Caveman 2 Cosmos (ideas/discussions thread)

@Hydromancerx

I'm glad you like the work. I completely agree with the suggestion to have Archaeology before Psychology. I just wonder where that silly Assembly Line requirement came from. It had to be an oversight.

The construction ideas regarding the combat engineer were suggested to give it a unique capability, but if the game crashes then the idea obviously should be ignored. I still think the rename from Modern Grenadier is appropriate even if the characteristics of the unit don't change, because "grenadier" is an archaic term that is simply not used in modern warfare. Even the Modern Grenadier "-pedia" entry is just a copy of the vanilla game Grenadier, referring to building these when faced with Riflemen. Maybe someday the game engine will better support the unique capabilities of a true combat engineer unit.

I don't remember much from RoM/AnD, so while I probably knew there was an Armored Car in it, I couldn't put my finger on it. The unit does have some merit as a unit to be added to what I think is a weak category (Wheeled Units.) Feedback on balance is asked for and welcome on all of these suggestions. My idea is that this is NOT intended as any sort of tank substitute, it's really more of a recon unit - this is why it has no bonuses vs. other mechanized units. Armored Cars were widely used in WW2 for recon (they are really the result of the evolution of cavalry into a mechanized formation.)

I hope you can find a nice icon for the V2 rocket somewhere. Also, if a move towards dumping the specific unit names (P59 jet fighter, M60 tank, etc) is someday adopted, this could easily be called the "Early Ballistic Missile", while the V1 could be called the "Flying Bomb".

Yes ideas are great, i had to change some grids around also, because of the requirements also, plus i moved Sailing over two grids to the right and industrialism one to the right, also, i had to make Trench Warfare a ORpreq of Armored Vehicles to get a line, line(s) are from the ORpreq and not the andPreq. JFYI. I hope i got them correct.:rolleyes:

Now thats the way to give good suggestions and or ideas, way to go.
 
@ Koshling,

ok here is a wanderer, when you click on auto hunt, it attaches itself to one of the units of your civ, not the way its intended:(

I'll look at this today since you have a save game for me :) I just have to load it up and select the (only?) wanderer and auto-hunt right? Should get to this early this afternoon

Edit - nvm looked at it and it's no understood. Basically the automate hunt routine if it can't see any targets to kill does essentially the explore action until it sees a hunting target. The exploration routine contains a clause with the following comment:

Code:
//When in an offensive war, we are already sending stacks into enemy territory, so exploring
//in addition to the stacks is counterproductive, and dangerous

Basically this causes the AI to cease exploration and have its exporation units join regular army stacks while the war is in progress. In your game you are at war with pretty much everyone and the hunting automation trips over the AI exploration AI safeties. I am changing it so that that clause onl applies to AI units, which will mean it won't happen to human units happening to use parts of the exploration AI for hunting.

Edit 2 - fix pushed to SVN, rev 152
 
Running DEBUG flags up a bunch of new XML errors. The cause is the new shaman religious buikldings that are dependent on rabbit in the vicinity. BONUS_RABBIT is undefined - has someone forgotten to add this bonus type or should the buildings not be there?

Edit - pretty sure the rabbit-using buildings are spurious - they got submitted to SVN with the change that introduced walruses and so on (and their buildings) and DH's revision comment talks about the other bonus types but doesn't mention rabbits. I'll comment the buildings out and push to SVN. Let me know if you think this is wrong.

Also, just noticed aluminium (sic - I'm English so I spell it properly!) visible at the start of the game!! Reason is:

Code:
			<Type>BONUS_ALUMINUM</Type>
			<Description>TXT_KEY_BONUS_ALUMINUM</Description>
			<Civilopedia>TXT_KEY_BONUS_ALUMINUM_PEDIA</Civilopedia>
			<BonusClassType>BONUSCLASS_MANUFACTURED</BonusClassType>
			<ArtDefineTag>ART_DEF_BONUS_ALUMINUM</ArtDefineTag>
			[B]<TechReveal>NONE</TechReveal>[/B]
			<TechCityTrade>TECH_MINING</TechCityTrade>
			<TechObsolete>NONE</TechObsolete>

Not sure what this should be, so someone that knows will need to fix.

