Civ 5: Civilizations/Leaders Wanted!

[chrissifniotis]

Still toying with this kind of idea:

UA: Your Great Admirals can also perform actions of a Great Merchant, and vice versa.

(Note: Only 1 action and they're consumed)

Another UA component:

UA: Technologies that unlock naval units are researched 33% faster.

Would these 2 together be overpowered?

I really don't like the idea of replacing two great people for one 'super person', too powerful to use, and the first UA turns two great people into two kinds of one super person. As for the +1/3 science for naval unit techs, I did some research; 10 technologies would be affected out of 80 - or 12.5% of the tech tree. I think that's a bit overpowered too.

As for the Feitoria idea, I think I have it;
UI - Feitoria, replacing the Great Merchant's Customs House
the Feitoria is a VERY unique tile improvement, it's the only TI that can be built outside your territory and more specifically inside the borders of a city-state. The Feitoria actually has two abilities; one for internal revenue, and another for external transactions with your allies.
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Firstly, the base revenue of a Feitoria increases to 5 Gold (4 + 1), how the Feitoria is used afterward changes the bonus yield. The Feitoria also increases the defensive properties of the tile by 25% and all units stationed in or next to it heal 50% quicker.
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The internal properties of the Feitoria are for revenue raising and increasing the likelihood of Great Merchants. The Feitoria produces 1 extra Gold for every 5 Production (the number is subject to change) produced from all the tiles on and around the Feitoria in a 1 tile radius. The Feitoria also produces 1 Great Merchant point for every 2 Water tiles next to the Fetoria in the same radius. The restrictions on the Feitoria inside your borders are that it needs to be built on the coast and next to a coastal city, meaning that in any usual game only two tiles can be used for a Feitoria around any given city radius, there are rare cases of greater capacity so the Feitoria is also unable to be built on tiles with a resource on it - at all!
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The external properties of a Feitoria are for influence management and trading extra luxuries. The Feitoria in a friendly or greater city-state provides 1 extra Gold as a flat bonus rate. When a Great Merchant builds a Feitoria on a friendly or better city-state's coast, the action itself produces a lump sum of 12 Influence - similar to killing a barb next to the borders - and afterwards reduces the rate of Influence decay by 25%. A Feitoria also increases the Influence gained from gifted Gold to the city-state by 1/3 (33%). Last of all the Feitoria can establish one random Luxury Resource to be produced outright from the tile improvement, unable to grant any yield bonus but doubling the Happiness from any and all Luxury Resources traded from the city-state. The restrictions of the Feitoria outside your borders are that only one Feitoria is allowed per city-state. You cannot enter a war with the city-state. Most importantly, if the city-state is annexed, puppeted or risen by another civilization the tile improvement is destroyed.

I know it's very complex, especially given its dual properties, but how is this one, or should I ask how overpowering is it?

 

[OmniPotent42]

I don't know about you guys, but I would like to see some shorter-lived countries in the mix of civilizations, such as the Confederacy, the Republic of Texas, and maybe some other rebel forces. I already have an idea for Texas:

The Republic of Texas
Leader: Sam Houston
UA: Remember the Alamo! - Forts and Citadels grant +100% and +150% defensive bonuses, respectively. Oil and oil wells are researched at Steam Power and oil rigs provide +5 gold as well as the normal production bonus. Becomes obselete at Information Era.
UB: Saloon, replaces Theater. Grants +4 happiness instead of 3 and is maintenence free.
UU: Frontiersman, replaces rifleman. Doesn't count towards military unit maintenance.

 

[Nyanko]

I know it's very complex, especially given its dual properties, but how is this one, or should I ask how overpowering is it?

You should avoid complex when designing something for a video game. Not saying its not a good idea; just saying simplicity is easier.

 

[Liex]

I did like the idea of a UI that is built in a CS and improves the relations with it, among other things. The Feitoria would fit this kind of UI, indeed. But the one you suggested is quite complex for a single unique feature.

 

[chrissifniotis]

You should avoid complex when designing something for a video game. Not saying its not a good idea; just saying simplicity is easier.

Yea, thanks for the comments, I completely agree with yours and Liex's points, I'd prefer simplicity. The problem I find is the usability of a city-state tile improvement from a Great Merchant, mainly how can I compose a reasonable tile improvement for city-states, when the idea of the tile improvement is to be used internally? I suppose with some fine tuning I can better work the idea to work purely inside city-state borders, but I still feel some compensation is needed to fill a slot for internal revenue, I might fix it up a bit either during lunch or after work.

 

[Kurtbob]

I also like the idea of the Fretoria being a UI that can be built in a CS. However, though a historically accurate depiction, I'm not really digging the Fretoria replacing the Customs House. The three current UIs do not replace anything and neither should the Fretoria, IMO. I think workers (and possibly a UU or all Portugese units through a UA bonus) should build Fretorias, not Great People. Perhaps we are placing too much emphasis on Great Merchants in these ideas?

