1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

[NFP] Civilization VI: New Frontier Pass Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Eagle Pursuit, May 11, 2020.

  1. Alexander's Hetaroi

    Alexander's Hetaroi Deity

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2017
    Messages:
    5,565
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Texas
    Considering Stalin and Mao were also in the game Kublai was most definitely overlooked. Also totally different times even though it doesn't seem that long ago.
     
    Inawordyes, Kjimmet, AntSou and 4 others like this.
  2. Myomoto

    Myomoto Prince

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2013
    Messages:
    459
    The game came out like a decade ago. Does it even have a Mandarin version? Definitely very few people in China had computers to play games on at that time.

    As already mentioned, Stalin and Mao were also in the game. Maybe I'm a bit sensitive, but let's maybe leave out people who potentially genocided the player's grand parents? Playing as Stalin as a Ukrainian must be pretty wild... :shifty:
     
  3. BuchiTaton

    BuchiTaton Warlord

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2019
    Messages:
    177
    Gender:
    Male
    Nubians are a great thing on the Pan-African "nationalistic" imaginary.
    1- They are ancient, so is the better example of black africans as forerunners of civilization.
    2- The Nubian dynasty of Egypt is usually used (by the most conspiranoic ones) as a "evidence"of the black origin of egyptians and civilization as a whole.
    3- Ancient Nubians could represent an african civ without be related to modern european colonialism and atlantic slave tradding.
    4- Amanitore is a good option to represent a strong female african leader. Even the "Nubian Queen" is used by some Afroamericans as term for fine and strong woman.

    So is true that even the afroamerican market is not an obvious big market for CIV, but neither are the native north american market, dispite that, these civs still are a good option to fit the expectative of the americans who ask for representation of minorities. They know afroamericans and native americans are around there, a huge part of the market is about inclusion and pop culture. So Nubians and Cree meet the social quota and at the same time add something different/new.

    I am happy with the inclution of civs like Nubia, like I would love to have also Kanembu, Ashanti, Oyo, Somali, etc. But for me the idea that Cree could replace the Haudenosaunee (Iroquois) just because they are native americans is actually absurd. Shoshone are also an example of how empty this idea of "fill" North America with some random native civ is also market/social pandering. Why not chose something closer to the other civs? Like the late mississipian Muskogee.

    I dont se the point of nomadic "survivalist" civs. Mongols were empire conquerors and Aztecs were urban expansionist, but Cree and Shoshone try to be "different" while used most of the same mechanics of all the other civs.

    Why not some "native" like civs from Russia, Indian or China? People would said "because that would be bad to sell the game on those countries", sure because those countries dont tolerate put on doubt their national unity. Western countries do something kind of opposite, the wrong thing is NOT represent their minorities on same way.

    Sadly for me the civilizations with more longer recorded history, more interaction and closer to urban ways from the East could not be, while the "different" from the West must be, even taking the place of many better options like Haudenosaunee, Muskogee, Zapotecs, Chibchas, etc.
     
  4. WillowBrook

    WillowBrook Lurker

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2004
    Messages:
    3,443
    Location:
    Chicagoland
  5. Deggial

    Deggial Emperor

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2007
    Messages:
    1,346
    Location:
    Germany
    Who are you and where do you hold the real Civfanatics hostage?

    I mean ... guys ... September is already 1/3 in and still no new thread created, asking: “The month is almost over! When will we finally learn about the next Civilization and the next content of the NFP???”

    Hey, Civfanatics, you can do better than that! ;) :D
     
    Noble Zarkon and tedhebert like this.
  6. Pfeffersack

    Pfeffersack Deity

    Joined:
    May 10, 2003
    Messages:
    2,737
    Location:
    Germany
    A true Civfanatican will rather ask "When will we finally learn about the next Civilizations" - we have 2 of them in the September release ;)
     
    tedhebert, Inawordyes, Zaarin and 4 others like this.
  7. Deggial

    Deggial Emperor

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2007
    Messages:
    1,346
    Location:
    Germany
  8. salty mud

    salty mud Deity

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    4,944
    Location:
    die Schweiz
    Does anyone know if Firaxis originally planned to release a "proper" expansion, but in light of Covid, we got the NFP in lieu? I've heard this rumour a few times but not seen anything concrete.
     
