Civ IV: Beyond the Sword Info Center

[eric_]

Really? I would like an option to disable the swap file until my RAM is exceeded.

I'm pretty sure you can do that...I think I read something about it in this thread that Gyathaar linked.

I don't want to suggest you do something like disable page files without warning. I've never had a problem after doing so, and have never heard of anyone else having a problem. But, ostensibly MS built them in for a reason, so, i have to say, proceed at your own risk .

If you do, one thing you can do to test it somewhat safely is open something like Adobe Photoshop and create a HUGE image (like 10 feet by 10 feet or something) at 300 dpi and start making changes and saving them. Or, try and find a huge PDF on the net and open like 10 instances of it and then start playing Civ.

 

[taketounwanted]

well, disabling my PF solved the speed issue definatly, running since my post about it 100 or more turns again..
and honestly, if 2gigs is used by windows for applications, and 2for the system(if you have 4 in total) how possibly could windows use swapped memory additional? it's only32 bit and unlike win2k which has a complete system independend memory management, winXP or Vista the 32bit versions are simply restricted to 4gigs anyway use your calc for 2^32=32bit=4gigs.....maybe im wrong about this, but how could windows use more then 4gigs(either RAM or SWAP) so anyone using 3 or 4gigs of RAM doesn't need the Swap anyway...

and honestly, my wife edits on this computer tons of photos, 8.2MPixel, in photoshop, which uses alot of RAM for each pic! I use Solidworks, 3D technical drawing that is, I use VS 2003 for compiling stuff, etc..I never ever needed the 4gigs i have..never used more then 60% of my RAM...that windows starts to swapping is totally unappropriate und unneeded and even BAD, in the case of civilization, obviously!

i'd say, disable it, untill you need it...
btw, 16MB are default allocated for a pagefile anyway for system purposes..so windows won't crash anyway..and yes, it does warn you when you go low on RAM, i know that from my older comps with less RAM!

 

[eric_]

honestly, if 2gigs is used by windows for applications, and 2 for the system how possibly could windows use swapped memory additional?

My guess would be that the page file would be drawn from 2 GB reserved for system processes.

yes, it does warn you when you go low on RAM, i know that from my older comps with less RAM!

Indeed. And, I always have ignored them with no problems .

My only question at this point is, how will Vista break down 2 GB between applications and system processes?

 

[taketounwanted]

Well, im running vista, and obviously it has also the 2gigs bug, with the special cmd line from "whoever started it" but was copied in by gaythaar you can set the system to use 1gig and apps to use 3gigs..so defaulted, my guess is a 50-50 reservation?
1gig system
1gig apps

would be my best guess..

 

[eric_]

so defaulted, my guess is a 50-50 reservation?

That's what I was thinking, too. I'll disable page files and then see how things go...I'm totally shocked that 2 GB is problematic. The idea that this game is more resource intensive than high-level audio or video editing is absurd.

Have you reverted back to 50-50 since disabling PFs and rerun the test?

 

[taketounwanted]

yeah, i, as always, do alot of testing, the 50-50 on my 4gigs system, hence 2gigs for applications, isn't good enough, i even MAF upon loading the savegame now! definatly need the 3gigs..

my savegame is 2.1MB at the moment btw
only 1 computer left, the others are already destroyed by my autopilot, looks funny though, all the world belongs to me! and alot of money surplus ROFL
if civ had an economical aspect, im sure i'd be able to buy the remaining civ LOL

 

[taketounwanted]

anyway, as much as I've figured out, the number of Ai's alive isn't much of importance to the memory civ needs...something between 10 and 50MB/civ i'd guess...rough guess i must admit! more important:"number of cities, number of units, number of plots(mapsize), although, mapsize of course directly influences on the number of cities or number of units"

I'll compile a dll with 36civs and let it run the next 2 days, as im studying now constantly, only having civ in the background and reporting here what i've seen on the BtS, i can afford letting my comp run "tests"

but it defintly shows that gaythaar is right, you need alot of mem, and 2gigs isn't enough for BIG GAMING!

Note:"i have all graphic options enabled/maxed"
could save a couple MB there probably..but it won't be enough to play BIG on a 2gig system..that's for sure..

 

[phoenix_sprite]

when does it come out in Canada...they changed the dates didn't they?

 

[eric_]

the 50-50 on my 4gigs system, hence 2gigs for applications, isn't good enough

That's even with paging files disabled?

 

[taketounwanted]

hmm, although not 20mins/turn(like when the comp starts swapping)...still 4mins/turn upon war..no war is 2turns/minute...still a huge difference between war and non war..especially, because im owning 5continents completely, the last and 6th continent i own 80%, enemy has only 4cities left...no need for the Ai to WAR-STRATEGY all units..i think here we have to mod a little bit AI really only needs to move units on the 6th continents and leave all the other units alone...

