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Coastal Fortress

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by MysteryX, Feb 17, 2011.

  1. MysteryX

    MysteryX Chieftain

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    Is there a point to having a Coastal Fortress?

    I have played a few games where I was relying on Costal Fortresses to limit the damage enemy navies could do while I was skimping on my own navy to pursue land wars against neighbors. It is my understanding that they protect from naval bombardment.

    I have seen a lot of Coastal Fortresses destroyed by bombardment from Destroyers. On their very first try at bombardment. It seems like more bombardment attacks from enemy Destroyers fail after my Coastal Fortress has been destroyed.

    At first I blamed the random number generator, assuming I was a victim of a series of accidents, as are we all. However, I am beginning to suspect that Coastal Fortresses are just simply worthless.
     
  2. Ataxerxes

    Ataxerxes Chieftain

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    IIRC they don't work at all. It's a bug. Agreed they're just about worthless even if they worked. A navy of your own that can retreat into cities if injured is the best bet.
     
  3. Raliuven

    Raliuven Chieftain

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    In spite of my numerous posts sarcastically praising coastal fortress, they do not work. I don't know the full story behind the bug, but they do not work and are almost always destroyed by the first bombardment (I would hazard to say they are immediately destroyed on the first bombardment - I've never had one survive - and yes, I have built them to test it out, though not extensively).
     
  4. Lord Emsworth

    Lord Emsworth Chieftain

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    That Coastal Fortresses perform so badly has got to do with how they work and how the AI behaves.

    Coastal fortresses will bombard any ship that moves from one tile adjacent to it (coast tile) to another tile also adjacent to it (coast tile), IOW it works like a ZOC hit, but it is necessary that a unit moves coast-coast.

    The problem is that the AI behaviour unwittingly thwarts most chances of getting ZOC hits from CFs. It is unwitting because this is not done to avoid ZOC hits, but simply because sea tiles grant a larger line of sight than coast tiles do. And so, even AI galleys will mainly move coast-sea-sea-coast, and cases where an AI moves or has to move coast-coast are rare.


    It is quite hard to explain, but worth half a *facepalm* once you understand it.
     
  5. ChaosArbiter

    ChaosArbiter Chieftain

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    I've had them survive a bombardment, although usually from the other side - it'll take 2-3 shots from *my* ships to break a CF.

    That said, I do build them occasionally, usually because there's nothing else to build in the town that I want/need. No upkeep, IIRC ... could be wrong, though.
     
  6. Ceoladir

    Ceoladir Come Fly With Me

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    They are almost as pointless as (insert other pointless builds here).
     
  7. bigFRANK

    bigFRANK Chieftain

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    From the description they have a 1 range ZOC, I have yet to see the AI drive up and be enganged by a CF though so if that’s the only thing left to build and you don’t need more units then pick wealth. Far better to have some arty ready to redline your opponents navy if they get close and then finish them with a destroyer.
     
  8. Raliuven

    Raliuven Chieftain

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    I almost choked on my milky way. I've never seen it described in such an adept way. :goodjob:
     
  9. MysteryX

    MysteryX Chieftain

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    If they are pointless, I'm not building them.

    I am trying to get myself out of the habit of building structures just because I can. I just recently stopped building the Courthouse in my capitol. It's still hard to resist clicking it when it pops up on the production list, only takes one turn to build and I'm so wealthy that the upkeep is so insignificant ...
     
  10. BuckyRea

    BuckyRea Boldly Going

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    I once had a capital city with one shield of corruption. I didn't think caps could get corruption, but there that little red sucker was, like a crack dealer on the White House lawn (that's a George H.W. Bush reference for you senior citizens out there). But I just flipped one of my tax collectors over to cop and went about my business. No need to build a courthouse.
     
  11. Ceoladir

    Ceoladir Come Fly With Me

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    You were in Communism, no?
     
  12. BuckyRea

    BuckyRea Boldly Going

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    NEVER! Ugh, I loathe communism. (I'm very emotional about how I play my games, so I never do feudalism, communism, or fascism.) I was democracy or monarchy and it was a huge city with buttloads of shields. But it was corruption, not pollution, causing that one red shield. Now that I think about it, it may have been a vanilla game.
     
  13. Ataxerxes

    Ataxerxes Chieftain

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    Good decision on Coastal Fortresses.:lol:

    A lot of cities can do without courthouses. If a city is 90% corrupt there isn't much point. Just farm Scientists and set the city for some build that might be completed before the game ends. I'm a builder but I always find the best way to happiness is to get more resources the AI won't trade to me. Most of my wars are over resources.
     
  14. scratchthepitch

    scratchthepitch Chieftain

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    I think I've built them in the past, but probably just because I could. I don't ever remember putting them to a test. By the time I could build them, my navy was more than a match for any rival and they never got close to my cities. Having a strong naval element that can intercept the ships before they reach your cities is what I do. When at war, I set up picket lines off the other civ's shores and sink their ships as they attempt to cross.
     
  15. timerover51

    timerover51 Chieftain

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    I have modified the coastal fortress to boost shield, commerce, and food production, along with autoproducing cannon which can be upgraded to artillery, and also have it set to reduce corruption, assuming that it will reduce smuggling. All that makes it more useful, especially the auto-produced cannon. One of these days, I will get around to adding a seacoast cannon unit with lethal sea bombardment that upgrades to a seacoast artillery unit that also has lethal sea bombardment. Both of them should be immobile.
     
  16. bigFRANK

    bigFRANK Chieftain

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    Nice idea the auto production of cannon, would make the CF worthwhile (to some degree).

    Adding the other benefits may be over egging the pudding though.
     
  17. timerover51

    timerover51 Chieftain

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    What is wrong with over-egging the pudding? I figure that the AI has enough benefits of its own, including knowing where every resource is going to appear on the board.
     
  18. Raliuven

    Raliuven Chieftain

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    Next step, CF small wonder. Good work so far!
     
  19. Tarc

    Tarc Chieftain

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    Sry, little bit of an old bump but was looking for info on this today. What happened to the coastal fortress between PTW and Conquests? Did it trigger differently in PTW, i.e. not needing them to do that coast-coast movement pattern that it apparently does now?
     
  20. Lord Emsworth

    Lord Emsworth Chieftain

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    I wouldn't think there is any difference. A ZOC-hit is a ZOC-hit.
     

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