• 📚 A new project from the admin: Check out PictureBooks.io, an AI storyteller that lets you create personalized picture books for kids in seconds. Give it a try and let me know what you think!

Civ Discussion - Silla

bengalryan9

Emperor
Joined
Nov 13, 2018
Messages
1,194
Figured we might as well go back into the antiquity age and do the newest addition there before continuing through the modern age (where we’ll eventually get to the second new civ). They’ve only been out a couple of days but I think their kit is relatively easy to examine and most people probably chose them for their first post-patch game anyways, and while there is another thread about them that thread seems mostly focused on non-gameplay aspects. Today’s discussion is on the Silla. The Silla are a diplomatic and economic civilization with a starting bias towards grassland and rough terrain. Their associated wonder is Emile Bell, which gives a base +2 influence, rewards a diplomatic attribute point, and unlocks the unique Ginseng Agreement endeavor that grants food to both leaders’ cities. They only unlock one civ later on in the game – Mongolia.

Their unique ability is Maripgan, which gives +1 culture on resource tiles.
Their unique military unit is the Hwarang, a slinger replacement with an extra movement point, higher bombard strength, and which counts as a cavalry unit.
Their unique civilian unit is the Sangdaedeung, a merchant which gives +5 gold based on the relationship level you have with the target leader when creating a trade route.
Their unique buildings are the Lecture Hall (base +3 culture, bonus culture for adjacent wonders, and an extra resource slot if placed on rough terrain) and the Pagoda (base +3 happiness with bonus influence for adjacent mountains, natural wonders, or wonders), which together form the unique quarter the Sachal that gives increased gold for every resource you have slotted into that city.

Korean civics:
Kolp’um – unlocks the Beopseong tradition and forms a free trade route to the capital for each leader when you form an alliance. At mastery it unlocks the Lecture Hall and Pagoda, as well as grants culture equal to 25% of the target’s CS when a Hwarang defeats a unit.
Samguk Sagi – unlocks the Emile Bell and the Strategic Allies tradition, and at mastery gives +1 social policy slot.
Seonggol – unlocks the Sangdaedeung and The Golden Road tradition
Jingol – unlocks the Seorabeol tradition and gives +1 resource capacity to towns, and at mastery gives +5 land trade range to all settlements.

Korean traditions:
Beopseong – towns with a happiness building receive +2 happiness on resources
Strategic Allies – all trade routes between you and your allies award food and production equal to the trade route’s gold value
The Golden Road - +1 science for each imported resource
Seorabeol - +1 gold and influence on resources slotted into trade outposts or factory towns

What are your thoughts on the Silla? Are they strong, weak, or just right? Which areas do you think they excel in, and where do you find them lacking? Any interesting discoveries in your play time with them? Which leaders make for a good pairing, and which civs will you look to transition to in future ages? Let’s discuss!
 
I had an interesting first game as the Silla in that the map generator gave me a long east-to-west continent where I only had one neighbor (Augustus) and he was on the complete opposite end of the continent. This meant trade was difficult to establish for a long time and that I only had one potential ally, which meant that I didn't really get any use out of 3 of their 4 traditions. Safe to say that with the new map generation formula you may be rolling the dice a bit when you pick the Silla... will you spawn on a continent with a bunch of potential friends, or only one? Worth noting that you could compensate this by picking one of the older map scripts, though.

I think their unique ability, while maybe somewhat dull, is strong - that culture will go a long way in the early game and resources are all over the place. Ranged units with extra movement are always powerful so the Hwarang is good. I didn't get any real use out of the unique trader as mentioned above, and the buildings/quarter seem ok (not being able to get any bonus culture on the lecture hall kind of hurts it IMO). Emile Bell is nice since it got patched, though that is one wonder I never have any trouble building if I want it.

Will most likely need to give them another go in a game with more neighbors before I have a strong opinion on them either way, but I think they seem like a nice addition to the roster that should fit my preferred playstyle. Not sure who I'm going to transition to in the Exploration Age... the rough starting bias gave me a map with a decent amount of mountains, so maybe Inca, especially since in my current game I have a lot of free space on my own continent left to settle and the distant lands may be a little cramped. Might also consider Majapahit or Vietnam.
 
