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Clashing of Empires - A standard map version of Rhye's Civilization Expanded

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Completed Modpacks' started by V. Soma, Feb 3, 2005.

  1. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    You see, there were not much ancient activity (wars),
    so I set almost all nations to MOST aggressive (+2).
    Now I think that it is perhaps too much,
    and kind of an average of (+1) is maybe enough.

    Now I am experimenting with leaving Rome and Scandinavia as +2,
    but the Celts, Babylon and Carthage lowered to +1.
    /this runs as a would be v202/

    And well, in this v202 I DO CHANGE
    great wonders
    so they are kind of tied to geographic regions.
    I think wonders should be built with much more requirements... :)
    I do tests, and will tell how it went
    (I will put up lists of wonder building here)
     
  2. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    Good idea ! Add few wonders for variety :)

    Good luck
     
  3. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    GREAT WONDERS

    I am working on the next verison - and this time around it will be real changing,
    not just cosmeticating mistakes and tidbits.

    Here is my REALITY concept - about wonders:

    Until the age of Industrialism - civ or geography specific wonders!

    This means that an early wonder (mainly wonders of the first TWO eras)
    can be built by only a certain civ or group of civs.
    I go for two aims:
    1.
    REALITY
    Yes, so no Pyramids for the Celts and so on...
    2.
    GAME DYNAMICS
    In "directing" who and when can have and which wonder,
    history can go in a way that certain civs "rise (and fall?)" accordingly.

    I will change the "meaning" of many wonders
    as you will see in the below example,
    by which I would like to illustrate the new wonder-system:

    The big and problematic trio of Rome-Carthage-Scandinavia:

    In the game as now, these 3 civs are not really strong.
    I yet have to test up to a full game, but here is how wonders for them would work:

    ROME:
    Temple of Artemis - changed to The Academy,
    which would be the same as the Great Library, only lasting shorter:
    from Greek Polytheism to Feudalism.
    Rome must be a leader in the ancient age...
    The Academy is based in Rome - so capturing it is not easy thing :)
    Statue of Zeus - name remains but the meaning is NEW:
    Gives a wall in every continental city,
    reduces war weariness,
    doubles city defence,
    AND gives a hoplite every 7 turns.

    It is meant to represent the LIMES and the strength of the empire.
    Zeus is working until Firearms...

    CARTHAGE:
    They get the Great Lighthouse and the Great Library...
    Actually the Library could be built by Babylon and Rome as well,
    but in practice the AI gives it to Carthage all the time... :)
    They are as now, so menaing is self-explanatory...
    Carthage is to be leader until early Middle Age and probably they remain on top
    with their money they can collect...

    SCANDINAVIA:
    They will have a changed Asa Temple,
    which is to give a horse archer every 7 turn,
    from Nordic Cults to Chivalry.

    By this, they can mean a force against Rome or anybody near.
    ALso, the horses might prove to be a good means
    to defend the Vikings when neighbours wake up and smell their blood...

    GENERAL CONCEPTS

    a.
    The early ages wonders are CHEAP,
    so they can be built in 10-20 turns.
    I think it is important not to waste TOO much time and shields on them,
    so that the AI can build defensive and offensive forces,
    and improvements as well.
    b.
    Late wonders are not really changed,
    and they remain to be available to every civ.
    This means wonders from the Industrial Age on.
    (Naturally there are exceptions... like Statue of Liberty)

    In a day or two I will show you the
    FULL LIST OF WONDERS in a table-format.

    As I see it, these changes will make the game
    in the first half a kind of semi-scenario,
    say "world-history",
    which would "melt" into normal game at the later phase...

    Hm? :)
     
  4. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    Nice ! V.Soma :)

    I can't wait !

    This thread was dead ...
     
  5. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    Well, I still have to experiment a little...
    I wanted to give something for the Celts,
    so I tried with Stonehenge (which will be exclusively theirs)
    that it would give +2 free techs...
    ...but it was too unbalancing, as development became too fast.

    Instead, Stonehenge will give happiness until Theology
    (is that long enough?).
    I wiil try this out these days.
    The concept is that the Celts should have a fine Ancient Age
    to be able to build improvements fast and keep up nicely
    until second half of Middle Age, when they get another boost
    with Newton...

    They need this help because they can hardly expand area wise,
    having only 3-4 good cities...
     
  6. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    :) Where you are ?

    I have an idea : why not a fictionnal map for strategic purposes ?

    Like a Tamriel Continent's World of the Elder Scrolls for example ?

    :goodjob: I can't wait !
     
  7. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    Well, I would like to stay with Earth,
    especially as CoE is a version of Rhye's...

    Umm, I am about to give the v3_wonders edition :)
    but I am having trouble:
    Rome (AI) just doesn't want to build the Statue of Zeus :(
    Or only rarely... Think I am going to give them for free...
    only if I know how to...
    ???

    anybody help me with this?
     
  8. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    Roman problem solved! :)

    New version v3 will be up on Tuesday evening (GMT +1)
    It will have supplying exel file of the new wonders...
     
  9. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    Well, we are soon Tuesday evening :)

    Can you create a link to your Excel file ?
     
