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City Size

Discussion in 'Civ3 - General Discussions' started by wgauld, Nov 15, 2006.

  1. wgauld

    wgauld Chieftain

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    I generally allow cities to grow as large as they want, but I have read a few posting suggesting restricting city size to 12. What advantages does this provide.
     
  2. thetrooper

    thetrooper Schweinhund

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    It's not the city size they want to restrict, it's all about placing cities closer together: CxxC. To use every tile available. As a result of this, cities rarely get past size 12 anyway. Why spend gpt on hospitals?

    btw - I prefer a mix of CxxxC and CxxC.
     
  3. wgauld

    wgauld Chieftain

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    man alive I am spreading my cities too far apart (i kinda thought that anyway). So the CxxC formation is that both east west and north south.
     
  4. thetrooper

    thetrooper Schweinhund

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    I don't say that you should do this as a strict mathematical exercise. Try CxxxC for a while. What are you doing now? CxxxxC? You waste tiles that way. Depends on food and many other things.
     
  5. thetrooper

    thetrooper Schweinhund

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  6. Decebalus

    Decebalus Chieftain

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    I use a mix of CxxC and CxxxC, almost never CxxxxC. But often offset, not on the same line. This packs them even better. As everyone said you never have to worry about letting tiles go to waste, and you can fit more cities in the same area than you could before.

    I tend to use CxxxC on the core cities since I know they will eventually get very powerful, big and productive, but CxxC for the fringe cities that will most likely be full of corruption later.

    However, you can grow them to be bigger than 12 you just have to be wise about how you improve the terrain. Irrigate a few grasslands, mine hills to makeup for the difference in shields. As the city grows I find that I sometimes I need to change a mined grassland to an irrigated one. It's ok, as long as overal production stays the same or goes up.
     
  7. Bartleby

    Bartleby Remembers laughter

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    Don't forget to ICS the Tundra!
     
  8. thetrooper

    thetrooper Schweinhund

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    And the desert unless you're agri!
     
  9. Bartleby

    Bartleby Remembers laughter

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    Sometimes I will ICS jungles, until I have spare workers.
     
  10. AutomatedTeller

    AutomatedTeller Frequent poster

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    You don't have to ics desert, even if you arent' agri. You just can't grow cities large until rails though. You do have to ics tundra, because you can't get tundra to 2 food.

    allowing cities to go to size 13 or beyond is useful, for 3 reasons, and a pain for 2 reasons:

    It allows for more unit support under most governments.
    It gives you more gold and shields from the center square
    it allows you more specialists, which is especially useful in highly corrupt cities, making them tremendously productive.
    you have to research or trade for hospitals
    It creates pollution.

    In general, you usually only get a lot of value from metros if you are either doing a milk run to get the highest score, or if you want to do research deep in the modern age, like with a spaceship.

    You do get a more efficient empire by having fewer cities that are metros over a given area of land - there is less corruption and less maintenance cost, though support costs may be higher.
     
  11. Mirc

    Mirc Not mIRC!!!

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    Also, just to add to what the others said, if you restrict it to size 12 you don't have to build a hospital. ;)
     
  12. thetrooper

    thetrooper Schweinhund

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    I did in post #2 damnit! :mad:

    ;)
     
  13. Mirc

    Mirc Not mIRC!!!

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    Eh, I didn't read every single word that was so deeply hidden in this thread, so sorry for posting what has been already said. ;)

    :D
     
  14. AutomatedTeller

    AutomatedTeller Frequent poster

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    a hospital is 2GPT.
    A metro adds 1 or 2 commerce to the central square (depending on whether the civ is commercial or not), plus adds a shield.

    If you can add 1 taxcollector to your city and the city is reasonably uncorrupt, then going to size 13 may be a benefit to the civilization. Or may not. If you can add a bunch of specialists, then it may be a large benefit.
     
  15. Decebalus

    Decebalus Chieftain

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    It's the specialists that make it all worth it. After irrigating almost everything and with RRs I've had cities that went up to 20+. And usually about 4-6 of the population were not really needed to work any tiles.

    In the later game I could then use them as either taxmen (2 gold a piece very nice) or if I needed something built quickly as engineers (2 shields a piece). If not, as scientists to get those extra techs.

    All my core cities in any given game (between 5-10) usually make it to this status by the end.
     
  16. MAS

    MAS Deity

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    But you forget, A hospital not only costs gpt upkeep, it also costs shields!
    You'll have (more) pollution!

    And most important of all! More happiness problems!

    My advice would be to give your core and semi-core cities room for 12 tiles, and place your outer cities in ICS style.

    Build a hospital in cities where the extra city size will help you reach a certain point in shields-per-turn to make endgame units (or space-ship parts) in less turns.

    For example, if a unit costs 120 shields (I'm pulling this number from thin air, it is just an example), and the city is producing 59 non-corrupt shields, it will build this unit in 3 turns, if size 12+ means you will get enough extra non-corrupt shields to make the unit in 2 turns, then the hospital is great.
    But if the city was producing 40 non-corrupt shields, and the hospital wouldn't result in 20 extra non-corrupt shields, then it is a waste.

    Keep in mind that increasing the population in this case would also mean you have to re-organize the population in other cities. witch could result in other cities producing units in more turns.
    Leaving room free for your cities to grow would mean you are using less of your land in the early stages of the game.
    This is worse than Ginger's guide would have you believe, because the early turns are more important than later turns. Because of the exponential growth factor.
     

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