I think they're fine? I played them with Himiko who amplified their abilities to absurd levels (roads across an entire continent, trade routes you otherwise can't get and that do not count towards the usual limit), but I can't really think of another leader than can leverage them quite as much. Alliances have that very unfortunate side effect of dragging you into conflict with players you don't want to be in conflict with. Quite a good chunk of culture though for a Civ that lacks a 'Cultural' label, but none of it carries over (which I assume is why they aren't tagged as Cultural).

Amina and Genghis Khan might be good with them, the former to slot more resources into cities (plus a sweet combat bonus in case you do end up at war), the latter to make better use of the Hwarang.

Dai Viet seems like the best Exploration transition at a glance, if only because the Hwarang upgrade into Ranged Units, meaning they become Voi Chien.
 
...
Strategic Allies – all trade routes between you and your allies award food and production equal to the trade route’s gold value
I don't think this tradition is working. I don't see numerical changes after slotting it.
 
I don't think this tradition is working. I don't see numerical changes after slotting it.
It might only apply to the settlement that gets the gold... so trade routes sent to you give your settlements food/prod, Trade routes sent to your allies give them food/gold.
(and it does have to be allies)
 
It might only apply to the settlement that gets the gold... so trade routes sent to you give your settlements food/prod, Trade routes sent to your allies give them food/gold.
(and it does have to be allies)
Yeah I get that. That's what the wording suggests but I am not seeing any numerical changes at all when slotting this tradition.
 
Having played a bit further with them, a few things jump out.

1) Your traditions aren't going to be as immediately helpful after age transition as some other civ's are since all of your trade routes disappear. The only card you're likely to get any use out of early on is Beopseong, at least until you get your trade routes up and running again. Could make for a slow start, maybe?
2) Seorabeol seems to be completely useless in the Exploration Age. Now maybe I'm misremembering but I could've sworn I've used trade outposts in the exploration age, but right now I'm not seeing that as an option in any of my towns which means that card has literally zero use for an entire age. That's a shame.
3) While I did end up choosing Inca based on my current map (lots of mountains, lots of room on my home continent left to settle), Chola strikes me as a very good Exploration Age choice in order to really leverage Silla's trade bonuses - you'll get extra trade routes and extended trade range with them.
 
They underwhelmed me when I tried them. Everything felt fine, but also like it was somerhing I could get a better version of with other civs... Alliance gameplay is also messy and unpredictable which wasn't the most fun experience. Very middle of the road. I guess that's relevant for a civ which has a road building ability...

But then there's the music. Oh boy. Please give us a jukebox Firaxis.
 
They underwhelmed me when I tried them. Everything felt fine, but also like it was somerhing I could get a better version of with other civs... Alliance gameplay is also messy and unpredictable which wasn't the most fun experience. Very middle of the road. I guess that's relevant for a civ which has a road building ability...

But then there's the music. Oh boy. Please give us a jukebox Firaxis.

I played through with them, and yeah, I'd mostly agree. I was going fine until Genghis declared war on me, and then my ally Napoleon decided to join in the war against me. Then Augustus joined in too, despite him being friendly with me too. So I went from neutral or positive with basically everyone, to having to fight 3 wars, and yeah, when you play as an alliance game, that doesn't really do much. Basically lost about half the power of the civ when you lose all those alliances and trade routes.

I think either they need something crazy, like having the alliance trade route bonus give that to every city for both civs, or either maybe they need some passive bonus if you're defending. Even if I get like a +5 when defending on rough terrain, something to help out if I can't get the alliances to work. Or give like a unique endeavour which is all about boosting your relationship. With how the civ plays, I would have gladly taken double relationship bonus on endeavours even if I only get half the yield in return.
 
I played through with them, and yeah, I'd mostly agree. I was going fine until Genghis declared war on me, and then my ally Napoleon decided to join in the war against me. Then Augustus joined in too, despite him being friendly with me too. So I went from neutral or positive with basically everyone, to having to fight 3 wars, and yeah, when you play as an alliance game, that doesn't really do much. Basically lost about half the power of the civ when you lose all those alliances and trade routes.