  9. AvianBritish

    AvianBritish King

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2017
    Messages:
    757
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Kepler-22b
    I think NFP is a "proper expansion" but as people suggested they wanted more frequent smaller DLCs then 1 annual expansion in their survey last year, they decided to split it into 8 DLCs this time.
     
  10. Wielki Hegemon

    Wielki Hegemon King

    Joined:
    May 27, 2013
    Messages:
    956
    Location:
    Warsaw
    I don't think they planned "proper expansion" because they said the game has enough complexity and doesn't require more significant mechanics. This is a good way to monetize their product in a long term and test this kind of sale model.
     
    Noble Zarkon likes this.
  11. WillowBrook

    WillowBrook Lurker

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2004
    Messages:
    3,443
    Location:
    Chicagoland
    Have you not been reading the epic thread on what new civs might be coming? :dubious: People speculate on the timing of the next reveals every three pages or so. :D

    I suspect that both options (standard expansion and the content of an expansion split across smaller DLC) were under consideration from before the release of gathering storm. I expect the decision to go for the current model was made many months before covid, although covid may have delayed the initial announcement and release.
     
    Noble Zarkon and acluewithout like this.
  12. tedhebert

    tedhebert Emperor

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,219
    Location:
    Montreal, Canada
    you mean the one with 7250 posts in it... Yeah.... NO !!! Man that thread is just too much for me ;-) I swear I feel that without a History major at a world famous university, there's no way to follow THAt conversation ;-)
     
    shaglio, WillowBrook and Deggial like this.
  13. Navelgazer

    Navelgazer King

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2012
    Messages:
    712
    Gender:
    Male
    I have no idea how large the African or Afroamerican or Afroeuropean markets for Civ are, but Nubia was a great inclusion. I'm a white American dude and still long for more representation of African civs, ancient civs, and women leaders, and Nubia gave us all that, plus a powerful early design that can show new players how to snowball, and some body diversity while we're at it. The fact that Nubia symbolizes African identity for so many people is a nice cherry on top as well, but even if every civ player were in my demographic, I'd still find them welcome.
     
    ferretbacon and 8housesofelixir like this.
  14. Inhalaattori

    Inhalaattori Emperor

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2003
    Messages:
    1,489
    Location:
    Up North
    Well its true that Sub-Saharan Africa could use more representation. Benin might be nice addition. I think its clear that Africa has too few Civs. Its also not just about who you are playing as, its also about Civs you playing against. Doesnt really make much sense to have only European based Civs.

    Women leaders are extremely over represented in Civ VI, which is kind of OK for me I guess, but sometimes the choices can be a little silly. In fact would actually be ok if the Civs wouldnt have any leaders at all, but that is not probably going to happen.

    When it comes to modern American identity politics... Im not too excited about that. Most of the Afrocentric stuff coming from USA is just pure nonsense. In general Americans have a way of looking past through their modern race-obsessed lens, when in reality race is practically meaningless concept if we look at the world history as a whole. After all being "white" or "black" only has meaning if there are lots of people that are not similar "race" as you. This is why for example "being black" in Africa has been and still is pretty meaningless concept in most parts of Africa. Talking about race of Egyptians and stuff like that is just so silly an unnecessary. In reality Southern-Europeans, North-Africans and Middle-Easterners are genetically extremely close and they even look really similar. Average Greek looks pretty similar to average Iraqi or average Egyptian. Average Greek definitely looks more like average Egyptian than lets say a Finn, but many would think Greeks and Finns are part of the same "race", but Egyptians are not.
     