Fretoria ideas:

Available with Guilds/Banking/Compass (which?). Can only be built in City-States. +15% defense on this tile. When built on a Luxury or Strategic resource, double that resource's yield (will replace any previous improvement). The double yield is lost when a Fretoria is not within a City-states borders (after conquest). While your unit is fortified on the Fretoria your influence resting place is increased to 15 with that City State (stacks with Papacy Primacy and Aesthetics, doesn't stack with multiple Fretorias).

Who should build a Fretoria?
Workers - of course, but maybe not. A unique non worker could be far more fun and limiting.

A UU like the Carrack (Naus) could be a fun option, though it would be strange to be able to build a UI on an adjacent tile. Perhaps an explorer unit (replacement for Scout or another melee unit?) that can move freely through CS borders without harming relations.

A UA that states all melee units can build Fretorias could be nice, but would make Fretorias far to easy to build and fortify.

 

[Liex]

Fretoria ideas:

Available with Guilds/Banking/Compass (which?). Can only be built in City-States. +15% defense on this tile. When built on a Luxury or Strategic resource, double that resource's yield (will replace any previous improvement). The double yield is lost when a Fretoria is not within a City-states borders (after conquest). While your unit is fortified on the Fretoria your influence resting place is increased to 15 with that City State (stacks with Papacy Primacy and Aesthetics, doesn't stack with multiple Fretorias).

But, if another player allies with the CS, then he'd benefit from the Feitoria's doubled resources as well, wouldn't he?

The increased Resting Point while fortifying the tile is a nice idea, but I'd increase the Combat bonus to 50%, so the Feitoria could be as effective as a Fort.

Another possibility is to transfer the tile's yields (food, production and gold) to the Portuguese Capital.

 

[NJC]

Personally,i always thought Israel should've been a nation in civilization, they have had a large ancient (other than religous influence they formerly held a formidable kingdom under King David and Soloman) and modern impact on the world.

Faction: Israel

Leader: King David or Soloman

Special Traid: (the promise land) gain faith points twice as fast, Inquisitors have greater difficulty in rooting out their religion and spy's cost half

special unit: any ideas?

special building: any ideas?

Moderator Action: Merged into the main thread about new civs.

 

[NJC]

unit: replace spy with mossad agents that are more effective than other agents

 

[Peng Qi]

I don't know about you guys, but I would like to see some shorter-lived countries in the mix of civilizations, such as the Confederacy, the Republic of Texas, and maybe some other rebel forces. I already have an idea for Texas:

The Republic of Texas
Leader: Sam Houston
UA: Remember the Alamo! - Forts and Citadels grant +100% and +150% defensive bonuses, respectively. Oil and oil wells are researched at Steam Power and oil rigs provide +5 gold as well as the normal production bonus. Becomes obselete at Information Era.
UB: Saloon, replaces Theater. Grants +4 happiness instead of 3 and is maintenence free.
UU: Frontiersman, replaces rifleman. Doesn't count towards military unit maintenance.

I suggested a Confederate States idea a while back:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=11596089#post11596089

 

[gunho730]

I think Canada's music theme should be Oh Canada without words.

 

[Kurtbob]

But, if another player allies with the CS, then he'd benefit from the Feitoria's doubled resources as well, wouldn't he?

The increased Resting Point while fortifying the tile is a nice idea, but I'd increase the Combat bonus to 50%, so the Feitoria could be as effective as a Fort.

Another possibility is to transfer the tile's yields (food, production and gold) to the Portuguese Capital.

Yes, another player would benefit from the double resource. I intended it that way, but after thinking it over, it doesn't make much sense considering Siam, Greece, and Austria receive their Ciy-state bonuses without having to build a UI that can possibly give their competitors advantages. Not very practical.

A 50% defense bonus makes sense.

Transferring tile yields could be nifty, but what would stop Portugal from building Fretorias upon every tile within a CS? Maybe limit the Fretoria to a specific type of tile(s)?

How about:
Fretorias can only be built upon Luxury and Strategic resources. May be built in City-States, replacing any improvement. Yields resource (even if within City-state). +50% defense. When your unit is fortified on the Fretoria within a City-state, your influence resting point with that city-state is increased by 15 (stacks with Papacy Primacy and Aesthetics, doesn't stack with multiple Fretorias). Fretorias within Allied City-states double their resource yield.

Strategy: You can take resources from CSs and deny them to other civs without being allied to the CS. Even if the CS declares war on you, you retain the resource so long as your unit holds the Fretoria. You receive an added bonus when you are allied with a city state, basically your Fretoria acts as a bazaar UI that works outside of your empire and doubles strategic resources as well as Luxury resources. You can also build them within your empire, but you are trading off extra bonuses that may come from mines/plantations/quarries/camps/buildings for additional defense. I think this idea could be pretty potent in the hands of the player.

 

[fuzzatron717]

I think Canada's music theme should be Oh Canada without words.

Very unfortunatly canada probably won't be in Austria took the canadian colors and they are never likely to get picked which sucks I want CANADA!!!

 

[aceflamingo23]

wat about mexico i mean it be so majorly beast i don see why it aint included. and what about the czech republic i think they deserve to be in it too am i right?