I think either they need something crazy, like having the alliance trade route bonus give that to every city for both civs, or either maybe they need some passive bonus if you're defending. Even if I get like a +5 when defending on rough terrain, something to help out if I can't get the alliances to work. Or give like a unique endeavour which is all about boosting your relationship. With how the civ plays, I would have gladly taken double relationship bonus on endeavours even if I only get half the yield in return.
They need to improve alliances so that

1. if 2 of your allies go to war you get a 3 way choice..join A in war with B, join B in war with A, or break both Alliances and stay neutral.
You should suffer War Support penalties for either war you declare(since you are attacking an ally), but get a big relationship boost with the one you support.

2. When you make an alliance you should take a relationship hit (one time and ongoing) with every civ your ally is less than friendly with. and get a boost for civs your ally is Helpful with, to help avoid having allies that hate each other.
 
I played through with them, and yeah, I'd mostly agree. I was going fine until Genghis declared war on me, and then my ally Napoleon decided to join in the war against me. Then Augustus joined in too, despite him being friendly with me too. So I went from neutral or positive with basically everyone, to having to fight 3 wars, and yeah, when you play as an alliance game, that doesn't really do much. Basically lost about half the power of the civ when you lose all those alliances and trade routes.
I find that alliances and trade are a particularly bad combo since you can quite easily lose a lot of trade routes to alliance chains. The AI usually sides with other AI rather than the player if they have to pick, so while you have some control by watching which AI like each other, it can still go wrong easily.

I think we need defensive and offensive alliances separated again... Either way it'll likely take mechanical changes to get me to try Silla again...
 
I find that alliances and trade are a particularly bad combo since you can quite easily lose a lot of trade routes to alliance chains. The AI usually sides with other AI rather than the player if they have to pick, so while you have some control by watching which AI like each other, it can still go wrong easily.

I think we need defensive and offensive alliances separated again... Either way it'll likely take mechanical changes to get me to try Silla again...
They need to improve alliances so that

1. if 2 of your allies go to war you get a 3 way choice..join A in war with B, join B in war with A, or break both Alliances and stay neutral.
You should suffer War Support penalties for either war you declare(since you are attacking an ally), but get a big relationship boost with the one you support.

2. When you make an alliance you should take a relationship hit (one time and ongoing) with every civ your ally is less than friendly with. and get a boost for civs your ally is Helpful with, to help avoid having allies that hate each other.

It doesn't help that when they got pulled in, it didn't count as a surprise war. Like if it pulled Napoleon in my case but gave me the 5 war support for a surprise DoW, at least I could defend that a little more. But really, it should be an option of joining in either side of the war as a surprise war, or break both alliances and stay neutral. Or perhaps it could be based on the aggressor - so in my case, Genghis declared war on me. Napoleon should be able to join on my side for free, but it doesn't really make sense to join in with the aggressor for free.
 
I had a ball with them (played through them with Lakshmibai, eventually into Qajar in Modern, because I wanted to try out all the new toys.) I wouldn't call them OP or anything, but they fit so perfectly into my playstyle (Diplomatic, Economic, and even with a fast ranged unit, which is exactly what I want to be building in Antiquity.) They're going to be one of my go-tos for sure. Need to try them out with Amina next.
 
I don't think this tradition is working. I don't see numerical changes after slotting it.
It worked for me - I had two routes coming into my capital from forming the two alliances, each worth 6 gold. This is the before and after of slotting the tradition:
1759595710413.png
 
I think because it's given to the receiving town, so it relies on the AI sending you trade routes, it's confusing.
Well I think it is meant to go with the automatic ally trade routes to your capital (which means it needs capital working resources and allies)
 
Well I think it is meant to go with the automatic ally trade routes to your capital (which means it needs capital working resources and allies)
Maybe. My allies' trade routes to other settlements did not make any food/production changes. Still haven't gotten any routes to my capitals so I don't know. This is very situational tradition if it only applies to capital.
 
It definitely works outside the capital - this is my before and after in antiquity with one extra route into Daegu. I'll check if I get the same in exploration when I get there
1759611515660.png
1759611563030.png
 
It definitely works outside the capital - this is my before and after in antiquity with one extra route into Daegu. I'll check if I get the same in exploration when I get there
Please do. I couldn't test it in antiquity since I could not get any allies. I had 1 ally sent a trade route to a non-capital in exploration age, but didn't see any change upon slotting this tradition.
 
Back
Top Bottom