Civilization Resolution! Part One

[comatosedragon]

My New Years Resolution: To move up to Emperor dificulty.
I have been playing on Noble now for about a year, and it's time to move on. The only way I feel I can do this is with YOUR help, however. So, I have decided for the first time to post my games here in the forums. I will follow pretty much the the same format as other games I have seen posted here. Starting with my mission statement:

To advance to Emperor!
How will I do this? I will play and post a series of games with the following format:

MAP TYPE: Shuffle
SEA LEVEL: Random
CLIMATE: Random
SIZE: Standard
CIVILIZATION & LEADER: I will play each civilization alphabeticaly, picking the leader based on my preference.
DIFFICULTY: I am starting on Noble, and will advance in difficulty with every two wins. If I have not won two emperor games by the time I reach Shaka, I will have failed in my mission.
MISC - I play CIV IV BtS with the 3.17 patch (and Bhuric's) and the BUG mod.
I will not regenerate the starting location!


GAME ONE!
America - George Washington.
Actualy, he is one of my favorite leaders. I feel his traits (Charismatic, Expansive) work very well together, and are GREAT for warmongering (which is, like many of you, what I have the most trouble with). Faster workers are invaluable(especialy early), and the cheaper building (granary) is fantastic, because every city needs one! Also cheaper Harbors, which is not always useful, but who knows what the map has in store! Less experience needed for promotions means we will probably want a barracks earlier than usual. And lets not forget +2 Health and +1 Happiness per city, which means I can support larger populations earlier, which is a huge production bonus, both with slavery and simply the extra citizens woking tiles.

The UU and UB both come late in the game, and to be honest, I have never seen either of them! So, I have nothing much to say about them . . .


THE MAP!

(Sorry, I don't know how to post those cool full screen shots, only the thumbnail down there. If someone wants to clue me in, that would be swell! While I'm at it, I don't know if people who are not using BUG can use that save, so if someone wants to tell me what I need to do so anyone can use it, that would be swell too!)

Wow. I really lucked out on this one. My starting techs dont help too much (Agriculure, Fishing); but just look at all those resources! I can cottage up those two riverside wine tiles, and mine the gold, yeah, this is going to be a commerce city, almost surely.

Most likely settle in place, Tech Mining, Bronze, Animal Husbandry; build worker, worker, settler. But of course, that is dependant on what you fine folks have to offer in the way of advice. (Maybe I want pottery before AH?) Will most likely start this game tonight (nothing wrong with getting a head-start on a New Year's Resolution!), but It may be in the morning.

Feel free to play along, but please don't spoil anything for me or others!

 

[PaulusIII]

I agree with settling in place, but the techs are better in another order imho.

In this case you want to start AH-Mining. Both pigs and cows are excellent tiles to work and will help your city grow while you research Mining and build your first worker.

While worker first is the way to go here, you don't want to get your second worker out immediately. Build some warriors first, let your city grow a bit while working the pigs, cows and later the gold.

 

[comatosedragon]

Okay, my thoughts were that growing a city before pumping out two workers and a settler would result in a production penalty. Maybe just one worker and then a settler? I still like having BW before other worker techs that way I can chop-rush the settler. I'm open to other ideas, though! Lets see what others have to say.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Oooh, forced pace improvement. I like it. It's a good mentality because if you have the determination it raises your focus.

I'll probably start shadowing everything en masse' again soon (as if I haven't been already). Family meeting time is winding down a bit now that it's after xmas.

 

[Sian]

i'd might settle 1SE

 

[DMOC]

I would settle in place. You've got freshwater where you are and the settler's on top of those lovely plains hills which give you an extra production point in your city center. Good luck on your game -- I will most likely be lurking and giving comments.

 

[ABigCivFan]

Settle in place. 1 SE prob gives you a coastal tile.

Tech order: AH-Mining-BW-Wheel

Build order: worker(improve cow/pig then gold hill)-warrior-warrior (grow to size 3 and work cow/pig/gold)-worker-warrior/settler (grow capital to happy cap, work additional hills and pump more settlers)

explore with warrior and post some pic of the explored map.

 

[vicawoo]

Settle in place. 1 SE prob gives you a coastal tile.

Tech order: AH-Mining-BW-Wheel

Build order: worker(improve cow/pig then gold hill)-warrior-warrior (grow to size 3 and work cow/pig/gold)-worker-warrior/settler (grow capital to happy cap, work additional hills and pump more settlers)

explore with warrior and post some pic of the explored map.

I think you're wrong (ooohhhh, disrespect!)

Definitely settle in place to utilize the expansive worker bonus. You need to be making at least 4 hammers - food doesn't count - for it to take effect.

