Clan of Embers rebalancing

[WarKirby]

- My workers not getting exp meaning they will NEVER get the 10 xp to get rid of the undisiplined and on top of that they are SO slow you need 2 to come close to one worker for another race. When they "Go native" it is annoying (but not overly costly) I would like to see either the Gerkins get xp like other workers OR have undisciplined removed from them.

The flipside of this, however

1. Gretchins have a far lower cost than any other civ's worker, and even a lower cost than a warrior, allowing you to get some production going quickly in any new city.
2. Gretchin have free maintenance, completely. Yes you need millions of them, but unlike say, elves, or lizardmen, your economy isn't crippled by the millions of workers you have to pay for.
3. Gretchin have 1 inherent combat strength. This makes them almost useless against anything certainly, but it means an entire stack of them can't be absorbed instantly by a single scout. You're only ever going to lose one gretchin from one attack. The strength does also make them occasionally capable of winning a battle, or wounding enemies who try to kill them so your troops can finish the job.
4. Gretchin have an inherent 10% withdrawal chance. not a lot, but it helps their survival a little now and then.
5. Gretchin don't consume food to build, so you can start on one right out of the gate on turn 1 in your capital, and get a headstart on improving lands before anyone else.
6. Not really a property of the gretchin, but of the civ as a whole. They're duplicated by warrens, like anything else, which softens the issues with needing so many.

I do see your point about losing them as barbarians though. Settlers and gretchin shouldn't be getting Undisciplined, I think. If you want to mod your FF to change that, consider it an officially sanctioned mod Can't say when we'll release another patch so I won't be able to do it myself for a while, although I'll make sure it's sorted in 0.60 eventually (could be months though)

- I don't care for the upgrade path screwyness. Other races you original Scout and Warrior can end up being Beastlords/immortals/phalanx I don't like not being able to continue to use what can get to be a very well promoted unit.

The general theme of the clan is that each unit has less value, collectively being a part of a whole. Goblins are very limited in their upgrade paths and generally shouldn't be used for more than cannon fodder anyways (except the wolf riders, who are vicious little buggers). The upgrade path from warrior to berserker is still open though, which is quite a natural progression.

If we get a tag to allow unit-specific national limits, I'd probably give the clan a higher, or completely removed, berserker cap.

 

[Breez]

I understand you points... those are just some of the down sides of the clan for me.

The Grikins having a defense also means they don't automatically stop working when danger gets near. If they didn't have undisciplined they would be okay for me.

The upgrade paths make sense... I just don't like it. At least I was able to make my Mutated WereWolf, from Foxford, Warrior into a Archer. i will take him up the Archery line. The clan can get Crossbowmen and Marksmen right?

I have to say I enjoyed "For the Horde" I wish I would have waited another 50 turns to use it tho. I would have gotten a bunch of Ogres. (no settlers game LOTS of wilderness)

 

[Imuratep]

I remember a game with Clan when I had about 100 gretchins and Stephanos spawned. He attacked one of my cities but as I didn't need them anymore I put them into the city he attacked. As Stephanos does not have blitz the Gretchins could easily defend my city and as my capital had a gretchin spawn rate of 2 per turn I could build more gretchins than he was able to kill. I managed even to keep him in the tile he was standing by surrounding him with two gretchin on each tile around him. That's why I was able to win the war I had started before and finally killed him with my stronger troops.

 

[WarKirby]

I remember a game with Clan when I had about 100 gretchins and Stephanos spawned. He attacked one of my cities but as I didn't need them anymore I put them into the city he attacked. As Stephanos does not have blitz the Gretchins could easily defend my city and as my capital had a gretchin spawn rate of 2 per turn I could build more gretchins than he was able to kill. I managed even to keep him in the tile he was standing by surrounding him with two gretchin on each tile around him. That's why I was able to win the war I had started before and finally killed him with my stronger troops.

hahaha, oh wow
this is exactly the sort of thing they're made for. excellent use of resources.

it seems odd that stephanos wouldn't just take blitz though, he must have been getting plenty of xp from regular slaughtering. That, or strike back with the horde of gretchin he must surely have amasssed from capturing