Edit - just realised this is weird since it has the tag BONUSCLASS_MANUFACTURED, yet in SO's save game it appears as a map resource. Not sure what's going on but there is some sort of XML problem here.
 
Running DEBUG flags up a bunch of new XML errors. The cause is the new shaman religious buikldings that are dependent on rabbit in the vicinity. BONUS_RABBIT is undefined - has someone forgotten to add this bonus type or should the buildings not be there?

Edit - pretty sure the rabbit-using buildings are spurious - they got submitted to SVN with the change that introduced walruses and so on (and their buildings) and DH's revision comment talks about the other bonus types but doesn't mention rabbits. I'll comment the buildings out and push to SVN. Let me know if you think this is wrong.

Also, just noticed aluminium (sic - I'm English so I spell it properly!) visible at the start of the game!! Reason is:

Code:
			<Type>BONUS_ALUMINUM</Type>
			<Description>TXT_KEY_BONUS_ALUMINUM</Description>
			<Civilopedia>TXT_KEY_BONUS_ALUMINUM_PEDIA</Civilopedia>
			<BonusClassType>BONUSCLASS_MANUFACTURED</BonusClassType>
			<ArtDefineTag>ART_DEF_BONUS_ALUMINUM</ArtDefineTag>
			[B]<TechReveal>NONE</TechReveal>[/B]
			<TechCityTrade>TECH_MINING</TechCityTrade>
			<TechObsolete>NONE</TechObsolete>

Not sure what this should be, so someone that knows will need to fix.

Edit - just realised this is weird since it has the tag BONUSCLASS_MANUFACTURED, yet in SO's save game it appears as a map resource. Not sure what's going on but there is some sort of XML problem here.

OK just added a tech_Mining there, even though the bonus is not really used.
 
Does anyone else think that upgrading boats to newer versions is really weird?
Vehicle type units at all to be honest.

"Got this nice spiffy War Canoe with a bunch of promotions. Lets remake it into a Trireme, only costs a little gold and is cheaper than building a new Trireme."
How does one upgrade a Canoe to a Trireme, or a Trireme to a Destroyer? War Galley to Trireme is more along the lines of possible.
At certain points along vehicle unit paths upgrades shouldn't really be possible. Promotions though, like adding Iron Plating to a Brigantine, something that couldn't be taken by a Destroyer, or any other water unit with metal hull already.

Anyways, just a thought there.

Cheers
 
Does anyone else think that upgrading boats to newer versions is really weird?
Vehicle type units at all to be honest.

"Got this nice spiffy War Canoe with a bunch of promotions. Lets remake it into a Trireme, only costs a little gold and is cheaper than building a new Trireme."
How does one upgrade a Canoe to a Trireme, or a Trireme to a Destroyer? War Galley to Trireme is more along the lines of possible.
At certain points along vehicle unit paths upgrades shouldn't really be possible. Promotions though, like adding Iron Plating to a Brigantine, something that couldn't be taken by a Destroyer, or any other water unit with metal hull already.

Anyways, just a thought there.

Cheers

Upgrading doesn't nessasarily mean the unit is rebuilt into the upgraded form, but that the unit is replaced by the newer unit in your nation's arcenal.

Although the idea of not having units being able to upgrade if it doesn't make logical sense is realistic, for me anyway, not being able to upgrade abunch of obsolete units really stinks. I don't even like the upgrade fee to be honest, but I live with it.
 
OK just added a tech_Mining there, even though the bonus is not really used.

What used to reveal Aluminum (in Vanilla BTS)? When did it become a manufactured resource, and if it IS a manufactured resource why is it appearing on your map at all?? Does it even appear for you (just NE of your city), or am I seeing a bonus-id-mapping bug due to differing sets of bonuses being defined between your save and my load maybe?

Edit - Can't seem to ever get screenshots to work for me, but to be precise it appears 3 tiles north and 2 east of your city for me.