 

[fuzzatron717]

wat about mexico i mean it be so majorly beast i don see why it aint included. and what about the czech republic i think they deserve to be in it too am i right?

everyone deserves to be in but a lot of nations will never be included unless you want to count city-states and the czech republic is represented by the city-state of prague.

 

[awesome]

i was thinking that maybe portugal could form trade routes with allied city-states as/as part of its ua.

 

[Peng Qi]

i was thinking that maybe portugal could form trade routes with allied city-states as/as part of its ua.

Trade routes provide quite a lot of gold. It would need to be balanced carefully.

 

[Nyanko]

Personally,i always thought Israel should've been a nation in civilization, they have had a large ancient (other than religous influence they formerly held a formidable kingdom under King David and Soloman) and modern impact on the world.

Faction: Israel

Leader: King David or Soloman

Special Traid: (the promise land) gain faith points twice as fast, Inquisitors have greater difficulty in rooting out their religion and spy's cost half

special unit: any ideas?

special building: any ideas?

Moderator Action: Merged into the main thread about new civs.

There have been quite a few Isreali suggestions in this thread already, a few pages back (two, three) there was a nice long discussion on it where you could get ideas

 

[steveg700]

I have been meaning to post this up last week but managed to forget, and I did some tweaking to the UA to make it better - my Portugal idea;

Portugal - João II
Age of Discovery - Scouts gain 1 Movement and Naval units gain 1 Line of Sight. Double Gold from discovering City-States.
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Possible Unique Elements

Carrack, replacing the Caravel; 3-4 mased ship, large and provided lots of room. Used by the Portuguese and Spanish for exploration. Very likely.
- +1 Movement
x Consider ability to carry units

Stats;
135 Production (120 + 15)
20 Combat Strength
5 Movement (4 + 1)
-Promotions and Bonuses-
Extra Sight 1 (+1 with UA)
Withdraw before Melee
Can Carry 1 Scout
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Cassador, replacing the Musketman; Light infantry with strong attack but little defence. Possible.
- +4 Strength
- Defence Penalty

Stats;
150 Production or 300 Faith
28 Combat Strength (24 + 4)
2 Movement
-Promotions and Bonuses-
-1/3 Strength when Defending
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Ribauldequin, replacing the Cannon; Organ gun cannon, used to break infantry and cavalry lines. Range for the cannon was lesser than most.
- Bonus against Mounted and Gunpowder units
- -1 Range

Stats;
185 Production or 370 Faith
14 Combat Strength
20 Ranged Strength
1 Range (2 - 1)
2 Movement
-Promotions and Bonuses-
May Not Melee Attack
+200% Strength vs Cities
No Defensive Terrain Bonus
Must Set Up to Ranged Attack
NO Limited Visibility (This penalty is removed due to the Ribauldequin's small range)
'Organ Gun' (+1/3 Strength vs Mounted and Gunpowder units)

How is everything here? Especially the double gold bonus and the Ribauldequin unit with its balancing act of bonuses and penalties.

Seems similar to my idea for Portugal that's posted on the front page, but noticeably weaker, because it seems the improvements to exploration don't serve a strategy. You might find some extra goodies in the ancient era, and maybe net a small bit of gold from meeting CS's more quickly, but overall those are real game-changers.

I have the carrack and the caçadores, although they could stand to be updated post-G&K I suppose. I wouldn't readily associate the ribauldequin with the Portuguese, but maybe that's just lack of knowledge on my part.

And I confess I have second thoughts on the carrack. The caravel is in fact Portugal's major contribution to the age exploration, so it seems odd to deprive them of it. The carrack came somewhere between the caravel's innovation and the rise of the big galleons and frigates that would make it obsolete.

How about this:

UA: While you have a unit within a City-state's borders, your influence cannot decrease; you gain +1 influence a turn for every unit within the city-states borders in excess of the first.
To represent Portugese pressure to trade and influence other peoples.

UU: Naus (Carrack) - Replaces Galleass. Same stats but can enter ocean tiles and has +1 movement. Bonus to bullying City-states.
To represent Portugal's early lead in exlporing the oceans and its highly advanced naval technology. Naus were known for their extra cannons over the basic Carrack (Nau).

UI: Feitorious: Available at Banking. Can be built only on coastal tiles. Yields luxury and strategic resources it is built upon. +15% defense on this tile. +1 . Double heal rate of naval units within two hexes of the Feitorious (even if outside of empire's borders).
To represent Portugal's ability to protect its coast and trade interests through walled settlements/trade posts.

Well, it's obviously problematic to negate loss of CS influence (or even improve it) simply by parking units in their territory.

The idea of whether a feitoria should be a UB or UI is something I go back and forth on. The idea that it can improve a resource is interesting.

Carracks definitely came after the caravel, so it would be odd to introduce the former before the latter. To reflect Portugal's early entry to the age of exploration, I'd rather simply encourage players to beeline to that tech, which is why I gave a free merchant away with Astronomy.

 

[steveg700]

Very unfortunatly canada probably won't be in Austria took the canadian colors and they are never likely to get picked which sucks I want CANADA!!!

Don't lose hope. It's not like the Germans and Huns are easy to tell apart.