz and Cav, who
    both have the benefit of academies for better gold-to-beaker
    conversion. We belive it could be the most efficient way to achieve
    our goals. However, Philosophy or Theology may be preferred.

    With regards to the suggestion of MS to trade CS to Saturn, Team
    Cavalieros cannot see any circumstances where we would sanction any
    trade with Saturn or SANCTA - let alone an important tech like CS.

    Team SANCTA have a worrying large manufacturing capability, the threat
    from the alliance of S&S is great and ever increasing - we urge our
    allies to be prepared and ready to face any cunning attack from the
    deceitful twosome.

    We stand ready to receive you response.

    KingMorgan dos Cavaleiros
    We need to get up a reply. Anyone care to propose a note?
     
  12. damnrunner

    damnrunner Emperor

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    donsig - I am rushed so I can't type anything up but I think we can largely say that we are in agreement.

    We may also want to propose the idea of asking for cash to fund military upgrades. I think we would also mention a willingness to pay them back in some form. Straight gold or gifting some of the upgraded units once we are done with them are two obvious options.
     
  13. damnrunner

    damnrunner Emperor

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    We may also want to indicate that the potential to do a $ upgraded attack on Sancta is very time dependant. Once they have catapults we will be boxed in until rifles.

    But if we capture the city at the head of the valley we can attack sancta in multiple directions wich will make our superior units much less vulnerable to masses of Sancta catapults.
     
  14. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    note from US along with my reply

    Spoiler :
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Unconquered Sun
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Indiansmoke
    well both... I realize you might have seperate views from the majority of the team... I know I do in some issues...so I would like to hear both your opinion and Cav's opinion.

    The official view of team Cav is expressed by our appointed diplomats (I don't want to go over their heads). Moreover, I'm taking a break off Cav.

    My personal opinion is both Cav and Kaz don't approach the war with due caution. SANCTA have a number of ingame and out-of-game advantages. IMO we have to downsize them a bit. XP 5 units are crucial for that and Theology seems to be the best way to get them.

    I am not sure what you mean by in game and out of game advantages, if you can please be more specific.

    Also not sure what you mean by downsizing either...you mean take/raise some of their cities?

    Regarding Theology, you need religion in cities to use it, and organized is the way to spread religion plus get the necessary infrastructure buildings like granary etc. Theology will be in next civic switch for sure if this war drags on, but my view is that right now I'd rather have faster maces than 2 promo axes.

    Also there are elephants, and Sancta have ivory, these are 2 promo units with stable that are basically owning this era. 2 promo maces will lose to 2 promo elephants 1vs1....so I am not so sure you can "downsize" an empire that has elephants and catapults on a 1vs1.
     
  15. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd Rest in Peace Black Panther

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    IMO "out of game" advantages has to mean either:
    1. More Time
    2. Better Demographic Reading
    3. More Chatting and other out-of-game/forum communication

    But I could be wrong. Maybe U. Sun will explain a little more... Unless that was Smoke talking... a little unclear from post.
     
  16. Kaleb

    Kaleb Deity

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    Sommers - I think you're right on all 3 points! Although point 2 is really just a derivative of point 1 :)

    Cav seem really keen on Engineering. The fast roads will really help us as they can get units to the front. Pikemen will also sort out Elephants easily enough. They are probably also interested in getting Notre Dame
     
  17. Indiansmoke

    Indiansmoke Deity

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    That was US talking..sorry a bit unclear from my post.

    Out of game advantages mean something else than time to read demographics IMO (how does US know how much time we have anyway?).

    What I think he means is personal relations, but not sure with who and for what benefit.
     
  18. donsig

    donsig Low level intermediary

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    Anyone know if the ninjas on SANCTA played together in the last MTDG?

    EDIT: I checked myself. Here's the roster from Team Epsilon which won the last game. The asterisks indicate those who went to SANCTA. As you can see they have a solid core from the winning team. We have Classy and Team Cav has Methos and Empiremaker. No one from Epsilon went on to Saturn or MS. I'd say the out of game advantage is SANCTA's winning experience as well as their ability to work together as a team. We certainly lack the latter.

    Epsilon Team: [27]
    fe3333au
    General W *****************************
    lost_civantares
    azzaman333****************************
    classical_hero KAZKHSTAN
    gbno1fan
    MjM
    TheDivide
    Civmansam
    Kentharu
    DaveMcW
    Kylearan *******************************
    kojimanard
    Memphus **********************
    brooklynprop
    Methos CAV
    Agarwaen
    ItalianVoice
    diogo.bercito
    Pharod
    EL_OSO
    M@ni@c
    marius312
    Empiremaker CAV
    Pinman
    civplayah *****************************
    remake20 *******************************
    AutomatedTeller *****************************
     
  19. damnrunner

    damnrunner Emperor

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    Is classy a spy?
     
  20. Kaleb

    Kaleb Deity

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    lol

    Is it ok for me to send this to Cav via PM?

     

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