Chambers of the Ambassador to the Gamecatcher Alliance

[FortyJ]

Welcome citizens.

In an attempt to keep everyone appraised of our dealings with Gamecatcher Alliance, I have opened this thread for suggestions, requests, demands, etc... that anyone wishes me to convey to our "friendly" neighbors to the east.

 

[Goonie]

'demands'

 

[FortyJ]

Attached, you will find the zipped chat log from our discussions today. Nothing much was accomplished, and nothing much divulged.

My first impression is that these talks will accomplish nothing more than to gather information on our neighbor while we amass troops for the conquest.

By the way, I'm willing to wager that the coastline we just ran into in the north wraps around to form a nice little peninsula. So, unless we're going to be content with the land area we already know, I think war with this nation is inevitable. Might as well start getting ready for that war now, rather than later.

Oh, and if they have met up with another nation, as is rumored around town lately, there was no revelation of that fact in this session. Such an occurence, however, would certainly complicate our war plans, as they would assuredly implore that nation for assistance. Thus, before we go to war, we'd better be very sure that our forces are excessively superior in number, if not ability as well, to these people.

Password: scripture

 

[Octavian X]

A few comments...

I sincerely hope my presidential decrees don't look like 'yadda' to you, and is it safe to assume that you are a fellow Windows XP user?

I think their relunctance to trade for Warrior Code only means that they will not be pursuing a war-like path in the near future. This is good news to us as would-be conquerors.

 

[Zukatah]

Should we wait until we have met with Apolyton before waging a war or do you plan to strike them quickly? If we wait and have the assurance by Apolyton that nothing will be done to slow down the liberation of those poor citizens, it would be much safer. By the way, I think they're not expecting a quick strike as Octavian said before, they don't seem all that interested in warrior code. Maybe they are researching it now though...
Sorry if this post wasn't that interesting, I'm curious about how we will proceed.

 

[FortyJ]

Originally posted by Octavian X
A few comments...

I sincerely hope my presidential decrees don't look like 'yadda' to you,

No, they're not. That was just a shameless attempt to saddle up next to the enemy in hopes that he might slip out any information that might prove helpful in our future plans for conquest.

... and is it safe to assume that you are a fellow Windows XP user?

No. Not yet. Only Win2k. Why do you ask?

I think their relunctance to trade for Warrior Code only means that they will not be pursuing a war-like path in the near future. This is good news to us as would-be conquerors.

Either that or they are merely a few turns away from discovering it themselves, or that they don't value this tech at all because they are heading straight for Iron Working too. I would be reluctant to draw any conclusions from their position on this one tech. I still say we assume the worst.

They are trying to exploit their position on the map and the techs they have and in the process keep us in an inferior position. This infuriates me! But, I will not let him know it. At least until we have 20+ vet swords within striking distance of Balance of Power.

In the meantime, I would like to call a Foreign Affairs meeting to discuss strategy for these and future talks with Gamecatcher. Goonie, you and I have to be there as it directly pertains to your department and because I'm the one doing the talking. So let me know when a good time for you is and everyone else who wishes to join is welcome to do so.

 

[Zukatah]

I say we should be really careful at this point in the game because we really don't know what is going on. If we trade techs with them, they'll probably trade them with Apolyton (assuming they have contact with them) and we'll thus be contributing to their probable war effort. We assume that they occupy a prime position and that may be true but they may also find themselves blocked by another civ at the east or have bad terrain.

 

[Goonie]

I wouldn't trade with GC until we have Poly's contact. Also, we cant even talk to Poly online.

 

[Killer A's]

Should mapmaking be more important so we can make contact with Apolyton?

 

[Zukatah]

To minimize the risks of an unwanted war with them, I'd say yes but again, I'm only a citizen and I may be wrong.

 

[Killer A's]

In my mind the options are mapmaking (to find Apolyton), the wheel (for horses), or ceremonial burial (for temple to expand city boundaries).

