Caveman 2 Cosmos (ideas/discussions thread)
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Yes, workers can't defend themselves at all.
Also even though they are passive, they still can kill someone when protecting themselves.
Lets say these animals tried to protect their babies
Its not pigeon
I think category "completely harmless" would be nice - that is animals that can't kill humans.
Passive animals are "mostly harmless".
Okay, I've done some testing and apparently you need to add this line of code:
Between ArtDefineTag and Defense to have caves negate terrain damage.
Code:
<YieldChanges>
<iYieldChange>1</iYieldChange>
<iYieldChange>1</iYieldChange>
</YieldChanges>Between ArtDefineTag and Defense to have caves negate terrain damage.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
They used to, if they spawned in a barbarian city with that terrain and you have terrain damage on.
There is a category "completely harmless". They have a >1% chance of killing a unit. Even pigeons will kill someone if they startle them at the wrong moment eg negotiating a tightrope over a deep gorgeYes, workers can't defend themselves at all.
Also even though they are passive, they still can kill someone when protecting themselves.
Lets say these animals tried to protect their babies
Its not pigeon
I think category "completely harmless" would be nice - that is animals that can't kill humans.
Passive animals are "mostly harmless".
That will cause caves to spawn near first cities a lot.
Nowadays it's very hard to spawn without a cave near you anyways.
I think they used to be a rarity, once.
Also, that same gang of musk oxes just attacked and killed my unit of clubmen. I guess those nasty cavemen were wawing their large sticks at their babies, uh?
Or getting startled by rabbit, when setting trap for big animals - like big hole with spikes in itThey used to, if they spawned in a barbarian city with that terrain and you have terrain damage on.
There is a category "completely harmless". They have a >1% chance of killing a unit. Even pigeons will kill someone if they startle them at the wrong moment eg negotiating a tightrope over a deep gorge
That will cause caves to spawn near first cities a lot.
What unit team would be best for subduing all animals on some tile in single turn?
Lets say there is 10 animals, some of them are strong predators, and others are good at hiding.
What animals don't spawn inside players territory?
I remember, when I was playing on my spacemap less and less predators were spawning, but still territory was full of peaceful animals, most of them being good at hiding.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
I don't think I have had caves near my first city in the last 10 games.
I'm using latest SVN and Perfect Mongoose, what about you?
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
I'm super happy with how animals are behaving in play now. It's clear they have been well designed based on a study of their natures. I really get a clear sense of reality when out exploring the wild now and that is just unspeakably badass.
From what I understand, yes, Musk Oxen can be extremely aggressive just because you happened upon them.
How are we going with the gradient of willingness to enter human territory though? You said a while back you were going to review the use of that tag. I don't recall if you did that yet or if it's still something intended for future work.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
@Toffer90 : You liked this comment... to me it doesn't make any sense. Do you see something I don't here?
I guess that list is outdated; walrus are listed as neutral in it but in my game they have the deer flag.
But even going by the list, musk oxes are just on the second step of the aggressivity ladder and they don't have the "can attack" upward triangle, so they should be pretty pacific.
Yet, in my game, they have been acting like full-blown predators, eating my workers and attacking weakened units - definitedly bugged.
I guess my English IS pretty bad after all, I never took that "First" certificate.
What I mean is:
In Assets/XML/Terrain/Civ4FeatureInfos.xml, I tried randomly copying lines from <!-- Ancient Forest --> to <!-- Cave -->. And it turns out that adding that one line gives the desired effect, ie making caves remove terrain damage.
Could you try removing the hammer, see if it works with just the food?
The second yieldchange is the hammer.
I liked it because that's the closest thing we have to a clue to why ancient forest remove terrain damage. It doesn't make sense at all, never did, because it's an unintentional quirk in the dll code.
That's how I've interpreted it up until now at least, I don't think its intentional that ancient forest should protect against terrain damage, caves make sense though.
It's still on my list.
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It's as I suspected, this also explains why flood plains and oasis removes terrain damage from deserts (which makes sense); it would seem that this was an intentional design choice for terrain damage logic, though a dedicated feature tag for removing terrain damage from specific terrains would be better in the long run.
Ancient forest should perhaps not increase food yield, move it over to +1
instead, or?
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Well I'll be danged. I would not have imagined that sort of scenario to be programmed into the system but I suppose the proof is there. Maybe it does make sense to change the benefit of the ancient forest so as not to inadvertently trigger that side of things since it will take a bit of a code hunt to figure out where that is taking place in the code.
JosEPh_II
TBS WarLord
This has been discussed before, in fact many times. But since you are new to C2C you perceive it is as a problem. They will attack almost anything. While this may go against the List and be incorrect coding per the list, we that have played with it this way have come to accepted it. We've learned to come "armed" or escorted when going thru Musk Ox territory. It's become part of the game. Adds to the game actually.
Long time ago all animals were predators even pigeons and ducks. But too many players and even modders hated getting a wounded mil unit killed by a duck. So Dancing Hoskuld (DH for short) the author of Subdued Animals made changes. In fact he's made several changes since this was incorporated into the Mod. It's just that new posters to the forum and C2C are expecting All "passive" animals to lay down and die if any "armed" unit even looks at them. Even if the armed unit has 0.01 health left, which is a totally borked way of looking at it, with or without Terrain Damage option On or Off.
There are also Beastly and Predator animals now that will not attack either, especially if you are on a forested hill. But if in the desert they will. The combat odds favor them there. So in essence you can pick apart the 3 animal AI list all day long if you want to.
There are bigger concerns than this and I'm 100% sure DH is very tired of it too. You just can't please everyone.
So for now best advice towards the animals depends upon the Options used and just don't put your own units in harms way.
