Civ 2 vs. Civ 4

Which is better?


  • Total voters
    69

Civman33

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Civ II was said to be the, "Most epic, exciting civ game ever." But when Civ IV came out, the 2's popularity began to change. Now, the 2 will battle for which is better. Civ II, or Civ IV...

BTW, off topic here... Look at my avatar and above! Just look at it!!! Lol...
 
Obviouly going to be some bias in the civ IV forum lol.

Anywho I loved civ 2, but civ 4 has so many different concepts and gameplay options it's very, very easy for me to say civ IV wins.
 
I LOVED Civ 2! It was, at the time, my most played game ever! Yet, I don't go back to it now.

Civ 4: I was pretty lukewarm about. I gradually grew to respect it, even like it. Now I play Civ 4 and it's mods almost exclusively. I doubt I'll ever go back to the old games. But I don't love it, it's more a long-term friendship than Civ 2's mad whirlwind of gaming.

So it's hard to say which was the better overall: I was a young teenager with Civ2 - it wasn't my first love (Civ 1) was that - but it was the real thing. Au revoir, Civ 2.
 
I enjoyed Civ2 and also enjoy Civ4. However at the time Civ2 was a well developed game that used the machine (windows) well.

However while Civ4 is a better game, it stands on the shoulder of Civ2 and has more mediocre qualities -

1. The python environment make my machine (a pentium Core2) slow to 386 speeds - Civ2 maps were bigger, but the machine never slowed to a crawl like Civ4.

2. Civ2 counters were easy to see - compared to Civ4's camouflaged units that really can hide in the tree's - a BIG user interface design fault.

3. In Civ2 (hell even in Civ1 !) the game focus stayed with units in an area - by which I mean if you had two islands it stepped you though unit moves on one island (or geographical region) andonly then moved to the the next region - In Civ4 you lurch all over - you apply the siege for one attack then your next focus is on a unit you are moving to garrison on the other side of the globe - if something attracts my attention there I may forget to go back to the first location - didn't happen in Civ1 or Civ2.

So saying Civ4 is better than Civ2 is saying that any contemporary physics graduate is a better physicist that Albert Einstein or Isaac Newton. They're not.

I vote Civ2, even though I accept I play more Civ 4 at the moment - relative to the time era's Civ2 was a more creative game with fewer serious and unnecessary flaws.
 
Civ4. I enjoy that you can ignore half the aspects of the game entirely and get a win out of leveraging one or two. I don't feel as railroaded into specific strategies.

Now as to whether Civ4 would beat a fixed Master of Magic without the bugs and with a decent AI... ah well.
 
Now as to whether Civ4 would beat a fixed Master of Magic without the bugs and with a decent AI... ah well.

Hmm, thats a tough one MoM had too many buildings, but the empire variability, even back then, was awesome.

Imagine applying the Civ4 regime to it , without the naff bits :eek:
 
I completely wasted a few years of my life playing 2. I'm playing 4 nowadays, but not nearly as much. May have something to do with being a teenager vs. being a responsible adult.
 
The Cultural boarders alone make Civ4 so much better, in Civ 2 it was just silly if a 'friend' settled on 'your' land all the time.
 
I spent years playing Civ2 and became a master at all levels. I could basically crush my opponents on any map, any game. It was definitely my favorite for a long time. As someone suggested, at the time it was very cutting edge and provided a variety of experiences that previous sim games - like SimCity2000 which was also cutting edge at its time - couldn't match.

What happened then was Civ3 came out, which was a horribly flawed "upgrade" but included brand new ideas that revolutionized Civ. In my mind the 2 most important improvements were cultural borders and the advanced handling of natural resources. If you recall, Civ2 had none of this iron, copper, banana, clam crap going on. The land was very bland and you could found a city virtually anywhere and make it florish. Military promotions were also taken to another level since in Civ2 you only had veteran and non-veteran units.

Civ4 is flat out way more complex and challenging, not to mention better graphics. It's really tough to win games on the higher levels which was not the case with Civ2. As someone else suggested, you also have a wide range of methods for winning the game and you can be really creative with your approach.

In Civ2 every game was pretty much the same progression: found a LOT of cities, breed a LOT of caravans so you can snag every single wonder in the game, use the Great Library to grab a smothering tech lead and go step on your opponents' throats. The question was never IF your opponents would die, but WHEN. Civ2 became just too easy even on deity.

So my vote goes to Civ4 for its creativity, challenge, flexibility for the player, and the fact that it's a clear upgrade over Civ2...an honor that Civ3 could not claim.
 
Ohhh... Tough one...