    Caprikel, 8housesofelixir and Zaarin like this.
  15. Airman1991

    Airman1991 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2017
    Messages:
    16
    Gender:
    Male
    The Official Civilization YouTube New Frontier Playlist currently has a private video
     
    Haig, conorbebe, Kjimmet and 8 others like this.
  16. Laurana Kanan

    Laurana Kanan Don’t underestimate who I am.

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2014
    Messages:
    2,916
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Near the Greatest Snow on Earth
    ^ It's looking like at least the first point quoting from my post in the Possible New Civ thread is on track then.
     
    pokiehl and tedhebert like this.
  17. acluewithout

    acluewithout Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    Messages:
    3,374
    I suspect a Third Expansion was envisaged at some point. I don’t have strong evidence for that, but the GS leak suggested a Third Expansion and the game seems to have a bunch of “gaps“ that look like spaces a third expansion would fill. Then at some point, probably earlier rather than later, they decided to go the season pass model instead.

    I like NFP more or less. It’s not a Third Expansion - the different elements are too disconnected to be a true Third XP in my view. But judged on its own terms, it adds some welcome optionality and customisation. Adds some very cool ideas (even if the implementation is a bit shallow at times). I’d be happy with another season pass after NFP.

    But I really wish FXS would just take the plunge a do a solid Third Expansion, focused primarily on the mid game onwards and bringing back some mechanics from Civ V that have been neglected and were well liked. The game really needs it. The end game is lacklustre. And there’s too much good stuff left on the table from previous games. I doubt we’ll see a Third Expansion given what we’ve heard this far, but it really seems like not having one is a missed opportunity to make Civ VI not just good but great.

    Anyway. It is what it is.
     
    xaiviax and Zaarin like this.
  18. tedhebert

    tedhebert Emperor

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2016
    Messages:
    1,219
    Location:
    Montreal, Canada
    those dates would be fantastic, since my Bday is sept 24th, and my retirement date is sept 25th ;-)
     
    Meluhhan, Haig and Laurana Kanan like this.
  19. ferretbacon

    ferretbacon Obsessor

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    Messages:
    1,536
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    North Texas
    I don't think we'll get a third expansion and would be surprised if there's another round of DLC after NFP. But I'm holding out hope that, out of the four remaining game modes, we get at least a couple that are more historical (rather than fantastical secret societies and doomsday scenarios).

    It may just be that I'm tired right now, but I can't really recall well liked Civ V mechanics that are missing.
     
  20. acluewithout

    acluewithout Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2017
    Messages:
    3,374
    Well, I’ve discussed stuff I think is missing from Civ V before, so I’ll refrain from banging on about that again. There’s certainly plenty of threads about that sort of stuff.

    I’m not ruling out more content after NFP, but I’m not holding out hope either particularly when it comes to a Third Expansion. Ed has been silent, and some of the NFP content is so light, that I do wonder if FXS maybe have another project they’re working on. But even then, that wouldn’t necessarily be something connected to Civ VI.

    I really feel that, post GS, we’ve ended up with a lot of missed opportunities with Civ VI. The whole back half of the game is a desert of what could have been. Instead of filling that, FXS have just provided more and more mechanics to just close out the end game faster so it’s even more irrelevant. I mean, even on its own terms, I think the various Game Modes and mechanics have been quite underwhelming. There are some really great ideas in Apocalypse Mode and Secret Societies, and what we’ve got is good as far is it goes, but FXS really didn’t go very far with these. SS in particular is very frustrating - what’s there is great, but then there’s just so little depth or intrigue.

    The most frustrating thing is that, as things currently stand, the modding community won’t be able to really expand the game like they did for Civ V because we’re not getting the .dll. So, there’s really no chance even of a Vox Pop style mod that lets the game reach its full potential from where FXS leave off.

    Anyway. It is what it is. Just seems a pity if Gathering Storm ends up the high water mark of Civ VI. I certainly don’t think I’d go on this journey again with something like Civ VII.
     

Share This Page