Change district scaling to the total sci/cul accumulation rather than number of completed techs/cvcs

Velvet glove

Chieftain
Joined
Dec 2, 2019
Messages
74
One of the silly things I find myself doing is leaving techs one turn from completion if I don't need them immediately to avoid the district and tile cost scaling. So instead I think this would work better:
  • There are 69 techs and 55 civics.
  • Each tech/civic adds 1/69 or 1/55 of the max scaling as it does now.
  • However a partially completed tech at say 30% would still add 30% of its 1/69th to scaling, as opposed to nothing as it does now.
  • This makes it pointless to leave a tech one turn from completion as it will still add nearly all of its effect to the scaling, and one can simply focus on what one is researching instead of doing gamey optimisations.
  • I think only techs where active contribution has been made should count, so activated eurekas/inspirations should not count until one starts working on the tech, at which point they start counting as a part of the full progress made in that tech/civic.
 
i agree in some way but not entirely.

for me district cost should not scale based on tech that doesnt affect them. only architectural tech should count.

in my view, the cost of building increasing would be because of new needs: better roads or larger roads, higher buildings, better foundation for higher (or heavier) buildings, ...

each of those tech could give a bonus, like +0.33 housing per district (an equal to the card that give +1 housing if you got 3 districts, making that card an early bonus)

in that case district that have been built before those tech could be renovate to updated standard using some production.

the production cost would remain the same. for old district you would spread the price between eras while new district would need to pay full price.

it's like building a district for 60 prod then making 3 separate renovation that cost 20 prod. that would make the final cost of a district be 120 prod. building a new district would then cost you 120 prod.
 
One of the silly things I find myself doing is leaving techs one turn from completion if I don't need them immediately to avoid the district and tile cost scaling.

I think that's the point of district scaling - to make you think (more) about how you want to progress on the tech tree. I go back and forth on if it's a good point depending on how interested i am at the moment about min/maxing.

in my view, the cost of building increasing would be because of new needs: better roads or larger roads, higher buildings, better foundation for higher (or heavier) buildings, ...

I agree. Something to keep the immersion up.
 
One of the silly things I find myself doing is leaving techs one turn from completion if I don't need them immediately to avoid the district and tile cost scaling. So instead I think this would work better:
Under the hood, ideally whatever they scale it off of will be easily computable with available information. It turns out that you can just grab the number of techs & civics a player has researched. Not to say the current method is perfect, but, the way they did it is relatively clean. It's only something to game if you know the formula (which is never explicitly put in front of the player) and even then, the benefit isn't that high compared to something simple like pre placing districts once you have the pop.
If anything, I feel the fact that players are sometimes willing to game cost scaling like this points to too many techs being effectively filler and low value. Not all techs need to be on the level of industrialization, but they should all do something that makes you want them.

I think that's the point of district scaling
Districts, chop value, and unit & building cost all follow the same trend (go from to 1 to 10x between ancient and info era.) Chops follow the same formula as a district. The reason they scale it up is to prevent the absolute oppression that a tech lead would give you otherwise- a unit upgrade is +10:c5strength: per era. With no cost inflation, simply unlocking the next era of units would basically be increasing your military power by +50%. Plus, you economy grows with tech & time too, so they have to tie the cost of stuff with city productivity and size to keep numbers sane. I think late game units are fine, although late game infrastructure is perhaps too costly since the scale of the benefits from buildings follows a much shallower progression.

Insofar as what ought to be, the first thing to think about is whether it should scale continuously or based on some discrete factors. The tech scaling we have now does give a nice upward trend, but while in aggregate a player's economy grows continuously, per city productivity doesn't (it jumps at certain techs,) and this is usually where the big disconnect with players happens. Ex: It's the industrial era and suddenly my little size 5 town says it needs 40 turns to build a campus. What?!

I also happen to think the wrong thing is scaling: if you look at building costs, despite a minor tweak they made last year, all buildings (and units!) were originally priced based specifically on what column of the tech tree they appear in. Completely divorced from function. So, a Library cost 60:c5production: but a workshop cost 180:c5production:, despite both giving +2 yield. So it almost seems like buildings should be scaling and not districts! Because I hold other opinions on the district subject it would take a long time to come up with a well laid out idea on how it could be improved, but loosely I think tying things to government tiers and eras has better potential.
 
Yes, the scaling mechanism is far from perfect especially when it comes to conquered cities - they are essentially free and come with districts that you don't need to build, integrate instantly if you just sort out the loyalty and without disadvantages. Much better scaling and balancing should be possible but given that if it's a major overhaul it probably won't be implemented, my thought was that a very minor tweak of the current system can make things better. Although here the benefit is minor so I guess also not worth implementing.

It's actually the pre-placing of the districts that makes me do the tech juggling. If I have a city that will reach pop 4 in a few turns and the current tech isn't a prerequisite for the next I'm going to do and not needed immediately, I'd switch so that it's slightly cheaper to place the district. But this effort would be saved if it didn't matter whether techs were completed or not, and it's still quite easy to calculate: each tech adds 54*9/69=~7 production to a district so if your current science per turn is 1/10 of the tech your are researching the district costs will be increasing at 0.7 per turn.

But the point that many techs feel like filler techs is very valid. Even more so for the civics.
 
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