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City Strength

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by Victoria, Jun 30, 2017.

  1. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Just done knights... count as Melee, CBA posting resuilts ubnless people really want them
    Will test light cav, scouts and Rangers next. I guess I will have to check all the special units after that.
     
  2. myclan

    myclan Chieftain

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    So it is more effective to break the wall with Field Cannons than frigates, but frigates are more effective to take a city without a wall?
     
  3. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Chieftain

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    It seems that you have been working on some already known features.

    Furthermore I'd like to point out that Wall Damage and Garrison damage are independent from each other, which indicates that it generates a number (random damage factor) from 0.75 to 1.25 twice, one applies for wall damage, while the other applies for the garrison damage. Then focus on the widely known formula that garrison damage is actually reduced by current outer defense %.

    What is unknown is how much does the repair work cost and how does the outer defense system works when you try to build a new wall when the current one is damaged. Please figure that out.
     
  4. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I really do not care if something is "widely known". It is also widely known that district discounts are based on the average districts of all players but is incorrect. If you are going to write something you need to validate it first. Also I did not know about garrison damage so clearly a guide is needed

    0.75 to 1.25 seems incorrect and was more correctly assessed to be 24-36 as per Hans Lemurson figures out the Combat Formula.... that why validation from lots of people help

    Sure on the walls, glad to help.

    @myclan the only difference between ranged land and ranged sea is that ranged sea is not -17 strength versus any type of city. If the land and sea ranged had the same value it would be better in either walled or non walled to use naval.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
  5. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Chieftain

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    It's sure that in Civ5 that was 24~36, which indicates that 0.8~1.2 times the basic number.
     
  6. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Well you seem to have got your 0.75 - 1.25 from the same thread but just not read as well
    No idea why you mention civ V, Hans agrees on the 80-120 for civ 6 so good by me.
    I will try and check out the power dampener param at some stage, all takes time.

    I've done a few quick tests, getting the walls right with firetuner is a bit annoying as is waiting 3 turns to fix the damage
    Just some initial tests on ancient and medieval walls indicate its 1 production per 10 damage points (tests to 9 & 11 and 139 & 141 damage) and the cost does not increase with wall level, era or techs / civics ... but just some quick tests. Quite consistent
    The other part of your question will take some time and kids now have awoken so not chance to use PC
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
  7. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Managed to force the kids to make lunch and run so,me quick tests

    @Lily_Lancer for the question
    I damage my ancient wall by 25 HP and its going to cost 2 prod to repair. My Medieval walls show greyed and state I need ancient walls before I can build Medieval. Regardless of what I try, I can only build my Medieval walls once I repair my ancient walls
    Once I build my Medieval walls I damage them by 25 HP and it shows they will cost 2 prod to repair. Once I have Seige tactics my Renaissance walls and Medieval walls are both greyed out saying they need ancient walls to be built until I repair my walls and then I can build renaissance walls.

    My city strength at this stage shows 19
    +10 for my warrior strength -10
    +3 for my palace guard
    +1 for my ancient walls
    +2 for my Medieval walls
    +3 for my Renaissance walls

    I now damage my renaissence walls by 39 HP (repair Cost 3cprod) and give myself Civil Engineering
    My walls stay damaged but now have 161 HP which can be repaired to 200 for the cost of 3 prod

    If I now create a Modern armour Army and move it into my city, my city has 116 strength (107 for the armour, 3 for palace guard and 6 for my walls) and my walls in total cost 3 maintenance for that additional +6 strength

    Hopefully that answered your queries.... any others?

    I'm going to see how towers change crossbow damage next
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
    Photi likes this.
  8. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Chieftain

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    This is good. It seems that fixing outside defense does not cost many production.

    Could you do a further version with encampment? In fact I'd like to know is the case that both the Encampment defense and the city defense is damaged,
    and the case that one of them not damaged. What will the cost of fixing refer to?

