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CivIV: Warlords - New Leaders shown here!

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by Ephor, Mar 16, 2006.

  1. microbe

    microbe Cascaded Mansion

    Nov 16, 2003
    Right. How many units do you kill in a game? :)

    I don't understand. If you hate him so much, you should be glad that he is included in the game so you could kill him.

    Including someone != endorsement of his leadership. Grow up!

    Then you are wrong. I don't mind playing with him.

    Please don't speak for others.
  2. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

    Oct 21, 2004
    Torino - Italia
    I hope that these urban legends are not what is taught at school in the USA but just the result of poor informations you found on the internet.
  3. Eternalsteelfan

    Eternalsteelfan Prince

    Jan 21, 2006
    Thugz Mansion
    I said solid? He DID rebuild the German economy around heavy industry and war machines similiar to Stalin. FYI providing employment is the first steps towards rebuilding an economy, see FDR and the New Deal.
  4. Myxer

    Myxer Chieftain

    Jan 16, 2006
    Toronto, Canada
    I think they should only use the leaders that appeared in Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure. ;-)
  5. MasterShake

    MasterShake Goofy Boots

    Feb 21, 2006
    why did this thread turn into a politics debate:confused:
  6. SewerStarFish

    SewerStarFish King

    Nov 10, 2002
    Reading, Pa., USA
    Baeleric Slingers! Cool classic age unique unit.
  7. zx1111

    zx1111 Warlord

    Oct 31, 2005
    It is meanigless to argue Starlin or Hitler was good or bad leader...
    Have Civ 4 picked only good and competant leader as Civ leaders? No. there are some controversal one and even vicious or incompetant leaders in Civ 4 as long as they are considered to have influenced world history in either way, good or bad.
    So why not include Stalin and Hitler as one of such vicious leaders?
    Good or bad, Stalin and Hitler did someting with great influence in history.
    So they deserve to be included as Civ leaders.
    I don't think that picking them as Civ leader is considering them as good leader or praise their deed in history.
    Villains had their place in history. Why not in history based game like Civ 4?
  8. Dr Corbett

    Dr Corbett Chieftain

    Jan 19, 2004
    Why not that Carlos fellow? Carlos I or something like that? Wasn't he somewhat important? My memory's foggy.
  9. Kerrang

    Kerrang Warlord

    Jan 18, 2006
    St. Louis Metro East
    This is a discussion forum, how are you going to participate in a discussion if you never make more than one post in a thread? Are you just here to preach at us?

    The "dehumanizing of today's youth... should not be discussed in a public forum"? Where would you prefer that it be discussed? Behind closed doors at whatever school was foolhardy enough to hire you as an educator?

    Yes, Silver 2039 was either replying in a less than sincere manner, or that user has some serious emotional/mental/philosophical issues. He obviously doesn't speak for anyone other than himself, though.

    I am not so sure about your key demograhpic here, care to back it up? Civ is a long-standing and well respected franchise. Many of us who play the game are in closing in on 40 or have crested that hill. Civ4, being a turn-based game which requires quite a bit of thought and planning, is not all that appealing to the action oriented youth of today.

    So, if I play the Stalin leaderhead in Civ4, and manage a cultural victory without getting involved in any wars, I am being tasteless and insensitive simply because I played Stalin? I think you need to either put the bong down, or pass it to me.

    I have two teenage children, and I haven't seen any hammer & sickle shirts among their friends. I have seen a few Che Guevara shirts here and there, but that is more among the 20 something crowd.

    Because, of course, neo-nazis venerate Stalin.

    There is nothing sick and tasteless about including important historical figures (however much you may dislike them) in a game that seeks to recreate the history of human civilization. It is pinko-commy-psuedo intellectual-left wing-revisionist-bullsh!t to attempt to suppress their portrayal in such a game, and Politically Correct attitudes like the one you espouse here sicken me more than anything else I have seen in this thread.

    Where do you teach? I just want to make sure that if my children are exposed to educators such as yourself, that I have the opportunity to undo any harmful brainwashing that you may have been involved in.
  10. Crighton

    Crighton Emperor

    Jan 3, 2006
    That's ok, Mao killed more than either of them.
  11. Ephor

    Ephor Chieftain

    Sep 21, 2005
    my $0.02

    A soulless tyrant kills thousands of people because its a cheap and effective means for him, a single man, to maintain absolute power over an entire nation.

    A madman kills thousands of people because he's loosing a war and his grip of reality along with it.

    Stalin is soulless tyrant, he had no appreciation of human life as anything more than a resource. Hitler killed thousands because he was a freaking nutjob. That's why I think having Mao and Stalin is fine and Hitler would be pusing it.
  12. romelus

    romelus NUCULAR!

    Jan 4, 2002
    taking chicken milk bath
    warfare IS part of civilization, not everyone wants to bury his head in sand
  13. tombeef

    tombeef King

    Feb 5, 2006
    First off history is history. It can't be changed, rewritten, or remade. Because history repeats it's self so often, we need to learn from it. Stalin is hardly even taught in history classes these days, I think it is important to know the TRUTH, not some sugar coated version. For instance, the U.S. lost the Vietnam War and the War of 1812. Most textbooks however, fail to mention this. This does not change the fact. People have a right to know.

