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[RD] Clinton vs. Trump - USA Presidential race.

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by onejayhawk, Mar 23, 2016.

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  1. GoodEnoughForMe

    GoodEnoughForMe n.m.s.s.

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    Yeah, the wealthy don't spend nearly as high a percent of tax breaks on goods and services that middle and lower class do. This is backed up by decades of research.
     
  2. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd Rest in Peace Black Panther

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    So one source of criticism against Hillary gets debunked and your reaction is denial? Jeez, just pick a new reason to hate her, don't cling to the debunked ones... Isn't that the defense of Trump I keep hearing?
    As good an explanation as any... Another is the "Brexit" mentality worldwide...
     
  3. christos200

    christos200 Never tell me the odds

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    Facts prove you wrong. To use an example, lets compare conservative Reagan with liberal Clinton:

    Reagan:
    Clinton:
     
  4. El_Machinae

    El_Machinae Colour vision since 2018 Retired Moderator

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    Taxes spur investment, if you live in a regime that allows one to use investment purchases as a write-off for one's taxes. Seed money creates employment in the earliest stage of a startup, but it's consumer spending that keeps a business employing people. Likewise, lowering taxes doesn't encourage employment. You hire people based on the demand for you product. As well, since hiring people is tax deductible, the opportunity cost on an employee is a lot lot lower if there are corporate taxes.

    Edit, anyone can create employment by allowing the debt:GDP ratio rise. Importantly, under all of Reagan, the cost of the debt rose relative to GDP the entire time. Tax cuts don't spur growth the way you think it does. There's a time and a place for supply side stimulus. And Trump is pure Trickle Down instead.
     
  5. Archbob

    Archbob Ancient CFC Guardian

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    I'm almost sure you are completely cherry picking your facts, since there is a growth chart right here:

    http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth. Reagan and Clinton's growth rates were fairly similar, the only difference is that Reagan left the country in defeciet and the Clinton years, we had surplus.

    Reagan's Years are categorized by lots of ups and downs, Clinton's years were much more steady. Reagan had a few great years, but several down years as well. Clinton's years were pretty much all up and much more consistent.
     
  6. Thedrin

    Thedrin Deity

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    What do these stats have to do with the middle class?
     
  7. Thedrin

    Thedrin Deity

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    I'm missing enough information that I'm not quite following this post, but I know that I really want to understand it.
     
  8. TheCherryOnTop

    TheCherryOnTop Chieftain

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    I thought this was funny:

    #TrumpCaseNotes: Donald Trump Explains Famous Legal Cases
    By ELIE MYSTAL, KATHRYN RUBINO, and JOE PATRICE

    Trump FlagThe internet has been having a lot of fun doing book reports in the style of Donald Trump. We want to play! We don’t have English degrees, but we do have law degrees. Above the Law now brings you Donald Trump’s interpretation our most famous legal decisions.

    Marbury v. Madison
    Thomas Madison, Thomas Jefferson Madison, one of our great, great founding men, probably the best who was also great with the blacks, okay. He bought Louisiana from the Mexicans and turned it into New Orleans, one of our great, great lakes. So this great man decided that he didn’t want hire this loser who was a total disaster. The POLITICIANS… you know who I’m talking about… you know… the SWAMP PEOPLE, tried to make make the President hire this loser, but they lost. Tommy won. Bigly. EVEN THE SUPREME COURT, which is so weak, had to admit that Thomas was right the whole time.

    Palsgraf v. Long Island Railroad Co
    This woman, and if you look at her, you’ll know what kind of woman I’m talking about. She gets hurt. Okay. At a train station. After some loser, a very bad person, drops fireworks on the train tracks. Sad! But then this woman, and she was just looking for money, folks. Just looking for money. She sues the RAILROAD. What a nasty woman.

    Miranda v. Arizona
    The cops, and we have to support our cops… Our police. We need law and order, but the rigged media cancelled it. The cops caught these guys, these bad hombres. And they confessed. OKAY FOLKS? They confessed to crimes, to murders, to stealing our jobs and taking them back to Mexico. But then these liberals who don’t know how to win, said that these bad guys needed to be told things. SPECIAL THINGS that nobody even knows about. “Warnings” they called it. Telling CRIMINALS what we are not going to do to them. It’s true. So dumb. I would keep the criminals in suspense. We’ve got to have the water boarding, we’ve got to kill their families.

    Roe v. Wade
    I’ve never met this woman, Roe. I. Don’t. Even. Think. That’s. Her. Real. Name. But she says “I want an abortion!” Yeah right. Like anybody had sex with her. But this abortion, folks, it’s DISGUSTING. When you are a doctor — and the Supreme Court said this is true — women will just let you grab them by the pussy and rip their baby right out of their inside-purse. And, you know, when I was a younger man, I thought this was just fine. I had NO PROBLEMS doing this myself. But it’s wrong. And ACTIONS speak louder than words.

    Korematsu v. United States
    Listen, there’s a law, and that Fred Korematsu, he broke it. He’s a bad yat-su. And ya know. Internment camps, you know, they’re not that bad. We’re at war people! The Japanese they’re not sending us their best. No, they’re sending us their criminals, their rapist, their SPIES people. You’ve got to be smart about this. The Japanese government is much smarter, much sharper, much more cunning. Listen we’ve got to have complete and total shutdown of the Japanese entering the United States until our country’s representatives can figure out what the hell is going on, and the ones that are here, we’ve got to lock ‘em up.

