Civ5 - shipping with Steamworks * plus Digital Deluxe Edition

Discussion in 'News Updates' started by V. Soma, May 6, 2010.

  1. Melinko

    Melinko Reverend

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    Well here is a question for all those who agree that required steam is a good thing. I get you like it for whatever reason(s) you listed. Thats fine as you really have no choice, but lemons into lemonaid heh.

    But it is required.. meaning those who don't/can't have steam going for some odd reason are just out of luck. And what I am hearing is from those people who support steam is just 'Too bad'. I mean just because you like it does that mean it is okay to force it on people who don't want it. You support that kind of mentality, buisness practice?

    What if it was something that you found offensive.. I know its not like Ubisoft's DRM but there were a lot of people who said exactly what you are about it when it first came out.. I can always be online and deal with it being down once and a while.. 'Too bad' for you who don't like it.

    I know to you who like steam it isn't a real big thing, but look at all the people here who aren't with the steam bandwagon... I mean to them (sure some have some irrational reasons.. but I mean some have actual reasons why they don't want/can't have it) it is a big thing.. And despite whatever they say you are ok with required steam because it won't affect you... This is too bad really but I guess everyone has to look out for #1.. especially here on the net.

    I guess I wanted to say I get it.. you got what you want but the heck with everyone else who disagrees with you.. I do, but really people how long do you think it will take before things get added that you don't want, and these very people you are saying too bad to will laugh as the only reason they are able to push the rules so far is because of this 'too bad' mentality...

    Don't endorse manditory steam.. if not for yourself then for the future :p
     
  2. 2K Elizabeth

    2K Elizabeth <span style="font-weight:bold; text-decoration: un

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    Right now, the info you have out about the different editions is everything I can say. And yes, the Steam Deluxe Edition is special for Steam.
     
  3. Rub'Rum

    Rub'Rum Hates acronyms

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    The only question I really care about is the exact process through which Babylon will become available beyond the Deluxe edition. Will it ever come out as cheaper DLC, or as part of a future expansion pack, etc. This information would allow me, the consumer, to make a good decision on what product I want to buy because I am not interested in Behind the Scene and soundtracks.

    I also know that, since answering this question basically means you guys milk 10$ less from me, you will not answer it. Thanks really, I appreciate it.
     
  4. PieceOfMind

    PieceOfMind Drill IV Defender Retired Moderator

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    Thanks for your response. I thought it might be the case you couldn't say any more than that but that's ok, I certainly wouldn't hold it against you.


    Thinking aloud, I guess it is a deal between 2K and Valve for Valve to get more of the sale market share, reducing the pre-order sales from retail stores.

    Also, a subtle ambiguity in the reply suggests that while the DE is Steam-exclusive, it's not necessarily going to be limited to pre-orders. When I think about it more, it would seem a bit bizarre to have the Deluxe Edition of a game cease all sales as soon as it is released. It would not allow for positive reviews and so forth to increase its sales. I guess I'm answering my own questions now. :)
     
  5. arstal

    arstal Say No 2 Net Validations

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    Gotta remember this is being marketed as a console game.

    Console game preorder DLC rarely appears in later stuff. It's to encourage pre-orders, which make the publisher the most money.

    Every business decision on the Marketing of Civ V so far has made me want to buy the game less and less, it's not just Steam. It also makes me wonder about the expected quality of the game.
     
  6. Roman Emperor

    Roman Emperor Chieftain

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    I have been reading some of the post on here and getting mix answers about steam on Civ V. I don't play online I play solo games with that being said, am I going to need an internet connection to play Civ V? I usually pre-order my games so if I pre-order Civ V is it going to be mandatory that I have an internet connection since (if i understand this correctly) this edition will come with steam?:crazyeye: I started playing Civ with Civ III and I am always excited when a new Civ comes out but I do not always have an internet connection. :sad:
     
  7. Rusty Edge

    Rusty Edge Deity

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    I understand. Been there.

    On the bright side you only need to connect at installation for DRM purposes and after that, only when you want to patch. If you're in the US, can you get one of those AOL trial service disks and hook your gaming machine to a phoneline for a little while?
     
  8. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Super Moderator Supporter

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    No, only for the activation during the installation you need internet access, not constantly, not before starting, after the activation not really again (besides MP + updating).



    But it's still :wallbash:.
     
  9. evrett37

    evrett37 Prince

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    Listen to the way 2k Elizebeth words her replies...shes not proving customer service or answering fans questions - she is just spewing marketing lines and holding back answers till whichever mag or website pays the most for the next exclusive. Once someone has paid her masters then she can "answer" more questions. I say we start a petition to get this corporate shill off our site.
     