    Secondly, CIV IV is not an interactive shooting game in which you push a button and blow someone's head off. Heck, you could play a game almost entirely free of fighting. It's an E rated game, and does not glorify violence in any way.

    Now, I am truly sorry for those who think this is a lack of respect, and I completely understand your position, however, I think that, again, Stalin was a real figure, and his real impact on the world can not be denied.

    Being a teenager myself who attends a very diverse public high scholl of 1300 students, I have to say that I have never seen this, and I am saddened by the fact that so many teens get such a bad rep The fact of the matter is, most kids could care less about communism and Stalin, and don't even really know who he is, partly because he is not taught. This is another reason why he should be put in the game. Granted, as I said earlier, realizing history does not change it, and most of our thoughts should be put to the future, but it is important to learn from past mistakes.

    I think killing a defenseless person is the same no matter how you do it. But I think we must learn, and, therefore, I do not disagree in any way with the placement of Stalin in the game.

    Sorry to all of those who this offends, and cheers.
  14. monkspider

    monkspider Warlord

    Nov 14, 2001
    Wichita, Kansas
    According to Apolyton, some of the civs were revealed on a Norwegian website.

    According to gamer.no, a Norwegian gaming site, C4:W[arlords] will have 6 new civs. And 6 new scenarios. And 10 new leaders and units, 3 new wonders and new resources. Three of the new civs are the Vikings(yay!), Carthage and Gaul. The new scenarios is about the forming of China, Athens vs Sparta, Alexander the Great`s conquests, the Viking raids in Europe, Rome at its height, and the conquests of Genghis Khan. All civs will get a new unique building in addition to the UU.

    It should be noted that the first previews for PTW referred to the Celts as the Gauls, so I'm fairly certain that will be the case here as well.
  15. man o' war

    man o' war AKA Kristophski

    Jan 25, 2004
    Hole in a field, Cambridge, England
    I agree - and Mao is already included; he killed far more than Hitler, just not in Europe or America so no-one seems to realise :crazyeye:

    Bearing in mind that Mao is more recent than Hitler, you can hardly say that "It was a long time ago" as you might with Genghis Kahn - I personally know people who have given first-hard accounts of variouos events...
  16. Guerra

    Guerra Warlord

    Mar 7, 2006
    Toronto, Canada.
    Dr. Corbett, I'm not entirely sure about Carlos I, however, El Cid is one of Spain's greatest national heros... while Queen Isabella is known as a religious murderous nut who ruined her country.

    By the way, I had an excellent professor named Dr. Corbett, any relation? (He taught at U of T)

    Also, why would Gaul be a new civilization? Gaul is the old name for France.

    and back with the Hitler thing, helping the economy? Guys, please, read a history of economics book or something. Hyperinflation is not a good thing. Hitler just kept printing more and more money to fund the war, leading to a very very devalued German dollar.

    So, Hitler didn't help fix the German economy, you people say hes built factories and industralized, provided jobs, etc.

    Think about all the factories and homes that were destroyed.

    Germany today is amongst the first world because of America's Marshall plan and because of the EU.

    Hitler didn't help the Germans very much, sorry.

    Also, someone earlier said that Stalin was prepared or something silly like that? He wasn't prepared, he TRUSTED Hitler over Churchill, and when Churchill told him that Hitler planned to invade Russia Stalin wouldn't believe him! The guy was an absolute twit!

    Each Civilization leader should be amongst the best, the leaders that led that nation to their glory days, had some kind of contribution. Even Genghis Khan, amongst the worst people ever, unified Mongolia, and thats something not easily done.

    Stalin, Hitler, Churchill, Mussolini, de Gaulle, Franco, etc should be in the WWII scenario, but I don't think they should be in the regular game, they just aren't great leaders.
  17. GiantRaven

    GiantRaven Prince

    Jan 23, 2006
    Someone mentioned Hitler
  18. CellKu

    CellKu Emperor

    Feb 13, 2004
    Thanks, finally some useful information about the new add-on.
    I am bit disappointed about the units. The 2K press release talks about "new powerful warlord unit"s, so I thought we might get a leader specific unit, at last. Or at least some kind of second UU, which seems to be the case for the English. But with only ten new units what about the rest? Or did I miss something?
    In contrast, that unique building thing sounds interesting, but how will they implement that? Hopefully, they make sure that if you have a late game UU you will get an early game UB and vice versa - just to balance things a bit.
  19. Boris Godunov

    Boris Godunov Prince

    Aug 23, 2002

    That looks nothing like Brian Blessed! :gripe:
  20. vilemerchant

    vilemerchant Prince

    Jan 30, 2006
    This is silly. Chairman Mao killed more people than Stalin and Hitler put together and he's always in the game! But I guess it doesn't offend anyone in the games target audience if millions of Chinese peasants get killed :p

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