    Griswold v. Connecticut
    This case? We’ve got some nasty, loose women and uh, you know, they don’t want babies. And they’re married but you can’t blame them — I’m a star. Now the Supreme Court says birth control is okay, and there’s a right to marital privacy. And that’s yuge, let me tell you. Have you all seen Melania? Stand up and say hi Melania. There you go, isn’t she beautiful folks? I’ll tell ya, I don’t apologize to her though. Because you know, birth control, that’s what made America great again. Birth control, it’s like a great wall, that women have to pay for.
     
    MagisterCultuum and Sommerswerd like this.
  9. Archbob

    Archbob Ancient CFC Guardian

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    Also take a look at this chart:

    http://politicsthatwork.com/graphs/top-gdp-and-tax-rate

    You need to take out the WW2 years because they don't really count. Even taking that out, the only year where the top marginal tax rate was less than 60% that is in the top 20 in growth was 1984 when the top rate was 50%(far higher than it is currently). None of Reagan's other years where he cut the taxes even comes close to that. Our best years are crowded in the time period when our top marginal tax rate was the highest.

    This notion of lower taxes=more growth is utter nonsense.
     
  10. Kyriakos

    Kyriakos Alien spiral maker

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    Sorry, but only people who wear blinds would fail to see how utterly bizarre it is for Comey to make two u-turns in a week. And it goes without saying he/the FBI did not read 650K emails in a few days, Sommer.
    How exactly can you not identify this as rather dangerous?
     
  11. Takhisis

    Takhisis Jinping, wer fragt uns?

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    Erm, no. That's exactly what I am saying does not happen in other countries where the chief executive is elected directly. If there's a problem, you recount the votes in the district where there was a problem.
    They also came up with slavery remaining legal, but that was done away with when people regained their senses.
    And probably the largest single public works project ever, i.e. building a wall from ocean to ocean?
     
  12. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd Rest in Peace Black Panther

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    You are familiar with the Document Review capabilities of the FBI based on your expertise as a...?... ? ...

    The FBI is 35,000 strong. If they assigned 10% of their manpower to resolve this issue that would be 180 emails to review, per person. By way of reference, I can and have reviewed 2000 emails in a work day, while looking for particularly sensitive content. Your incredulity is your pro-Trump/anti-Hillary bias Kyr... pure and simple... it has no legitimate basis in reasonable expectations. There's no conspiracy there, no matter how desperately you want/need there to be. You don't want Hillary to be off the hook, so anything you hear that absolves her, will immediately send you into tin-foil-hat mode, and its clear as day to anyone who has done Document Review work.
    As I said there is an actual reason for that... like for the fact that black people are considered human now whereas back then they weren't. The perceptions underlying "equal votes for every state" argument havent changed.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2016
  13. schlaufuchs

    schlaufuchs La Femme Moderne

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    Not to mention a significant portion of the emails they ended up looking at were duplicates of ones they'd already cleared the first time they investigated her, making it much easier to eliminate them.
     
  14. Camikaze

    Camikaze Administrator Administrator

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    The FBI were only interested in those emails which were sent or received by Clinton, and which were on Wiener's laptop (apparently due to syncing with Huma Abedin's emails). Finding all emails sent and received by a particular person is not a difficult task. As it happened, apparently almost all of them were duplicates of emails that the FBI had already seen and reviewed. So I'm not sure how you're reaching the conclusion that the FBI couldn't possibly have identified all emails sent and received by Clinton which were on Wiener's laptop (a process presumably facilitated by some sort of document review software), and that once they'd found that small subset of emails, they couldn't go through them and determine that, of those few (if any) that aren't duplicates, there's nothing at all untoward.

    Keep in mind that this second announcement by the FBI isn't exactly the worlds best news for Clinton - it brings the emails squarely back into the spotlight, just after Trump had been drawing a bit more attention to himself. Clinton would much prefer Trump to be receiving attention rather than herself. As can be seen from Republican responses, this just provides another opportunity for the GOP to talk about her emails and how, even though she hasn't committed a crime, she apparently endangered every man, woman and child in the US.
     
  15. FriendlyFire

    FriendlyFire Codex WMDicanious

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    Yes I assume that Publicly announcing that FBI having gone investigated ALL Emails relating to Clinton recovered from Wieners computer now find no evidence of a crime ?
    At least the FBI prioritized completing the investigation of the emails. The vast majority were duplicates and already investigated anyways

     
  16. Zkribbler

    Zkribbler Deity

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    The Great Zkribblo predicts: Comey is toast.
     
  17. zxcvbob

    zxcvbob Emperor

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    Has anyone, other than Clinton herself, said that she hasn't committed a crime? Comey previously laid-out the case for her to be indicted for espionage (gross negligence in handling TS/SCI information, but he carefully used the phrase "extreme carelessness") but then said "no reasonable prosecutor" would prosecute. Not really his call to make, but it does make one wonder what his definition of "reasonable" is. I've discussed this with people who have TS clearances, and they tell me intent is not required to be prosecuted for mishandling intel -- I don't know myself, but they all seem to agree on this point.

    DOJ has previously told us it would take over a year to analyze 30000 emails. But we're supposed to believe now that they've looked at 650000 in less than a week? Were they lying before, or are they lying now? (not mutually exclusive, I guess)
     
  18. Zelig

    Zelig Beep Boop

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    Well pretty much everyone in America has committed various crimes, making a claim to the negative is never safe. Has Clinton even claimed to have not committed a crime?
     
  19. Arwon

    Arwon

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    Lol how exactly do you think document review and discovery works? Are you picturing Comey standing there with a highlighter and reams of printouts?
     
  20. whyidie

    whyidie Emperor

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    What u-turn ? There was no u-turn. His first letter said "we found more emails. We'll investigate."

    His last statement said "we reivewed them and it doesn't change our prior conclusion".

    Thats not a u-turn.

    Frankly, I'm glad he sent the first letter. The political parties blew it out of proportion, not Comey.
     
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