Classic Literature Reward Incorrect?

[Marnid]

Not sure if this is a bug or is intended:

One of the rewards for the Classic Literature quest (build X libraries) is "library get +2". At first I thought the description text was wrong and it means all libraries get +2, but it is consistent and indeed only one library gets this bonus.

However all of the other "build X of this building" quests give a bonus to ALL of the appropriate building so this one seems like it doesn't fit.

 

[MrCynical]

I'm not sure if it's a bug, but it certainly needs changing for it to be a worthwhile reward for this quest.

 

[ori]

Actually it is not a bug and if you look at the biggest reward (+1 free scientist for the Great Library) it is not big either. Face it this is the one Quest you would fulfill anyway (building libraries in most of your cities so you are not making a big investment just to fulfill the quest, hence the reward should not be too big either. +2 for all libraries would be extremely powerful early on...

 

[Bhruic]

Early on? How early do you consider "early on"? I mean, if you've got the 7 cities, and have built the 7 libraries, generally speaking you've gotten past what I'd consider early on. And an extra 14 beakers isn't really game-breaking by that point.

But yes, it would then make the 1 Scientist kind of a poor choice. Perhaps it could be changed to +1 beaker/library, or 2 Scientists? With Representation that'd be +12 beakers, and even without, the extra GPPs would make it worth it.

Bh

 

[Turinturambar]

Well +2 beakers would be really powerful even in the midgame. After scientific method it would essentially be an extra University of Sankore without the need to run and spread a state religion.
Would be too much of a bonus, considering you don´t give up anything for completing the quest, since you usually want libraries everywhere anyway.

Granted some other quests do give wonder-like rewards as well, like the build musketmen and the collosseum quest with their free golden ages, but they require you to actually have a certain wonder already and the units/buildings are far less desirable than libraries.

 

[ori]

+2 is in effect +2.5 only with the library modifier, add the odd monastery or university and you easily get +3 or more for a building you would build anyway.
as for +2 scientists - this would translate in even more free great scientists (which basically is what the +1 free scientist for the great library does -it increases the GPP in that city) - so that would be even more powerful.
I don't really think a quest that asks you to do what you would do anyway should give too much of an advantage - but I also think that the events should be there for flavor and not give too much of an advantage or disadvantage when they occur...

 

[Bhruic]

That's kind of a silly attitude to take, no offense. Saying that you'd "build them anyway" is a cop-out - and not necessarily true. I'm not going to bother building a library in my production cities, for example. Or, at least, not as an early build. And I often don't have enough cities to satisfy the demands of the quest, requiring me to build more cities. Why would I go through that hassle for almost no reward?

The answer, of course, is that I wouldn't - and don't. I never bother with the quest unless I've got the GL. It's just not worth it. And I never satisfy it because I'd build the libraries "anyway", because I wouldn't. It doesn't make sense to.

Furthermore, considering the rewards of a lot of the other quests in this genre, this one is distinctly underpowered. I'd much rather get the forge quest, for example. And that is something I'm going to build in all my cities.

Bh

 

[ori]

We have different playing styles
The forge one is not that much more powerful though, unless you don't have any metal (then it is huge) or are in the midst of a war (preparation) were swords are going to make a difference - the +2 stays on for ever, in one city its very little, I agree, in all cities it would IMHO be too much...

 

[Bhruic]

I don't necessarily build it for the production, although that's certainly important. But the extra happiness from gold/silver/gems is stellar, especially early game. The combination of the two makes it a high priority for me.

And yeah, +2/city might be too powerful, but what about +1/city? Seems like a fair compromise to me.

Bh

 

[Marnid]

hmm... on second thought, I guess the +2 in one library is balanced with the other two choices (free ancient tech (usually worth ~100) or build a wonder to get free scientist).

In general the rewards for events and quests seem related to the usefulness of the building/unit/civic. (i.e. weak units/building/terrains have very positive events while, strong units/buildings have more negative events)

I guess library is then considered the strongest building on average? (I don't play multiplayer, just against AI), I always build forge the most too.

 

[ori]

And yeah, +2/city might be too powerful, but what about +1/city? Seems like a fair compromise to me.

Bh

Sure, but you would have to change the other choices accordingly - and so it becomes difficult. As Marnid points out the Great Library bonus then becomes tricky, but hey that is what developers are for

 

[MrCynical]

As it stands the free scientist is a no-brainer if you actually have the library. Both the first two options are seriously poor, and need a little beefing up to match it.