Edit 2 - ok, so the reason the TECH_NONE didn't matter was because it was manufactured and could not appear on maps. This was so because it has no valid terrain types (that's what prevents the map generator placing it). The question then, is not why it doesn't have a reveal tech, but how it came to be placed on your map. Is this map a scenario map or anything special like that? My guess (STRONG suspicion) is that saved maps (of any kind not embedded in regular save games) will have untranslated bonus ids in them so if you create a new game based on them with different assets from where they wre originally created their bonuses will be screwed up (also terrain and feature types in principle but we probably haven't changed those). Bottom line is that scenario maps will not work across asset changes. I'm not sure how these get saved (are they effectively save games?) but to address that we'd need to have them save in max compatibility format somehow I'd guess.
 
What used to reveal Aluminum (in Vanilla BTS)? When did it become a manufactured resource, and if it IS a manufactured resource why is it appearing on your map at all?? Does it even appear for you (just NE of your city), or am I seeing a bonus-id-mapping bug due to differing sets of bonuses being defined between your save and my load maybe?

Edit - Can't seem to ever get screenshots to work for me, but to be precise it appears 3 tiles north and 2 east of your city for me.

Edit 2 - ok, so the reason the TECH_NONE didn't matter was because it was manufactured and could not appear on maps. This was so because it has no valid terrain types (that's what prevents the map generator placing it). The question then, is not why it doesn't have a reveal tech, but how it came to be placed on your map. Is this map a scenario map or anything special like that? My guess (STRONG suspicion) is that saved maps (of any kind not embedded in regular save games) will have untranslated bonus ids in them so if you create a new game based on them with different assets from where they wre originally created their bonuses will be screwed up (also terrain and feature types in principle but we probably haven't changed those). Bottom line is that scenario maps will not work across asset changes. I'm not sure how these get saved (are they effectively save games?) but to address that we'd need to have them save in max compatibility format somehow I'd guess.

I am pretty sure that BONUS_BAUXITE has the same ArtDefines as Aluminum.

I finally looked at what your talking about and any bonus_aluminum should be Bauxite, the guy that made it probably didn't know.
 
Naturopathy gives +1 food to jungle camps. However jungle camps cannot be built until Sedentary Lifestyle, which you get Naturopathy on the way to anyway. Should JCs be earlier? Otherwise the +1 food on Naturopathy is redundant (might as well just put it on the JC).

I would suggest swapping things around so that building a JC requires Naturopathy and Sedentary Lifestyle gives a JC +1 food.
 
mod sounds awsome but I can't get it to work

Every time I load it the loading screen stays up....

The main menu is there working under the loading screen but I can't tell what I'm doing with the loading screen in the way....

The loading music and screen stay up even after the game is done loading.

Please help
 
I'm sure any crash could be easily enough fixed (given reproducible case anyway). HOWEVER, I would still caution against this-dual-purpose unit FOR NOW, because it won't be effectively used by the AI and would need extra (non-trivial) AI work to have it taken advantage of. If we want to target this for a V15/V16 feature in 1-2 monthes time then I'm happy to undertake the necessary AI work (and crash fix), but would appreciate if we could hold off for a time, since I have more urgent AI work to do first really.

Well if it ever gets figured out then that would be great. I don't know as much about why or what went wrong (ask like DH or Afforess), but if you can get units to do worker tasks too that would be great since the elephant units could be returned to how they originally were as hybrid units who could both be used in battle and help with improvement construction.

Personally i want the mountaineering bug to be fixed first since the Pack Llama is useless at this point.

Naturopathy gives +1 food to jungle camps. However jungle camps cannot be built until Sedentary Lifestyle, which you get Naturopathy on the way to anyway. Should JCs be earlier? Otherwise the +1 food on Naturopathy is redundant (might as well just put it on the JC).

I would suggest swapping things around so that building a JC requires Naturopathy and Sedentary Lifestyle gives a JC +1 food.

That seems ok. I like the swap idea.
 
Running DEBUG flags up a bunch of new XML errors. The cause is the new shaman religious buikldings that are dependent on rabbit in the vicinity. BONUS_RABBIT is undefined - has someone forgotten to add this bonus type or should the buildings not be there?

Edit - pretty sure the rabbit-using buildings are spurious - they got submitted to SVN with the change that introduced walruses and so on (and their buildings) and DH's revision comment talks about the other bonus types but doesn't mention rabbits. I'll comment the buildings out and push to SVN. Let me know if you think this is wrong.