Civ II's classic feel, its reliability, the depth, the charm...

Civ IV's new age graphics, the vast wealth of content, the great charm, fantastic music...

You know, Civ IV wins, but Civ II is still one of the greatest games ever made.
 
I just voted that Civ 2 is better than Civ 4. But I should say that it MAY be better than Civ 4, if properly customized, in my view. Here’s why:
-First of all, Civ 2 is the most easily modded game I’ve ever seen. Which makes it easy to adapt to anyone’s particular taste.
-Secondly, because of this factor it’s easy to address the main issue: that it’s easy to win once you’re experienced, even at deity level. There are many ways to go about this, and I don’t think that is the case with Civ 4, which is more limited in this sense.
-Specifically, one way to make it awfully difficult to win is to add one hugely expensive, highly powerful, highly desirable unit or two. Since the AI will always create the best available unit, with little concern for cost (everything is cheaper for the AI), they can have hordes of say, very fast, powerful cavalry attacking your empire in mid-game, or very strong, super-destructive bombers for late-game situations. Of course, the human player can also build these units but, given that the AI advantage in building costs, this is a definite AI boost. Effectively, you can make the game as hard for you as you want. I don’t think you can do this in Civ 4.
-Another way: use the cheat menu at the very start. I recently did a test, in which I put every single ruler (playing 7 civs) against me, by clicking on the revenge square. I was lucky in the initial setup of this game, and later during gameplay, so it looks as if I’m going to win as of 1930 (but I also have super-bombers set up in this game, that haven’t appeared yet). If I still win this one, my next test will be to have every AI ruler at 90% hostility against me (or higher). Which is sort of simulating what happens when you play against humans… I haven’t played Civ 4 that much (I uninstalled the game years ago) but, again, I don’t think you can turn the AI there into vicious competitors, at least without some more complicated tweaking.
-Beyond the issue of how hard it is to win, there are other advantages to Civ 2. One is simplicity: it’s just easier to keep track of everything that’s going on, and focus on the hard choices of strategy, beyond tactics. Civ 4 is more comprehensive, has more info all over the place, and more choices, which is good, but takes up more time to ponder the implications of any big move, like declaring war, or devoting resources to such and such region, as opposed to another. Another issue is the absence of the feel-good stuff, like the possibility of achieving victory by cultural superiority. Even if it made any sense (which it doesn’t), I personally find it boring to win a game that way.
-Colonialism. Since Civ 3, colonizing enterprises are awfully difficult. It’s possible to go out and found far-flung colonies, but it is much harder. And the AI in Civ 3 and Civ 4 expands fast, covering the entire map soon. In Civ 2, playing in the largest map, there’s always empty land at any point in the game so, if you want to, you can start new colonies from scratch even in the 20th century. This is more fun, as it always gives you an incentive to spread your units around, and is also more realistic. Historically speaking, colonization wasn’t as hard as it is in Civ 3 and Civ 4. For example, a bunch of Spaniards took over most of the Americas with relatively little fighting, because of significant tech superiority and the effect of their viruses on the local population. By leaving lots of space empty, Civ 2 addresses this reality better (without the need for actual killer viruses).
Anyway, just my view. Both are great games really; and maybe recent modding of Civ 4 has made it more to my liking.
 
I'm pretty sure I've spent more time playing Master of Magic (and/or Orion) than any of the civs. But the civ 2 and the ToT sci-fi scenario still tops civ 4 in my humble book...
 
-Specifically, one way to make it awfully difficult to win is to add one hugely expensive, highly powerful, highly desirable unit or two. Since the AI will always create the best available unit, with little concern for cost (everything is cheaper for the AI), they can have hordes of say, very fast, powerful cavalry attacking your empire in mid-game, or very strong, super-destructive bombers for late-game situations. Of course, the human player can also build these units but, given that the AI advantage in building costs, this is a definite AI boost. Effectively, you can make the game as hard for you as you want. I don’t think you can do this in Civ 4.
Welcome to CFC

Just so you know you can easily create your own difficulty level in civ4 by opening C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Assets\XML\GameInfo\CIV4HandicapInfo.xml" . ( Or "....\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Beyond The Sword\Assets\..." if you have BTS) Also there is a "Better AI" mod for civ4.

I haven’t played Civ 4 that much (I uninstalled the game years ago) but, again, I don’t think you can turn the AI there into vicious competitors, at least without some more complicated tweaking.
Ctrl W to bring up worldbuilder then pick "diplomacy mode" icon to adjust not only each AI attitude toward your civ but toward each other as well.
 
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