[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[berlin88]

I'm working on writing a paper on Tecumseh and Pushmataha for one of my classes for my master's. In the process I'm studying the Shawnee, and the more I study the Shawnee the more I think they'd make a horrible choice for Civ. Not because they're not interesting--their history is fascinating--but because their most defining attribute as a culture was their mobility. They wandered from the Great Lakes to the Carolinas to Louisiana to New England and back again. They'd be very difficult to portray as a coherent civilization. The best I can think of is a very gimmicky design where they settle lots of one-tile, one-pop cities that can move and double as districts.

There are a lot of nomadic groups throughout Earth's history, and I don't see a way to easily incorporate that into Civ VI, unless you have a game mode devoted to civilizations that have no permanent settlements.

For Native American civs, I still think the Wyandot (Huron) people or the Métis would be excellent additions to the game, and I don't believe either has been featured yet in any of the previous civ games.

I was pleasantly surprised when the devs added Gaul (albeit with a focus on Belgian part of Gaul), so maybe the devs can eventually add the Huron or Métis to the game.

 

[Zaarin]

I still think the Wyandot (Huron) people

I don't see a very compelling reason to choose the Huron over their cousins (and enemies) the Haudenosaunee, who were more sophisticated and ultimately far more successful. The Huron threw their lot in with the French and lost with the French; the Haudenosaunee played colonial powers off each other and consequently remained a major regional power until the American Revolution. Too few Native American civs are put in the game for me to want a staple, but if one should be a staple the Haudenosaunee have no competition. In particular, I think it would be strange to pick another Northern Iroquoian civ in their place. It would be like including Savoy and leaving out France.

the Métis

The Métis are of mixed Cree/French Canadian descent. Having the Métis in the same game as the Cree and Canada would be way too much for me. Plus the Métis were never independent.

 

[Xandinho]

For me, we could have both Babylon and Assyria, and I'd still put Hittites on the list (I have been reading about Hittites and I am interested in them) if I were not being too demanding . Although some people might say that would be too many civs from the ancient Middle East . I just think that a game of civilizations would be expected that ancient Mesopotamia should be well represented.

 

[Zaarin]

For me, we could have both Babylon and Assyria, and I'd still put Hittites on the list (I have been reading about Hittites and I am interested in them) if I were not being too demanding . Although some people might say that would be too many civs from the ancient Middle East . I just think that a game of civilizations would be expected that ancient Mesopotamia should be well represented.

I'm 100% on board, and if Babylon, Assyria, and Hittites were added, I'd still want Elam and Hurria.

 

[berlin88]

I don't see a very compelling reason to choose the Huron over their cousins (and enemies) the Haudenosaunee, who were more sophisticated and ultimately far more successful. The Huron threw their lot in with the French and lost with the French; the Haudenosaunee played colonial powers off each other and consequently remained a major regional power until the American Revolution. Too few Native American civs are put in the game for me to want a staple, but if one should be a staple the Haudenosaunee have no competition. In particular, I think it would be strange to pick another Northern Iroquoian civ in their place. It would be like including Savoy and leaving out France.


The Métis are of mixed Cree/French Canadian descent. Having the Métis in the same game as the Cree and Canada would be way too much for me. Plus the Métis were never independent.

I suggested the Huron and the Metis for the very reason that they had connections to the French Canadians (where I get some of my DNA from). Either one could be used as an alternate for existing civs / leaders.

 

[Zaarin]

I suggested the Huron and the Metis for the very reason that they had connections to the French Canadians (where I get some of my DNA from). Either one could be used as an alternate for existing civs / leaders.

I would have preferred a more New France-oriented Canada focused on the fur trade myself.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I'm 100% on board, and if Babylon, Assyria, and Hittites were added, I'd still want Elam and Hurria.

Well I'd hate to map all of that out.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

I'm 100% on board, and if Babylon, Assyria, and Hittites were added, I'd still want Elam and Hurria.

i’d want hittites, assyria, babylon, mitanni, elam in that order

 

[bite]

Well I'd hate to map all of that out.

Indeed ... ... .... ... but I'd still do it

 

[Zaarin]

i’d want hittites, assyria, babylon, mitanni, elam in that order

I'd prefer Hurria to Mitanni and Elam to Hurria. Elam stands out for its success in resisting not just conquest but Babylo-Assyrian cultural pressure. Hurria stands out for having an awesome language. (But Hurria was also a regional power in Anatolia that exerted major cultural influence on their neighbors the Hittites. Hittite religion was really about 80% Hurrian.)

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

You know my mind is going crazy when I've decided to map out a hypothetical Final Frontier pass if Portugal and Babylon actually do show up in NFP. I guess this shows how much possibility the game does have at continuing.

