CivIV 102, pre-game thread

[xanadux]

CivIV 101, Mansa's Ju-Co is nearly complete, and I am thinking of doing a sequel. Here is the place for those interested to let me know which leaders you might like me to use, or which traits you might like to see leveraged. In the last game, Mansa's financial trait was used to create a powerful cottaged capital economy, and although Spiritual did not shine to its full power, the Spiritual trait was taken advantage of to great extent by many advantageous civics changes.

I am inclined to demonstrate a specialist economy this time around, but I am not set on it. As for traits I think would be good, either Philisophical or Industrious are what I am leaning towards.

I think the 3 most powerful traits, or at least the ones I think can be most easily leveraged to great effect are Financial, Philisophical, and Industrious. This is no surprise because they directly amplify 3 very important resources in the game: Commerce, Great People Points, and Hammers. I think it is important for those who have some struggles in the game to have a good idea of how to leverage these 3 powerful traits. Since I have just done Financial, that is the only trait I won't be using for sure in CivIV 102.

I would also like any feedback on ways the games can be presented in a better way. Let me know if there are things you don't like, things you like, and especially, specific points of the game I may not have shown in enough detail. If there are specific things you have a problem with that you want covered, let me know, and I will try to accomodate.

-Xanadux

 

[xanadux]

Here are some of the leaders I like for the next game:

Pericles: Phi/Cre. To me, the pinnacle of specialist economy leaders. Lots of useful cheap buildings, lots of GPP, and the Odeon is a pretty nice building for a creative leader ... 60 hammers for 2 happy and 3 culture. The UU is not overpowered, but is a completely uncounterable early game unit.

Suleiman: Phi/Imp. I consider Imp among the weakest traits. But the UU and UB are both very strong. A good choice for early mid-game war mongering.

Peter: Phi/Exp. Again Expansive is not super strong, but another good leader for a SE.

Lincoln: Phi/Cha. Maybe second to Pericles for the SE, maybe better. An easy early game +2 happy from Cha should not be sneezed at. Lincoln is seriously strong early from his traits, and his UU and UB are nice though very late.

Roosevelt: Ind/Org. A very productive leader. If you would rather I showcase an Industrious leader than Philisophical, a good choice.

DeGualle: Ind/Cha. Probably the true wonder building power in the game. If you want to see wonderspam to its fullest potential, this is the leader to choose.

Hammurabbi: Agg/Org. For those of you who just want me to fight, fight, fight. A true war monger at heart.

 

[Thyrwyn]

DeGualle - can be grotesque if he starts near Stone or Marble. StoneHenge is a must, which I usually don't bother with unless I am founding religions. His high happy cap does make building Wonders easy.

I like Pericles - cheap libraries and double GPP - sign me up! The UU and The UB are great, too.

Suleiman - I really like IMP: mining/chopping are key early strategies and IMP improves the rate at whih you can chop early settlers. Should work well with SE: prioritize CoL, switch to Caste System, run Merchants to keep your economy afloat while you recover from your early overexpansion. . .

 

[CBPE]

I followed your Mansa Musa's game, even if I've never posted there, I thank you a lot for your beautiful and really interesting job.

Actually, I'd like to see in the next game a sort of Hybrid economy, maybe leaving your cottaged capital (maybe with burocracy) running a high number of Merchant, and manage others food cities in order to produce beakers, with or without a massive use of Scientists (and, a bit late in the game, I'd like to see an "espionage city")

I'd like Peter or Lincoln.

 

[xanadux]

I follow your Mansa Musa's game, even if I've never posted there, I thank you a lot for your beautiful and really interesting job.

Actually, I'd like to see in the next game a sort of Hybrid economy, maybe leaving your cottaged capital (maybe with burocracy) running a high number of Merchant, and manage others GP cities in order to produce beakers, with or without a massive use of Scientists.

I'd like Peter or Lincoln.