  10. arstal

    arstal Say No 2 Net Validations

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    She's doing her job. That said, I see through the doublespeak myself. I think most on here do also.

    I've noticed often that games that have active community "folks" such as this tend to be games that end up disappointing.

    One lesson we may end up learning from this (I hope): what you can away with for games in genres such as MW2 won't work the same as what you can get away with in Civ 5. Or we'll learn that us, as gamers, like taking it up the arse and won't fight for our rights at all.
     
  11. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    That should actually be true for all apps. In the end all apps share the same physical memory however, so while you may technically not run out of address space, you run out of very real RAM that address space is mapped to. The end result being swapping between RAM and HD and bad performance once that starts happening (frequently).

    So this probably does not alleviate peoples fear of extra RAM usage due to Steam. The amount of physical RAM Steam is using is relatively small though, so this situation should almost never happen (because of Steam, i.e. the extra 50MB or so Steam uses would actually make a difference).

    Didn't expect it to, given that Steam uses <1% of my CPU on average ;)

    I wonder in which cases they see Civ 5 outperform Civ 4 though. Civ 5 is the first Civ to make use of multi-cores, so it should outperform Civ 4 on any multi-core system (provided they are both run on the same system). Are these the 'same machines' they are talking about or is it also true for single-core systems (meaning an engine which is actually faster instead of one which is using more of the available resources / cores, even though that already is an improvement too) ?
     
  12. 2K Elizabeth

    2K Elizabeth <span style="font-weight:bold; text-decoration: un

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    I'd mention I've been on this site longer than you, but that wouldn't be very polite, now would it? ;)

    I'm in marketing - interactive marketing, to be precise - and I'll never hide that for any of you. And yes, I'm not going to tell you everything, but no, that's not because someone is paying for an exclusive (that's never how it works, in fact.) I actually have my own exclusives, as I create the plans for those features and I certainly don't want to trump my own work. There are features and elements of the game we're planning to reveal for you later based on our overall plan (no game company just plunks a game out there on the first day, that's normal) but there's also a lot of detail I want to cover in screenshots, concept art, and interviews. I think most of you would rather wait for that than a single forum post that won't have nearly as much content.

    Just because I don't have the answer you want (when you want it) doesn't mean I'm evil. And yes, I'm going to be honest, even when the honest answer is "I can't tell you yet."
     
  13. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    I am ok with Steam and it will not stop me from getting Civ 5 and I disagree with most of the anti-Steam flames going on here in that I find them unfounded. That does not mean that I consider requiring Steam a good thing, I actually am not sure anyone did in this thread.

    This also is not a decision the user-base makes but either the developer or the publisher (not sure how much the latter can lean on the former).

    I certainly understand why they do not offer 2 versions if they use Steamworks for they online / multiplayer support. Offering a choice there makes no business sense, it just adds cost. It is like offering two different graphics engines because some people do not like one of them.

    How many people will not get Civ 5 because of its requirement of Steam and whether in the end it would have been beneficial to do without Steamworks is something the developer and publisher need to figure out.
    My take is this is a tempest in a teapot, very few very vocal people are getting themselves heard here, but ultimately they are completely negligable to the actual sales of the game as they are < 0.001% of the actual customer base.

    Noone here is forcing anyone else, it is not like we have any kind of power over this decision anyway (other than by not buying the game).

    I do not know of a single reason why someone cannot use Steam at least once to activate Civ, there may be some very rare cases where this is actually true, but for > 99.99% of players it is not. Whether anyone who can chooses to do so is another matter.

    I stopped buying Ubi games because of their DRM, if they still sell enough games despite it, I will simply play other games. I would prefer there to be enough pressure to get them to revisit their take on DRM (or at least their repressive version of it), but from what I hear they will go even further now that their server has been 'reproduced' which in essence means the game is cracked.

    I understand that people would like there to be no restrictions whatsoever, I too would prefer that. I also understand that people have different ideas about what is tolerable, but that goes both ways. I do not :):):):):) about people still buying Ubi games nor do I expect anyone to complain about people who buy Steam games.

    Complain to the publisher about requiring Steam, but don't try to get me to not buy Civ 5 because it requires Steam and you do not like that while I am ok with it.

    I do not care at all whether it uses Steam or not, I will buy it either way ;)
     
  14. mamba

    mamba Deity

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    The map pack is the preorder bonus, the Babylon civ, soundtrack etc. is the deluxe version. I can understand the map pack not being available past preorder, the deluxe version still would be on sale however.
     