Go animal husbandry first. With two tiles and then a gold mine to build, that will keep your worker busy for 5+4+1+5=15 turns normal speed after you tech animal husbandry. Er, if it's epic, mining takes 9-10 turns and bronze working 23, so normal that's about 20 turns, with a few turns saved by extra commerce. Your worker should only be idle for maybe 3 turns.

Don't cottage the wine.

 

[Skallagrimson]

I agree with the general consensus of an in-place settle, and AH, mining, BW, wheel.

Possibly farm the wine later if growth gets you to where you can work those tiles.

 

[slobberinbear]

Good luck on the resolution. I need to do this too; I've been stuck on Monarch forever.

Anyway, some thoughts on Washington.

With no early UU or UB and no direct economic advantages, I suggest that your path to victory will involve large doses of both horizontal and vertical growth. Some specific suggestions (assuming you don't axe rush someone):

1. keep cranking out the workers. This is one of your main advantages, so you might as well develop your land quickly.
2. consider chopping out Stonehenge. Free border pops and +1 happy face from Charismatic.
3. scout out your area completely and expand towards your neighbors.
4. fairly early, try to settle two or more cities that can be cottaged heavily.
5. settle a good food/hammer city and make it your military production city. Keep building units so that your power rating doesn't dip. Defending yourself will slow your expansion.
6. research Monarchy and switch into hereditary rule. This will also let you hook up your wine. But the main play here is getting big cities earlier than everyone else.
7. with the sheer production force of your mammoth population, hammer someone once you run out of expansion room and have a big enough force.

 

[Skallagrimson]

My level of play is relative to map type and how I start. The only way I have a ghost of a prayer on Immortal is E18 as Germany or Rome, or Pangea with regens for gems, etc. Emp is similar in that most maps except the really good starts won't allow me to win, but I play there frequently to try to feel out strategies and see if they're viable at higher levels. Monarch is probably my tipping point of 50/50 on blindly accepting whatever crap the shuffle map gives me; more wins on easier maps and more losses on the typical tundra peninsula nonsense or "you're surrounded by DESERT, haha!" Prince there may be some of the more difficult maps that can beat me, and Noble, I don't care what you give me, the AIs are pwnt.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I took on an easy one today .

Stripped of its bonuses, the AI fails.

To 1 AD (big segment)

Spoiler :

I settle in place. HIGH sea level, eh? What's this?! I meet Brennus VERY early on! Whaaaaat?! He founds a religion too. I'm licking my chops at this point because noble + religion = no archers, no axes, no hope:



Worker bonus? This is > IMP hah.



Holy city and everything. The logical thing to do at this point other than taking advantage of CHA via growing to the ridiculous happy cap that religion + the trait allow...is to CONTINUE KILLING STUFFS. But first we duck barbs:



...and throw down a 3rd city. MMMM cottages.



We open borders with Sury and find he has copper, but no spears yet. Good call buddy.



And that's two.



Continue to pump cities. Chariot vs phallic symbols is bad odds I wasn't thinking, however the quick strike and stripping of greek metal helps.





Not defending himself well.

I take his copper city and capitol, then get shredded by a spear and 2 UU's + an archer on a hill. After losing 5 axes without denting that much I use some rare discretion:



Time to fix the...wait no. It was fine all along. Now, the 1 AD status:

To 1615 AD - Game Over, Man!

Spoiler :

I go for Alex's throat:



Yeah, mass HAs own.

I stop making them for a while to build some essentials in my cities, raise the cap a bit abusing monarchy, and then quickly spam out some more to give hatty an arrow-pointed hug:



Lib is good for nationalism which is convenient since I have marble, plenty of "military tech", and lots of hammers to spare for taj.



Without Longbows, hatty doesn't have much to hold off HAs due to her 20 ibuildunitprob and lack of super bonuses:



The capitol goes down:



Then all of egypt:



Now, I teched democracy, then corp, then toward sushi while filling in the continent. I was all ready to go a sush-milking and then chain capping both remaining AIs, but noooooooooooooooooooooooo.

We have enough land for domination with just our continent, and I wasn't paying attention to that so:



Bah.

View attachment 198698

View attachment 198699

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[TheMeInTeam]

Good luck on the resolution. I need to do this too; I've been stuck on Monarch forever.

Anyway, some thoughts on Washington.