I see this tactic alot, during war AI moving alot of units for no purpose..if you're outnumber your enemy already anyway with just a small portion of your units, you don't actually need to start moving everything just because of the fact of "war"

my last enemy is not worth spending so much CPU power a few units will do!

think here we can improve performance on late-gameplay...especially the tons of airplanes i see flying around, WTH they wanna bomb? there isn't anything left to bomb! ROFL

That's even with paging files disabled?

yup!

You just simply need the winXP or Vista 3Gb memory Fix....and of course actually have 3gigs, or let windows do alot swapping(guess how long your turns will take!)


simply spoken, the minimum system requirement for
civilization 1.00 up to 1.64: doesn't matter, MAF will kill any game you would use alot of CPU power for anyway

civilization warlords up to 2.08: same, doesn't matter, either you play smaller games, will work on most machines, anything bigger will cause MAF anyway, or use the warlords.exe hack provided on civfanatics, that'll give you some space, together with the MAF fix by either NEV in the ViSa modpack or Gaythaar to reduce memory consumption on "savegame method"

civilization BtS: MAF has been fixed after 1,5years begging(THANKS to GAYTHAAR! NO THANKS TO TAKE2 for refusing to accept the bug was there and telling me for 18months there was no such thing as a MAF!) so now we can set TRUE system requirements,
ranging from:" 256MB for small maps and 8civs on older CPU's
up to: 3Gigs RAM with a 3Gig fix on windows for HUGE MAPS up to 18Civs on plain BtS

Mod requirements:" you have most likely(on modern system which already use 512MB graphical memory) around 700MB additioanal, on a 4Gigs win32Bit system, to play mods, any mod consuming more memory will result in a MAF on a win32bit system...you gonna need a 64bit windows system and hardware system too of course including 4+ GB of RAM

that's what i'd say to minimum system requirements on the BtS package!

so Firaxis finally got the thing done, thanks now it's just the limits of windows and the 32bit system you have to deal with!


. .. .. .. ., I have the E6600!!!!! I thought it was 32bit, now i Just saw it supports 64bit OS!!! ROFL
why the . .. .. .. . don't i just install 64bit windows? ROTMOFL I'm a stupid idiot!!!

 

[eric_]

think here we can improve performance on late-gameplay...especially the tons of airplanes i see flying around, WTH they wanna bomb? there isn't anything left to bomb! ROFL

Heh...you want them to just...give up!?

You just simply need the winXP or Vista 3Gb memory Fix....and of course actually have 3gigs, or let windows do alot swapping(guess how long your turns will take!)

I mean, you're playing a game with 6 continents! That's insane. I'll never play a map that big. My current configuration (1GB, 2GHz, 128MB Vid) can handle Rhye's Earth map pretty well up until at least the mid-late Medival period...if my new 2.13 GHz Dual, 2GB, 256 MB Vid can't handle it decently at least until early modern...wow...I'll probably return it .

No, but seriously, I'll eventually upgrade to 4GB, but, uh, yeah, there better be an immediately noticeable improvement in performance over my current machine.

 

[frob2900]

Well, true, which is why I make sure nothing else is running while I'm playing Civ.

In that case you don't play while you should be working.

(Hmm. I really shouldn't be discussing this with anybody )

 

[eric_]

In that case you don't play while you should be working.

(Hmm. I really shouldn't be discussing this with anybody )

HA! Nice...

 

[The Navy Seal]

Methos when are you going to put screenies and update?

 

[GoodSarmatian]

yes, according to the german civ forum some Saturn markets sell the game since 15.

WTH
I've only checked MediaMarkt twice this week, but I didn't occur to me that Saturn is already selling it.

 

[taketounwanted]

GoodSarmatian ROFL! I didn't knew it either! Just saw it in a gamersshop while walking through Krefeld city. I wasn't even looking for it, but those Civ-Graphics jumped right into the corner of my eyes Amazing how something catches ones attention without you even knowing your brains are already PROGRAMMED to get your attention to it automatically..no matter what LOL

 

[Shigga]

LÖL at least you two can allow yourself to buy it... I will zoom past all Media Markt and Saturn shops till I finished my diploma... which will be in about 12 month... omg it's killing me, but not softly!

 

[dutchking]

Why don't you guys in Germany just hop across the border to Austria or the Netherlands and get BtS? I'd think it's worth it... I'm doing the same thing with Canada...(vacation )

 

[The Navy Seal]

Is BtS in the US yet?

 

[NikNaks]

I think you get it on Monday next week.