  15. moopoo

    moopoo King

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    I understand many people (myself included) are frustrated with decisions being made for the release of this game, don't take it out on 2k reps posting on here. It's cringing, and the fact that they're here in the first place proves that they care more than the average publisher. I think there are a lot of people here being extraordinarily and unnecessarily cynical.

    A Question for 2KElizabeth: Will Civ 5's expansions follow the previous civ formula, or will we be getting E:TW style mini-chunks?
     
  16. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    This has got to be the first Straw Man argument someone has actually said. To spell it out for you when you said

    "Steam is being used as the fundamental basis for all the online content, data distribution, multiplayer and purchase verification." I nearly ROFLMAO'd ...

    Precicely because it is Steam's pursuit of making Computer Gaming a unified and closed system which brings all the irrationality out from woodwork. Making Computer Gaming a closed system (everything through Steam-or any other single provider) simply invalidates, for most people, all of the extra headaches that come with PC gaming.

    The very fact that Steam is openly pursuing a Closed System, and that you subconsciously realize this, say it, and is perfectly okay with it, tells me that you see the PC as just another console. If the PC was just another console then I would gladly use the OTHER consoles primarily, that do their job a whole lot better on average.

    It is the freedom and diversity of Computer gaming that makes system far more than just a simplified console. As others have stated, many free and independent programs can do the non-game aspects of Steam just as well or better than Steam does.

    While I respect Valve from a game development standpoint, their publishing and business practices as a whole leave a bad taste in my mouth. Computer gaming is not meant to be simplified and lorded over under one authoritarian government (Steam). Computer gaming is meant to have a variety of various independent companies vying for the interest of the Consumer with better functionality.

    Its simple free market vs closed market. For making the PC into a closed system makes it a closed market ... which means that instead of liking companies X, Y, and Z, you either like the PC or you don't like it .... just like you like the X-box or don't like it, because the publishing, marketing, and virtual community is all the same, and thus geared towards largely the same kind of player. The console player*.

    I like consoles a lot, but computers are meant to be different. Draconian systems for Console games ported to the computer are reasonable, while doing the same on PC only games is a serious breach of the spirit of Computer gaming as a whole.
     
  17. Periander

    Periander Chieftain

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    I like the fact that it's a Steam only release.

    I hope that they're using some of the steam smarts for multiplayer. Gamespy was horrible in Civ IV!!!

    The other added bonus is that everyone on Steam is at the exact same version...

    I have no dramas with Steam other than the fact that the Australian government banned L4D2, (well, refused classifications), and Valve made it hard to fake being from the UK to buy it... but there are ways...
     
  18. Tasunke

    Tasunke Crazy Horse

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    Well, I hope it works for Civ V ... by that I don't mean corporate pocket books, but the modding community and the civfanatic community as a whole.

    I am willing to be optimistic, but if installing a mod becomes a nightmare 10x worse than the worst of Civ IV mods ... I just hope it doesn't come to that.

    Also, I liked the flexibility of installing and keeping various copies of Civ IV on my computer (various patches, not including expansion packs) ... not to mention all the extra copies with modified XML and Python. I suppose that, taking a break from my other concerns, the primary concern I have with regards to entertainment value is for the Modding community and the ability for Mods to reach the average Civ V consumer.

    (not that I will be buying Civ V anywhere close to release, if at all)
     
  19. CivFanMUC

    CivFanMUC Chieftain

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    According to this and other forums: ~50%.
    50% of the real fanbase, 50% of ppl. who are so much into the Civilization franchise that they spend even their sparetime on forums like this.
    2K/Firaxis loses 50% of their most active fans. But, screw them. Who needs them. There are enough other customers out there, who buy the game, maybe playing it a few hours and put it away, who cares?

    Pecunia non olet
     
  20. arstal

    arstal Say No 2 Net Validations

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    MW2 had 80-90% reject, then most of those bought it at launch anyways.

    Then again, those are MW2 players- who are the bottom of the barrel in terms of gamers really.

    I think some of the 50% who say they won't buy will, but it will be a much lower percentage. Civ fans are to be blunt, smarter, older, and grumpier then MW2 players.

    That said, this community is maybe only 1-2% of the total fanbase, though it runs the modding community. What we're probably going to see if a mass change in the Civ playerbase into something a lot more casual, and Civ is moving towards a much more casual series.

    We'll be fine- other companies will support us- we are a profitable group, we're just not as profitable as the consolites. Ultimately, we're fans of Civ not because it is Civ, but because Civ is good.
     

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