I rank them mapmaking, CB, Wheel but CB and Wheel are close.

 

[Octavian X]

I don't know why we are obsessed with finding 'poly... We need to concentrate of Gamecatcher and Balance of Power.

FortyJ: It was just a something out of curiosity. The location where you saved that chat log looked a lot like the same file struture XP uses for different users...

 

[Cheetah]

Octavian:
It is the same. Win2k and WinXP are as equal as Win95 and Win98

Why we want to make contact with Apolyton:
It would be easier to trade techs and make other agreements when we know more than one civ. And we could get them as a friend or ally against GC.

 

[FortyJ]

I agree that we must make contact with all other nations as quickly as possible.

However, as we have no concrete proof that they are in fact in contact with each other, how should we approach this? Should we feign ignorance? Should we demand they reveal this to us?

I would suggest that we do not let on that we know this information in any formal dialog with Gamecatcher, at least not yet. Furthermore, I would propose that we simply put the question to them: "Have you met anyone else?" If they say yes, then we begin negotiations to obtain that contact info. If they deny it, then we let the matter drop and use that, among other pieces of info that we might obtain from them over time, as an argument to justify our looming war with them.

Remember, these negotiations may not need to actually accomplish anything to prove beneficial to us. Information is the key to victory, and we may well be able to use these chats to get enough information to not only assist us in our war effort, but also to justify such action in the eyes of the world.

 

[Cheetah]

Exactly FortyJ

We do NOT know for sure that they have met Apolyton. But we do have very good reasons to believe so!

If we let them know that we know, it may strike two ways:
- If they do have contact with them, we have given up valuable information (that we know it) and I highly doubt that they will give us contact with Apolyton (Would we give it to them?).
- If they do not have contact with them, and figures out that we think they have, they may use it against us. Telling us of alliances or otherwise mislead us with false information.

I believe you are thinking the same as me, FortyJ, but just to clear it up a little, we must ask the question in a way that will not make them sucpiscious of anything. ie, an opening-line with: "Do you know anyone else?" would not be a good start the way I see it.

Information rules
"If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle." - Sun Tzu

 

[FortyJ]

Cheetah
You are 100% correct. A direct opening question such as that would certainly tip our hand. The best way to handle such an inquiry would be off-handedly (and in actuality, face to face, but that's not possible under these circumstances) near the end of the conversation.... "...oh, by the way... have you met anyone else yet?"

In a face-to-face dialog, the truth could be found in the honest, instantaneous reaction in our adversary's face. However, since we can't do face-to-face under this current system, this ploy becomes a crap-shoot in a way. Catch him off guard, or during a moment of distraction and you walk away a winner. Don't, and you're walking away empty-handed.

But remember, in this case, if we do not get confirmation from this ploy, we will be able to use it later on to justify our declaration of war.

 

[Cheetah]

Hm, how do you think we could justify it?

"You lied to us! You deserve to die!" ?

or something a little more - civilized?

 

[eyrei]

Originally posted by Cheetah
Hm, how do you think we could justify it?

"You lied to us! You deserve to die!" ?

or something a little more - civilized?

How about "You got a better starting position than we did. You must die!"

 

[FortyJ]

Originally posted by eyrei
How about "You got a better starting position than we did. You must die!"

I think that's my new favorite PTW line. Mind if I use that?

But, on a serious note, any untruths, misleading statements, or attempts to otherwise deal unfairly with us can go a long way in the court of public opinion. Common sense and fair play would lead one to believe that a team that deals unfairly will be less likely to receive any support than one respects their neighbors.

 

[FortyJ]

Online Strategy Meeting!

What: Strategy Meeting
Why: To discuss options for dealing with the Gamecatcher Alliance Threat
When: Thursday, 3 April 2003 @ 2100 EST (that's 9pm )
Where: #MSDG_CFC (password: victory)
Who: All CFC MSDG team members are invited to attend

The room will be moderated, but all citizens will be allowed, and encouraged, to participate in the discussion. See you there!