    I guess you can build medival walls if you city's wall not damaged but encampment wall damaged, what will happen to the encampment's defense when you finish your building ?
     
  9. Canadian Bluebeer

    Canadian Bluebeer Chieftain

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    Ranged strength is an odd one as well. (see my cursing in the all tech/civics vids).
    Cities hit like wet noodles for a while, even with modern walls.
    (hitting a barb warrior for 4 damage. huh?)

    Get a ranger from a hut? They hit harder. Build helicopters? Not so much at all.
    Upgrade the warrior to mech? um.

    "Once they have at least Ancient Walls, any city and its corresponding Encampment district gain a ranged strike with Ranged Strength equal to that of the strongest unit your civilization possesses...."

    um, no, it does not seem to work quite like that.
     
  10. Locke_Daemonfire

    Locke_Daemonfire Chieftain

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    I believe it's more accurately 'ranged strength equal to that of the strongest ranged strength amongst units your civ has ever possessed.'
     
  11. Lily_Lancer

    Lily_Lancer Chieftain

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    It is tied to the most powerful ranged unit you have built/upgraded.
    IF you haven't built any, your ranged power will be 3. A 3-strength ranged strike can never do noticeable damage.
     
  12. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    If you are building walls and have never built an archer, I suggest you build one especially to shoot yourself.
    Ranged ships also will be used if stronger, frigate rush can be handy in this way.

    Sure, I can try. The city is easy with world builder as you can choose how much to damage walls, I am not sure encampments will be so easy but it needs knowing so will sort something out
     
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  13. Canadian Bluebeer

    Canadian Bluebeer Chieftain

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    'bout what I figured.

    In the all tech/civics, I don't build ranged for a bit. Just choppers.
    Then it's RA or a Missile Cruiser/Nukesub.
    :D
     
  14. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    So I will have to run through a dual hot seat tonight to test encampments. Worldbuiler lets me reduce the garrison of an encampment but not the walls.
    I tried dumping 2 enemy catapults and 3 warriors and 3 archers near my encampment a few times, they just scattered... damn silly AI
     
  15. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    @Lily_Lancer
    Encampments work in exactly the same way as city walls
    1 prod per 10 HP to repair
    Walls must be repaired before you can upgrade them
    If both walls are damaged only the most expensive (if you can call it that) counts.
    3 complete turns without attack before you can repair them.


    upload_2017-7-10_22-16-3.png

    upload_2017-7-10_22-25-4.png
     
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  16. myclan

    myclan Chieftain

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    I had found it in one of my game I just use my battleship to continue to bombard an already 0hp city for XP and then found the city strength showed beside the bar become a negative number. I hover on it and found the hp of the city also become a negative number, quite fun.
     
  17. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    I have not encountered this, normally when it gets to 0 it stops and no more XP is gained, weird
     
  18. myclan

    myclan Chieftain

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    I reload my game but just can't make it happen again. Maybe just an occasional bug. And it showed a bigger number than -10 for damaged district.
     
  19. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Yes some bugs are like that, annoying
     
  20. DarwinMayflower

    DarwinMayflower Chieftain

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    Thank you for the good work on city strength. I am new to Civ VI, so forgive the ignorance, but what are the advantages of having a combat unit inside a city under attack. The walls HP is not based units, the city HP are always 200, and the Combat Strength of the city is just based on the best unit owned by the civ, unless there is an army or corp as garrison. If a city with walls (or civil defense) has a unit within the city, does it get a separate attack aside from the city's ranged attack? A city without walls has no ranged attack on its own, so is a garrisoned unit able to attack during the civ's turn? When the city is attacked, what happens to a garrisoned unit when the city health points are brought to zero? Does the attacking civ have to defeat the unit within the city after reducing the city to 0 Health Points? Or is the garrisoned unit represented by the city HP, i.e. when the city HP is reduced to 0, is the garrisoned unit is destroyed?
     

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