With no early UU or UB and no direct economic advantages, I suggest that your path to victory will involve large doses of both horizontal and vertical growth. Some specific suggestions (assuming you don't axe rush someone):

Yikes, you're kidding! CHA/EXP are BOTH direct economic advantages! Two easy available VERY early isn't a joke at all. It's a substantial early game benefit that could even potentially alter your tech path. Until financial cottages pick up or you start running more meaningful civics this trait could easily outperform more traditional ECO traits in the beginning turns - and those are some of the most important. A higher cap generally gives your early cities higher raw production or commerce than other traits. This tapers off come monarchy or representation somewhat, but it's still a global +2 unit maintenance/turn in your cities saved even then. That's...direct.

EXP is similar. Workers are priority builds early on and you put a granary in every city (and each city's ability to grow quickly is a very important facet of economy). EXP granaries can be whipped for 1 pop or chopped easily. As the only building that is guaranteed to go in every city, that's substantial. The health is a bit more unnoticeable but still sound. Essentially before major resource bonuses or (very) late game health boosts come online, EXP allows 1 more pop in each of your cities under monarchy. In an empire that modestly has say 6 such cities (out of say, 8) with enough food to grow to health caps, this is 6 additional pop for the MAJORITY of the game. That's assuming no war or access to more cities. Can this outdo ORG or FIN? Most likely not, but it closes the gap, especially when you factor in the early returns in addition to the health benefit. If EXP isn't a "direct" economy benefit (aka more pop), I don't know what is. It'd be like saying PHI doesn't directly benefit economy!

I like Washington's trait combo a lot, actually. He's quite versatile.

 

[oyzar]

@ TMIT

Spoiler :

what no pre-ad victory? tsk tsk

 

[TheMeInTeam]

@ TMIT

Spoiler :

what no pre-ad victory? tsk tsk

Spoiler :

Don't think it's possible. Even if it were, given the map settings (shuffle, high sea-level, NOT meeting all the AIs initially, etc) I didn't exactly have reason to believe the continent would suffice for domination by itself (I even mentioned I wasn't aware of it until the end...or more accurately so close that I couldn't prevent it).

Given this is on normal speed and you'd need to hold ALMOST the entire land mass in your culture, I think an early AD win is more along the lines of the limit, especially playing this without knowing that ahead of time! It's not like I knew how much land hatty had in 2000 BC or something. What was I going to do, assume this unlikely land distribution from the get-go ?

 

[oyzar]

@ TMIT

Spoiler :

At least you could have taken out some of the AI's earlier... turn 80 to kill the second AI is not particulary fast(though obviously the settler slowed you down). I also think it is your mindset. You aren't looking to win fast, just to beat the AI. Take gtom 25 for example http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6255809&postcount=94 http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6303115&postcount=63 . You are allowed to count the tiles you know . Not to mention that game was emperor and this was noble... In this game warrior rushing brennus and chariot rushing the rest of the AI's should go VERY fast, faster most can potentially hook up copper...

 

[TheMeInTeam]

@ TMIT

Spoiler :

At least you could have taken out some of the AI's earlier... turn 80 to kill the second AI is not particulary fast(though obviously the settler slowed you down). I also think it is your mindset. You aren't looking to win fast, just to beat the AI. Take gtom 25 for example http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6255809&postcount=94 http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=6303115&postcount=63 . You are allowed to count the tiles you know . Not to mention that game was emperor and this was noble...

Spoiler :

You should know better than to think I'd actually bother counting tiles and planning an earliest finish date in a meaningless game . Hell, in one of those summaries the guy said it was a gamble outright anyway...

I just wanted to kick the AI around like it's nothing after that stupid emperor large/Big and Small crap map with random event gayness on (which I still won...) and the even worse PYL Mao start!

If this were a HoF submission, sure, I might have "gambled" on having enough land without counting. But, I probably wouldn't be playing shuffle to begin with.

At least I grew my cities more this time.

 

[Gumbolt]

@TMIT

Spoiler :

You took chariots against Alexander??? Brave man!!!

On my recent monarch game using Cyrus Alexander was a thorn in the side for myimmortals. Had to wait for cats/axes to finish him off.

On a side note i do love his uu. +100% mounted and +50% melee and strength 5. Stops your lil chariot/horse brigade in its tracks.

Perhaps you can redo the map and finish it by 1ad to make a point?

 

[Vita e Pace]

Looking forward to a New Years' update!

 

[slobberinbear]

Yikes, you're kidding! CHA/EXP are BOTH direct economic advantages!

Being able to grow bigger has all the benefits you mention, and my post was all about growing to take advantage of Charismatic and Expansive. I was loose with the term "direct" ... I was thinking of Financial, I suppose.

The other point: being bigger doesn't help if all you do is make buildings. Using your size to work more cottages, hire more scientists, and build units is the real power of growth.