  10. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    wonders of CoE v3 - part 1
     

    Attached Files:

  11. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    wonders of CoE v3 - part 2:
     

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  12. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    wonders of CoE v3 - part 3
     

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  13. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    Well, now here it is, the new and REALLY new
    Clashing of Empires - v3!

    (to Lachlan: no excel file - see the above pics)

    I really wonder how these wonders will turn out... :)

    I want to call attention to the new Rome:
    They have
    THE ACADEMIA and
    PAX ROMANA
    By them they can - hopefully - be a great power
    at least in the Ancient Age

    In my tests the Scandinavian
    horde of horse archers were also something to see... :)

    I hope they will have nice clashing with the Mongol keshiks...
     
  14. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    One thing to mention:

    These new changes with the wonders are NOT in the Civilopedia...
    This is because I don't want you to deal with files
    to change the original RoX (Rhye's).

    All you have to do is to start the BIQ...

    But this means you can get info ONLY from files I put up here.
    So far here are the pics above in three parts

    Question: Do you need these changes in a downloadabl file, too?
     
  15. Perikles

    Perikles Chieftain

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    Nice (and fun!) adaption of Rhye's mod! :goodjob:

    Just won my v201 game with Babylon by domination in 2005. An overview:
    I started over as I was struck by desease twice before my first settler came out; that was really too painful. Next attempt desease struck only once, but still I took a slow start, with the AI's expanding about twice as fast as me. There was however no competition for settling spots, as I was almost completely isolated.
    At least, so I thought. With nearly everyone declaring war on me, I slightly panicked when seeing that scout boats could transport troops. Onto my shores. But diplomacy easily handled the threat, and even bent the situation to my advantage. Took two cities from Rome with my bowmen. I wanted to create the hanging gardens, but lost the race by a few turns to Carthage (it built lots of wonders); started them too late :sad:
    Later took on Ethiopia (mainly to give my second Arab city some room, also built FP there), followed by the rest of Rome, Scandinavia, India, Carthage, Celts, China, Mongols. Slowly took out Joruba while conquering the aformentioned. I made sure to make an alliance with Carthage and Mongols everytime I went to war (until I declareded on them of course), as they were the only ones I feared.
    I also discoverd the strength of communism this game, there is almost no corruption! I had only used it once before in regular civ, but didn't think it was good then. What a mistake! If I had switched and started conquering earlier, the game shouldn't have taken this long.

    Some (hopefully useful) comments:
    - The isolation went a bit too far to my liking. Also the barbarians really seemed like overkill, especially those immortals (defence 4!). I don't think I would mind the spread of nations not being perfectly historical, if it would make the map a bit more accessible. It works great for Rhye's, but it feels a bit overdone here (from a Babylonian perspective).
    - The agricultural trait (as in Rhye's) would help Babylon get a better start, but I see how they need scouts to make contacts. Settlers upgrades weren't any cheaper though and I only got maps from huts.
    - Barbarians on desert tiles are annoying. I needed to suicide a scout to get them away from suez. First i made a camel rider, but apparently he can't enter desert tiles either, making him rather useless (but I understand the limitations, nothing can be done about this). Overal I like the the concept of impassable deserts though.
    - The Celts didn't built a city in Ireland, making them miss out on important recources.

    I hope I'm being constructive here, these are really just minor remarks. I surely enjoyed playing it! :)
    I don't think i have the time to play your new version though :(
     
  16. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    Perikles, thanks for the story! :)

    Uh, maybe those camels should deserve be able to cross deserts? :)
    My thoughts were they should use roads... but yet... will think of it...

    Well, well, even those annoyances - yet you managed to get domination,
    did not you? :)

    I am sad to read you do not have time for v3,
    I do guess one can play fast games here (8-10 hours),
    but OK, maybe some time later?
    And then some other observations? - I would be grateful...

    And those Celts - they usually DO have a city in Ireland,
    just when they are engaged in very early wars, sometimes they just forget it (?)

    EDIT:
    and well, Rhye went for historicity, I wish to keep that...
    Difficult barbs? Ehh, you did overcome that in the end... :)
     
  17. Perikles

    Perikles Chieftain

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    I'm not that fast of a player :)
    I also have a Rhye's game I want to finish first, and I'm playing some non-civ games too. I have a number of projects I need to do so my gaming time is limited. It's just that I don't want to start jet another game, I'm sorry :sad:

    Yes, eventually :)
    Those immortals were around wel into the Middle Ages. At that point I don't really like being confronted with barbarians anymore. The Mongols lost a lot of forces trying to remove them from Caucasus. I tried removing one with an elephant, but he didn't even scratch him. I didn't want to lose forces to barbarians, so I waited...
     
  18. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    I see... well, maybe I will make it easier for those poor Babylonians...

    I just want to tell I put up a file of the wonders in the opening post
    (...and so I answered my own question... :))
     
  19. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    Just to make things clear around the new wonders:

    Statue of Zeus is renamed to PAX ROMANA
    Asa Temple renamed to THE TEMPLE OF ODIN
     
  20. V. Soma

    V. Soma CFC Staff

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    This morning an idea came to me (oh, well :))
    So, I think I will use Hagia Sophia as a cultural/happiness wonder
    for the Scandinavians,
    and call it something that fits orthodox christianity...

    Do you think those Eastern Europeans need it?

    OK, first lets see some games with v3...
     

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