I mean I think they are good pairings:

Italy and Austria as the obligatory new and returning Europeans. Sure I can dream.
Navajo and Iroquois to round out North America.
Berbers and new leader for Egypt.

And some single packs:

Assyria (if Babylon does indeed show up in NFP, if it's the other way around switch them)
Benin/Dahomey: Either one would be my pick for another Sub-Sahara African civ.
Siam (Focused around Early Modern/Industrial to differentiate from Medieval SEA). Alternatively Early Modern Burma can work.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Siam (Focused around Early Modern/Industrial to differentiate from Medieval SEA). Alternatively Early Modern Burma can work.

I hope they just do regional civ dlc packs over the next years until civ 7 comes out.

East and SEA Pack: Siam (Narai), Burma (Anawrhata—or however that’s spelled lmao) + Vientiane and Malacca city states

South Asia Pack: Chola (Rajaraja), Mughals (Nur Jahan) + Ghazna and Kathmandu city states

Mesopotamia, Anatolia and Caucasus Pack: Hittites (Puduhepa), whichever of Assyria and Babylon aren’t in NFP (Sennercherib or Hammurabi) + Washukunni and Baku city states

MENA Pack: Berbers (Dihya), Yemen (Arwa al-Sulyahi) + Linguere and Khartoum city states

Southern Africa Pack: Shona (Nyatsimba Mutota) and Swahili (Al-Hasan Ibn Suleiman) + Kinshasa and Johannesburg city states

West Africa: Yoruba/Benin, Ashanti civs + Monrovia and Oyo (if Benin is chosen) or Edo (if Yoruba is chosen) city states

Oceania Pack: Hawaii (Liliuokalani) and Tonga (Momo) + Port Moresby and Chuuk city states

West Europe Pack: Ireland (Brian Boru), Italy (Vittorio Emanuel II) + Vienna and Copenhagen city states

Eastern and Northern Europe Pack: Sapmi and Kievan Rus + Bucharest and Sofia city states

North America Pack: Tlingit, whichever of Navajo/Haudenosausee isn’t chosen in NFP + Mesa Verde and Iqualit city states

Central and South America Pack: Haiti and Purépecha + Blue Fields and Nassau city states


Pipe Dream but might be the best way to fill out the map

 

[berlin88]

Given that everyone else is throwing out a wish list for future civs / leaders, I will reiterate the suggestions I have made before:

Native American Civs:

Wyandot (Huron)
Métis

Euro oriented Civs / leaders

Hanseatic League (Mayor of Lubek)
Finland (Jean Sibelius / Mannerheim)
Franks (Charles Martel)
King Louis XIV (alternate French leader)
Charles Lindbergh (alternate American leader)
Martin Luther (alternate leader for Holy Roman empire)
Jacque Cartier or Samuel de Champlain (New France or Canadian alternate leader)

 

[Aurelesk]

You know my mind is going crazy when I've decided to map out a hypothetical Final Frontier pass if Portugal and Babylon actually do show up in NFP. I guess this shows how much possibility the game does have at continuing.

There is a huge amount of unique district in this Frontier Pass, which lead to two copies of the same district: the Observatory (Maya, Campus) the Hippodrome (Byzantium, Entertainment Complex) and the highly speculated Dunon (Gaul, Industrial Zone). The only specialty districts that are not in the game twice are the Commercial Hub, the Encampment, the Holy Site and the Theatre Square but we have only 3 new civilizations in this Frontier Pass.

For me, this might be a reason why we would have a second Frontier Pass (or something else) just to have that completion feeling. This is not a proof, just a blind desire. Looking at civilization in V not represented yet, I think we could have:

• Assyrian, and the Royal Library as a Theatre Square (I guess)
• Moroccan, and the Kasbah as the Encampment.
• Portugal, and the Feitoria as... no... not the Commercial Hub! This is not making any sense! This is a Fort in foreign territory! Venitia, or something Italian (Genoa?) would make sense for this! (I am somehow feeling that we would end up with a Netherlands/Portugal rotation somehow, even if they are nothing alike, just to prevent to have too much of european civilizations).

I am not mentioning:

• Austrian → Hungarian. Not the same people, but fill the category: "City-State leverage with Hussar units"
• Babylonian → Sumerian. Not the same people, but same area, even if I have hope to see both, because they could lead to different gameplay.
• Carthaginian → Phoenician. The same people? but not entirely the same area? Let's say it fills the category: "I am Dido"
• Celtic → Scottish/Gallic with the antiblob policy.
• Danish → Norwegian. Not the same people, but fills the category: "Vikings"
• Hunnic → Scythian. Not the same people, but fills the category "Horse rush". I am pretty sure the Greeks would have called the Hunnic people Scythian anyway.
• Iroquois → Cree. Not the same people, but fills the cateogry: "friendly trading native american". There is still room for native american but they need different focus.
• Polynesian → Maoris with the antiblob policy.
• Shoshones → Mapuche. Not even the same hemisphere, but fills the category: "rebelling native american against invaders". As I said for Iroquois, there is room for more native american civilizations.
• Siamese → Khmer. Not the same people, but same area, even if I have hope to see both, because of different gameplay.
• Songhai → Mali. Not the same people, but same area, even if I have hope to see...Benin/Dahomey!)

