Civs with Muskets UU

[Wuddel]

Does the Janissary healing ability carry over?

 

[Barghaest]

Yes it does.

 

[Securion]

It would be more accurate to make the Carolean infantry musketmen, but i think they made them riflemen because there already are so many musketmen upgrades?

The Caroleans btw is the only large regular infantry unit that have taken more than 50% losses during combat and still were able to continue the fight. They even volunteered to fight again after the defeat at Poltava when their commanders asked them if they wanted to fight against the pursuing russian army. And that was after taking 57% losses (!).
The battle at Poltava by the way is one of the most deadly battle in human history. The caroleans who numbered 12500 men attacked the more than 45000 strong russian army and managed to almost defeat them. It was a series of very unlucky setbacks that finally gave the russians the upper hand. It was the first and only defeat for the caroleans.
Also, the caroleans was very religiously indoctrinated. They never huddled down when bullets started to fly, they never took cover, and they always were on the offensive. Even against much larger enemy forces.
Their tactic of marching against impossible odds while taking incredible losses, and wait to open fire until they were 10-30 meters away from the enemy and then charge with sabers, earned them a reputation across all of Europe as being completely unstoppable. I think the March promotion fits them well. Even though they should probably have the Discipline promotion as well...

A very nice military units that would have been a world legend if it had been english, french, japanese or american... Now they are almost forgotten by history, sadly. Sadly, because it was one of the most disciplined and efficient military units ever devised by men on earth.

 

[jjkrause84]

The Caroleans btw is the only large regular infantry unit that have taken more than 50% losses during combat and still were able to continue the fight.

This is an enormously confusing statement. Do you mean in all of history? If so, you might find yourself painfully in the wrong.

 

[bcaiko]

As far as I know, the American Minutemen lose out on the free promotion if they are from upgraded longswords. Much like Samurai don't get their free promotion if they are upgraded ironnmen.

That's incorrect, I'm afraid. Japanese Samurai and American Minutemen get their respective terrain bonuses so long as the promoted unit doesn't have it already. In other words, a Swordsman becoming Samurai that has the open terrain promotion gets nothing (you don't even get the second promotion), but a unit that has any other promotions will get the open terrain promotion for free upon upgrade.

For this reason, Japanese warriors should always take the rough terrain opening promotion and avoid the open terrain promotion until their inevitable upgrade into Samurai.

 

[Securion]

This is an enormously confusing statement. Do you mean in all of history? If so, you might find yourself painfully in the wrong.

In recorded military history there have not been a lot of military units that have taken more than 30% losses and still been able to fight. (Even less, wanted to fight...)
In most cases 20% are considered heavy losses. 30% is more or less catastrophic.

So taking 57% losses and still have a capable military unit that volunteers to fight that shortly after the defeat, is exceptionally rare.
Most such units are considered legends. (Spartans anyone..?

 

[jjkrause84]

In recorded military history there have not been a lot of military units that have taken more than 30% losses and still been able to fight. (Even less, wanted to fight...)
In most cases 20% are considered heavy losses. 30% is more or less catastrophic.

So taking 57% losses and still have a capable military unit that volunteers to fight that shortly after the defeat, is exceptionally rare.
Most such units are considered legends. (Spartans anyone..?

There are countless examples from the First World War alone of units and formations operating at under 50% strength (plenty of them maintaining high morale as well). While they were not often particularly successful after having sustained so many casualties, they maintained the will to fight.

I agree, though, that your example in your previous post is an exceptional example. Many of the units/formations in the First World War carried on because they had no choice, being isolated from their original trenches after an attack and forced to carry on.

 

[MetaSkipper]

That's incorrect, I'm afraid. Japanese Samurai and American Minutemen get their respective terrain bonuses so long as the promoted unit doesn't have it already. In other words, a Swordsman becoming Samurai that has the open terrain promotion gets nothing (you don't even get the second promotion), but a unit that has any other promotions will get the open terrain promotion for free upon upgrade.

For this reason, Japanese warriors should always take the rough terrain opening promotion and avoid the open terrain promotion until their inevitable upgrade into Samurai.

By that logic, on the path to Minutemen, take open-land promotions?

 

[Louis XXIV]

There are countless examples from the First World War alone of units and formations operating at under 50% strength (plenty of them maintaining high morale as well). While they were not often particularly successful after having sustained so many casualties, they maintained the will to fight.

I agree, though, that your example in your previous post is an exceptional example. Many of the units/formations in the First World War carried on because they had no choice, being isolated from their original trenches after an attack and forced to carry on.

American Civil War had examples as well. They had no business carrying on, but they somehow managed to do it.

 

[ghost88]

American Civil War had examples as well. They had no business carrying on, but they somehow managed to do it.

The Orphan Brigade ( the First Kentucky Brigade) Confederate States Army started the ACW with about 5000 men when they finally surrendered in May of 1865 they had about 250 men stand to. Thats 95% combat loss and still fighting. This is just one of many units on both sides that suffered over 60% losses and kept fighting.

 

[bcaiko]

By that logic, on the path to Minutemen, take open-land promotions?

Yes. Then pop out Minutemen from a city with a Barracks and an Armory for Minutemen with a free Seige promotion to take out cities.

Man, Minutemen got so much better just by being moved into the main upgrade path.