Challenging War: Maintain the Balance of Power

[Epimethius]

IMPERIALISM! CHALLENGE! WAR! PERILOUS JOURNEYS! COLONIZATION!

ALL THESE COULD BE OURS!

IF WE MAINTAIN THE BALANCE OF POWER AND SAVE GERMANY FROM BARBARIAN CHINESE AND AMERICANS!

Enough propaganda. The idea is this. Some of us seem to want a war. Some of us want a challenge. Well here's a war that has a legitimate reason, and will be one hell of a challenge. We ally ourselves with Germany and stop China from becoming too powerful.

This is not as anywhere near as obvious or easy as fighting the Iroquois (and not just because we happen to have all our spears aimed at Salamanca right now). The trip over would require a lot of construction and a perilous passage. Once there, we would not have a base at first, and would be going against a tough enemy. Our technology would be obsolete compared to theirs by that point. And if we get any cities we might as well give them back to Germany, since that's the point (and they'd be horribly corrupt).

But at the same time, its something that needs to be done. China just beat the **** out of India, and now they and Honest Abe are kicking Germany's ***. At this rate, China could become a massive power, and, if wars against America and Russia go well, conquer the continent before we conquer ours. They already have technical superiority on us. By protecting Germany we can stop them, and keep the balance of power. We'd send all the current troops ready to pounce on the Iroquouis over there in boats, and, in the mean time, could make more for the inevitable march on Veii. The only thing we have to loose is our troops, not our territory, and if we win we'll get foreign riches and prevent the rise of a great enemy.


Painting the world pink was so last Demogame.

Currently, China has most of India and Germany (22 cities), as well as a military even with our and a score only a little below us. With all of Germany they could beat us, especially if they mop up the rest of the continent, which shouldn't be too hard considering how they kicked the **** out of Germany.

Plus its a serious diplomatic principal, people. Not just "You neighbor. You die now."

I'm serious here, too.

 

[Civanator]

Give me boats for my troops and I will give you Beijing.

By the time we get there Germany might be gone...

But I am looking into this.

Also the Germans don't have Stuttgart anymore, just Salzburg, Konigsberg, and Nuremberg.

My early calculations show that it will take 11 turns from Sto'vo'kor to get to Nuremberg, if we dont sink. This doesn't include time for building caravels and scrambling our units from the Iriquois borders. I can have the Samurai withdraw but it doesn't seem likely we can save the Germans, but I will give it a try.

 

[Crimso]

Ok, this is crazy, but I think it could really infuse some life into the DG. But if we're going to put troops out there, we have to get something for ourselves out of it. What about Heidelburg and Bonn? We'd have to declare war on the Americans too, but my clothing is so drab...

For people who are immediatly opposed to this plan, just think of the excitement it'll bring to the DG! It'll hurt our rep with two nations... but, it's so crazy I like it.

 

[GenMarshall]

I am skeptical about this war with these civs. One main reason I am skeptical is the lack of support in the citizens that advocates for war. I, myself am planning to go for FAs in the next elections and I dont wish to put myself as a warmonger but wish to stick within the middle grounds of both pacificism and warmongerism.

I would see personaly what the diplomatic climate is like in that region (Wether or not they have the protection alliance between one another) and what the support for war is on our home turf.

 

[MOTH]

I don't see how you can see this as a legitimate reason for war. China has done nothing to us. I will not support a war against a country that has not declared war on us first.

Both the Iroquois and the Babs have both declared war on us in the past. That's a legitimate reason for war in my opinion.

 

[Nobody]

This sounds cool, the idea of saving a small nation from its evil neighbour sounds fun. but is it possible?

Problems:
1.Our military is not up to it, We would need a lot of soldiers like we have, but we would also need to keep a lot home in case of war here. And what about boats we only have one or two and they bearly float

2.We don’t have enough time, The Germans are almost dead. We need time to build our navy (or rush) and even if we started as soon as next turn chat began it would be hard. Also aren’t you Epimethius the person who thought just two polls wasn’t enough for war with Iroquois. you would need to get discussion and then polling done, and the military need to make pretty plans and think of a name for operation.

Other than that it would be cool. Would we hand over liberated cities at the end of war. I think we should. also in the RPG people are going on a trip to Germany now they could pick are weapons. If this doesn’t work out we could over there and acquire some new colonies anyway.

 

[GenMarshall]

I don't see how you can see this as a legitimate reason for war. China has done nothing to us. I will not support a war against a country that has not declared war on us first.

Both the Iroquois and the Babs have both declared war on us in the past. That's a legitimate reason for war in my opinion.