Speaking of Benin and Dahomey, their Voodoo culture could suit a unique Holy Site but I don't know enough about the culture to know if this make sense.

 

[8housesofelixir]

The only specialty districts that are not in the game twice are the Commercial Hub, the Encampment, the Holy Site and the Theatre Square but we have only 3 new civilizations in this Frontier Pass.

The lacking of unique Theatre Square alternatives is something I feel very interesting: The TS itself is basically themed after Classical Mediterranean cultures - as you can tell from the Amphitheatre and the allée - while the only unique TS replacement we currently have still belongs to the Greeks.

(IMHO Acropolis can also be a unique Gov Plaza placement,, which also fits the political/diplomacy theme of the Pericles/the political side of Greek philosophers. The TS replacement is fine though, for all those great playwriters.)

Portugal, and the Feitoria as... no... not the Commercial Hub! This is not making any sense! This is a Fort in foreign territory!

Well, the Hanseatic Kontors were originally Commercial Hubs, but due to theming reasons they become IZs with a CH adjacency. I'm a firm supporter of Feitoria-colonization, but if the devs turn them into CH I won't be too surprised.

Siamese → Khmer. Not the same people, but same area, even if I have hope to see both, because of different gameplay.

Makes me wonder how they will portray Vietnam/what will be Vietnam's theme. East Asia already have a culture one, a science one, and a culture-religion one; SAE are two religious ones, a religious city-builder and a religious seafarer. I guess Vietnam will be focus on defensive military and culture, but Gaul seems to fit into that position.

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Vietnam are almost certainly getting a unique theatre square or amphitheater, let’s not forget

I’d imagine the royal libraries for assyria would be library or campus replacements, rather than theatre square ones

 

[8housesofelixir]

Vietnam are almost certainly getting a unique theatre square or amphitheater.

A Mua Roi Nuoc-based TS/Amphitheatre replacement would be great. East Asian operas/dramas shall have some representation.

 

[Jeppetto]

There are a lot of nomadic groups throughout Earth's history, and I don't see a way to easily incorporate that into Civ VI, unless you have a game mode devoted to civilizations that have no permanent settlements.

Nomadic groups could be represented as early prototypes in Civ 7. Create mini-Era where your Settler can mini-Settle to absorb some form of benefit from surrounding tiles over period of time and repeat this, traveling across map, for X times before you unlock the option to settle permanently, granting the absorbed benefits to your Capital. Tall playstyles could get benefit of being able to absorb more for stronger Capital, or that the benefits spread to cities within 6 plot range etc.

As for historical accuracy, nomadic group that started existing later in history being represented by some Neolithic Nomad is as accurate as you starting as USA in Ancient Era and nomadic groups ceasing to exist by Ancient Era is similar case.

 

[Haig]

I wouldnt care for having a nomadic period in the start of every game, I think it would get old pretty quickly.

Maybe as a game mode yoi could check and uncheck, or as a special ability for one civ.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

• Assyrian, and the Royal Library as a Theatre Square (I guess)

• Moroccan, and the Kasbah as the Encampment.

• Portugal, and the Feitoria as... no... not the Commercial Hub! This is not making any sense! This is a Fort in foreign territory! Venitia, or something Italian (Genoa?) would make sense for this! (I am somehow feeling that we would end up with a Netherlands/Portugal rotation somehow, even if they are nothing alike, just to prevent to have too much of european civilizations).

Assyria makes more sense for the Encampment replacement. Even so we have yet to have a unique library and that would be better.

I still think Portugal will be added in eventually. Even if Europe is already crowded they just added Gaul right in between France and the Netherlands and Portugal would have had more room at least (well to go across the ocean).

Iroquois → Cree. Not the same people, but fills the cateogry: "friendly trading native american". There is still room for native american but they need different focus.

I wouldn't say the Iroquois fit the "friendly" part.

A Mua Roi Nuoc-based TS/Amphitheatre replacement would be great. East Asian operas/dramas shall have some representation.

I had to look up what that was in English. But yeah a Water Puppet Theater is what and I others believe they will get.

I wouldnt care for having a nomadic period in the start of every game, I think it would get old pretty quickly.

Maybe as a game mode yoi could check and uncheck, or as a special ability for one civ.

That does sound like it would be a fun game mode.