My normal game is not a SE, CE, or HE, but whatever seems to be best. A phi or ind leader tends towards more of a SE. What will actually happen will depend on how the game plays out. Sometimes even though you are philisophical, you get the land for a CE. And I have had games with a financial leader that I never build a single cottage.

 

[jake2007]

well i'd like to see Pericles played on noble since i cant beat noble and i use pericles a lot.

 

[xanadux]

I expect to play on Prince level again. I can think of no reason to play a lower level, as anything I do will be equally valid at any level below Prince as it is at Prince.

I hope for these games to have a lot of meaning for anyone playing any level below Emperor. Even emperor players may learn a thing or two. I think if I drop the level, it will be of help to fewer people.

But as I said, even if you are struggling at noble, or even a lower level, these games should be completely valid to help you at those levels, even if I am playing at prince.

 

[jake2007]

or Hammurabbi, is he the best/your favortie early attacker?

is an effective war monger mid/late game?

 

[KMadCandy]

i didn't notice the mansa thread until yesterday, it's on my list of "things to catch up on". i did notice you used "BTS, out of the box, no patches." why is that? i'd guess very few readers are playing patchless, perhaps none. so the game is as representative of the rules they'll see when they try to practice what you preach .

 

[xanadux]

I just haven't downloaded any patches yet. I'm glad you mentioned the patches. That is something I wanted to ask about here but forgot.

So, now I ask ... if I should use a patch ...

Are most using the game patched, and if so, which patch, the latest official one?

I doubt that noone reading the thread is paying patchless, and imagine more are playing without a patch than you think.

 

[KMadCandy]

i am playing patch 3.13, and bhruic's unofficial patch. i definitely recommend not using 3.13 if you don't use bhruic's, or 3.02 without solver's. i think most people using 3.13 are using bhruic's. it's not hard to find in the first place, and you can post details about where to get it in your introduction.

 

[xanadux]

I'm going to play some tonight (not the game for the thread) with the patch and see what I think.

Other opinions on the game ...

What about map type? Any requests? If a continents map again, I am thinking of upping it to 5 AI instead of default 4 to have a better chance of more than just 1 other AI on the continent.

 

[jake2007]

great plains? that map might be too easy though, huh?

 

[Rentage]

I'd go with Pericles. Sis' ALC recently did Peter, so there's no reason to go with him. Wonderspam is something all us newbies do TOO much, and encouraging us with Roosevelt or DeGaulle might be a bad idea.

As for warmongering, learning to do that without bonuses just makes Agg that much nicer when you have it.

Continent type: Big and small? Unless you draw an island start, you're guaranteed to have plenty of neighbors to deal with.

 

[xanadux]

I'm leaning toward Pericles unless someone convinces me otherwise.

 

[CBPE]

My normal game is not a SE, CE, or HE, but whatever seems to be best. A phi or ind leader tends towards more of a SE. What will actually happen will depend on how the game plays out. Sometimes even though you are philisophical, you get the land for a CE. And I have had games with a financial leader that I never build a single cottage.

You're right, maybe this could be the first lesson: don't start with the "pre-formed" idea of pursuit a CE or a SE or a HE, but adapt your strategy to the current moment of the actual game.

Anyway, as you said, this is an instructive game, so I'm sure that, starting with the PHI trait, you'll show a lot of interesting features of the SE.

I'd like to see Lincoln (yes, Peter was already "studied" by an ALC game) to see how to combine an SE with a warmonger trait (they say it's a powerful combo).

 

[JayThomas]

You're right, maybe this could be the first lesson: don't start with the "pre-formed" idea of pursuit a CE or a SE or a HE, but adapt your strategy to the current moment of the actual game.

This is so true. It took awhile for me to stop trying to shoehorn a game into a particular type. The map is the principle driver of what economies to use.

 

[xanadux]

I've decided to go with Pericles. Still normal speed, but I am thinking of going to a standard size map because playing on a small map is usually quite a bit different because normally there are few AI to contact in the beginning, and adding AIs to a small map causes an unusually small amount of land for expansion.