Also, just noticed aluminium (sic - I'm English so I spell it properly!) visible at the start of the game!! Reason is:

Code:
			<Type>BONUS_ALUMINUM</Type>
			<Description>TXT_KEY_BONUS_ALUMINUM</Description>
			<Civilopedia>TXT_KEY_BONUS_ALUMINUM_PEDIA</Civilopedia>
			<BonusClassType>BONUSCLASS_MANUFACTURED</BonusClassType>
			<ArtDefineTag>ART_DEF_BONUS_ALUMINUM</ArtDefineTag>
			[B]<TechReveal>NONE</TechReveal>[/B]
			<TechCityTrade>TECH_MINING</TechCityTrade>
			<TechObsolete>NONE</TechObsolete>

Not sure what this should be, so someone that knows will need to fix.

Edit - just realised this is weird since it has the tag BONUSCLASS_MANUFACTURED, yet in SO's save game it appears as a map resource. Not sure what's going on but there is some sort of XML problem here.

BONUS_BAUXITE is the ore version of aluminum. Aluminum is produced from a factory when you have access to Bauxite Ore. You should not be able to see Aluminum on the map and not be able to see Bauxite Ore until "Industrialism" tech.

What used to reveal Aluminum (in Vanilla BTS)? When did it become a manufactured resource, and if it IS a manufactured resource why is it appearing on your map at all?? Does it even appear for you (just NE of your city), or am I seeing a bonus-id-mapping bug due to differing sets of bonuses being defined between your save and my load maybe?

Its been around since RoM.
 
Could the whole stuck on the load screen have to do with it being Civ 4 Complete?

or maybe I'm putting it in the wrong folder IDK x.x

I put the mod in: C:\Program Files\2K Games\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 Complete\Beyond the Sword\Mods


this is driving me crazy... this is the kinda mod I've wished some one would make (well I really wished they would just do this them selfs but eh) and I can't play it!!! >.< GAH
 
Could the whole stuck on the load screen have to do with it being Civ 4 Complete?

or maybe I'm putting it in the wrong folder IDK x.x

I put the mod in: C:\Program Files\2K Games\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 Complete\Beyond the Sword\Mods


this is driving me crazy... this is the kinda mod I've wished some one would make (well I really wished they would just do this them selfs but eh) and I can't play it!!! >.< GAH

What is your OS?

Are you running as Administrator on your computer?

Do you have more than 2GB of Ram?

Did you check to see if there was a 2nd Caveman to Cosmos (C2C for short) folder inside the 1st? If so cut/paste to Mods folder and delete empty C2C.

JosEPh
 
using XP, everything else is good

I found out it's not the loading lol it's the main menu .... but there is just the background with no menu... but I can click on menu stuff.... just nothing pops up so only real affect is the unload mod or exit buttons.....

It's really confusing x.x
 
Naturopathy gives +1 food to jungle camps. However jungle camps cannot be built until Sedentary Lifestyle, which you get Naturopathy on the way to anyway. Should JCs be earlier? Otherwise the +1 food on Naturopathy is redundant (might as well just put it on the JC).

I would suggest swapping things around so that building a JC requires Naturopathy and Sedentary Lifestyle gives a JC +1 food.

Umm, JC was available at Naturopathy since... forever, did it get moved to Sedentary for this V14 build?

I would suggest swapping things around so that building a JC requires Naturopathy and Sedentary Lifestyle gives a JC +1 food.

Isn't that what DH did (along with other "fixes" ) to get JC working right?

JosEPh
 
son of a x.x

I clicked the highest most clickable (though i couldn't see it) then clicked the bottom right for OK over and over untill it started a game....

After like 5 mintues or so of loading the game I got a C++ runtime library error.....

"This application has requested the Runtime to terminate it in an unusal way."

So not only can I not see the menu but the game crashes when I start a game
 
Umm, JC was available at Naturopathy since... forever, did it get moved to Sedentary for this V14 build?



Isn't that what DH did (along with other "fixes" ) to get JC working right?

JosEPh

It's not how it is now is all I know.
 
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