I agree with you on that part. Though what will trouble me is the support for war against the Iroquois since I have seen almost a 1/1 split with the citizens on the Pacificst to Warmongers ratios.

 

[snipelfritz]

I would love to do this, but I really don't think our navy is all up to it. I feel we have three directions we can take this DG in:
1. We can pick off are neighbors one by one (easiest)
2. We can become pascifist, unless attacked (harder)
3. We can declare war on every nation in the world and fight it out (hardest, challenging, insane, possibly suicidal, and not that bad of an idea )

I think we need to decide which direction we are going to go in at this point of the game.

EDIT: I am half-joking/half-serious about the last one. Feel free to laugh at it. I know I am .

 

[TimBentley]

Regardless, if we are to fight China, we should wait for navigation or magnetism.

I don't think snipelfritz's option 3 is suicidal (I don't support it, but it's possible).

 

[Crimso]

Yes, the Cheat is a funnny one.

 

[Ashburnham]

I am strongly against getting involved in the Sino-German War. There's no reason for us to get embroiled in a conflict between two sovereign nations. And, frankly, nothing positive can be achieved by bringing even more bloodshed to the war-torn eastern penninsula of that continent. Let us instead maintain the attitude of progressive trade that we already have with both nations, and hope that-- for the sake of the people-- the violence will stop as soon as possible.

 

[Rik Meleet]

Why can't we just donate Ibabango to Germany ?? It will guarantee their survival (for now) but has the disadvantage that our contact-monopoly is broken.

 

[Nobody]

I agree with rik, but is ibanbango an important city? i have no idea. Also i would only agree to this is we intend to eventually go liberate german citys.

 

[invy]

Bad idea. Germans are dead anyway. If we want to play peacemakers then I suggest strenghtening our status of Worls Peacemakers, establishing trading connections, RoPs, embassies and alliances and defending our continent and neighbours from potential invaders..

 

[Rik Meleet]

Ibabango is the zulu city that flipped to us a few turns ago.

Actually I'd say we don't get ourselves involved in matters of the other continent. Unless we have a 20 turn deal with them that is about to be broken, hurting our Reputation. Then we can consider giving that nation help until the 20 turn deal runs out.

Our Reputation is everything. Do we have deals with Germany ?

 

[classical_hero]

Bad idea. Germans are dead anyway. If we want to play peacemakers then I suggest strenghtening our status of Worls Peacemakers, establishing trading connections, RoPs, embassies and alliances and defending our continent and neighbours from potential invaders..

First we need to get either Navigation or Magneticism before we can trade with the other continent. I can see great possiblities with trading with the other continent. With having 8 luxuries would be great for our cities and happiness. The growth that we can get from that would greatly benefit our nation.

 

[blackheart]

This is why I want to invade Iroquois. We have to strengthen ourselves before taking on China. Anyways, it's just suicide right now, given that their UU is the Rider.

 

[invy]

This is why I want to invade Iroquois. We have to strengthen ourselves before taking on China. Anyways, it's just suicide right now, given that their UU is the Rider.

Samurai actually can kill riders easier then rider -> samurai. Tho Riders are somewhat faster (movement 3 vs 2) but they anyway can't retreat vs Samurai..

 

[Epimethius]

I don't see how you can see this as a legitimate reason for war. China has done nothing to us. I will not support a war against a country that has not declared war on us first.

Both the Iroquois and the Babs have both declared war on us in the past. That's a legitimate reason for war in my opinion.

Actually, that would be like if England declared war on France in WWI, because they don't like France (and they were allies, just like us and the Iroquois). My idea is like England declaring war on Germany after they invade Belgium for no reason. This is honorable and diplomatically legimate.

As for a prize, we could fill the Berlin void, grabbing that ivory, and a port, and leave the rest to Germany.

Korigburg and Nurimburg have held out pretty well, so they might last. Germany could, if necessary, be kept alive through declaring war early, which might distract China (even though we wouldn't arrive until much later), and giving Germany Ibana-whatsit. The problem is, unless they move their capital, we won't Ibana-whatsit back.

Right now the China are barely less powerful than us, and at their current rate that won't last long. The idea of this is that we undertake a massive effort to ensure our supremacy in the world without attacking an innocent nation, and while keeping up buffer states. This is the realistic and farseeing way to maintain the balance of power, rather than just gobbling up another country whenever your rival does.

 

[Provolution]

I actually agree with Epimethius to send an Expeditionary Force. That will keep the game interesting. I really like how someone is picking up on doctrinal planning. Great initiative.