[BNW] Community Deity Game #39 - Carthage

Grendeldef

Trancerelic & coffeeholic
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Apr 30, 2012
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Finland
Oops, I got bored again and since I've had the map ready for ages I'll take the liberty of switching the order of Dido & Gandhi.




Spoiler Carthage :


Phoenician Heritage:

- All coastal Cities get a free Harbor
- Units may cross mountains after the first Great General is earned, taking 50 HP damage if they end a turn on a mountain


African Forest Elephant

Unique mounted unit of the Carthaginian civilization. Replaces the Horseman.

Special abilities:

Great Generals II promotion (Combat Very Likely To Create Great Generals.)
Feared Elephant: Enemy units receive -10% Combat Strength when adjacent to any unit with this promotion

Special traits:

Doesn't require Horses
Extra strength (14 vs. 12)
Slower movement -1
Greater Production cost (100 vs. 75)


Quinquereme

Unique naval melee unit of the Carthaginian civilization. Replaces the Trireme.

Special traits:

Extra strength (13 vs. 10)





Please see the CDG Series Discussion Thread to express yourself if you have remarks and ideas. Some maps in this series use mods. This map uses the DLC map packs, so you will need “Explorers Map Pack”, “Scrambled Nations”, and “Scrambled Continents”, as well as the earlier (and more common) DLC such as “Wonders of the Ancient World”.

Please share your experience playing this map, but if you post in the first page of this thread, use the SPOILER tag if you attach a picture, make a comment about your neighbors, nearby natural wonders, locations of ancient ruins, terrain features, luxes, resources, etc.

Before you download and start playing the map, please take a moment to speculate on your initial thoughts and plans for the game. Which version will you be playing? Will you settle in place? Will you try to found a religion? What are your plans for getting the most from the UA, UB, and UU? What Victory Condition will you be aiming for?

After you play the map, please take the time to post a screen shot relevant to your victory and write about your experience with the map. Could you notice the edits to the map? Did you have any difficulty getting resources? Was this map easier or harder than the typical deity game? What VC did you pursue, and what was your path to victory (or defeat)? What World Wonders did you build? What did you do with religion and how many GP did you faith purchase? How many techs did you steal with spies, and how where you using them towards the end of the game?

All VCs are enabled and there isn't even suggestion - have fun of figuring something out. It's also supposed to be easy enough to actually meet the achi requirements even though it'll will mean a very different game to a normal one.

The Map & settings of all 3 versions.

Spoiler Start :


Map is 8/20 Terra Incognita all civs starting on the same continent which is very small but there's a number of decent size habitable islands reachable with Sailing. Generally there is much more land than in a std TI map.

- lots of additional NWs in total but none on the starting continent
- Coal, Aluminium, Oil & Uranium will require Astronomy to reach
- very few Horse & Iron tiles in the starting continent, the islands have much more
- additional resources & luxes all over the map apart from the starting continent. Also the 2nd continent offers generally excellent city spots to compensate the very late settling
- blocking ice has been removed
- coastal areas should be more likely 2 than 1 tile wide
- all versions have additional ruins, the easier ones even more so



Opponents are hand picked to avoid Shaka, Attila & Alex. Also most of them have some sort of naval perks. Depending mostly on RNG the nearby islands may be settled early on or more likely not much before ~T80 which is from the gaming pov a bit sad.

Spoiler The Bunch :
Byzantium, Denmark, England, India,The Netherlands, Portugal & Rome



Different versions:


Lite has starting advantages but AI is intact.

- Scout
- Archer
- Quinquereme
- Pottery
- 100 G


Easy has starting advantages but AI is intact.

*** SETTLER *** Make a good use of it
- Scout
- Archer
- Quinquereme
- Pottery
- Sailing
- 100 G



Hopefully you'll manage to settle several cities beyond the seas as the AI is a bit binary on this issue - probably you'll have much more time to claim the land than normally but if you'll wait too long the AI will breed like rabbits.




Spoiler Achievements :


I think the theme here is obvious - it's pretty much all about exploring and the point maximum of 42 has some nice relation to exploration & going beyond though no mice where harmed during this experiment. I left the usual x number of y units out on purpose for this one. Let me know if wording and/or meaning is messy so I can clarify early.


1) Settle pre Education, capped 8 points

1pt for 1st city somewhere which requires Sailing
1 additional point for each new city and additional island


2) Trading , capped 6 points

*** This was supposed to be capped 1 pt per civ but it's not clearly stated so any unpillaged TR with any major civ is worth a point or half a point ***


A - as originally stated

1 pt for each full term Sea Trade Route with another major civ
0.5 pts each full term Trade Route with another major civ or CS


B - as it should've been

1 pt for each full term Sea Trade Route with a different major civ
0.5 pts each full term Trade Route with another major civ or CS

ie. capped 1 for major each major civ and 0.5 for each CS





3) Settling with Astronomy but before industrial

1 pt for 1 city
3 pts for 2 cities
6 pts for 3(+) cities

4) connect Industrial & beyond resources in their era or in case of Oil & Aluminium next era works too, capped 8 points


1 pt per resource, capped 3 per city and no points for multiple tiles of single resource. Total points halved if not all 4 are connected.

5) Ancient ruins taken in the game

5 = 1 pt
8 = 2 pts
10 = 3 pts
12 = 4 pts
15(+) = 6 pts

6) First to meet CSs, capped 8 points

1 pt for each requiring Sailing
2 pts for each requiring Astronomy


7) 'Mountains are only rough hills' attitude bonus

3 pts for making a city connection or fill a CS road quest over a mountain
1 pt for GG bomb on a mountain

bonus is doubled with both so the actual max points is 50.














Spoiler for links to previous threads in CDG series :
CDG1: Persia, Oct. 31st, 2015, domination, Pangea, hard, map by Consentient
CDG2: Assyria, Nov. 15th, 2015, science, Pangaea, medium, map by Consentient
CDG3: Ethiopia, Dec. 2nd, 2015, culture, NQ Pangaea, hard, map by Consentient
CDG4: Spain, Dec. 17th, 2015, domination, NQ Pangaea, medium, map by Consentient.
CDG5: Indonesia, Jan. 2nd, 2016, culture, NQ Continents, hard, map by Consentient.
CDG6: Zulus, Jan. 15th, 2016, domination, Oval, easy, map by Consentient.
CDG7: Shoshone, Feb. 2nd, 2016, culture, Oval, very easy, map by Enslingkorp.
CDG8: Austria, Feb. 15th, 2016, science, Pangaea, very easy, map by IronfighterXXX.
CDG9: Brazil, Feb. 28th, 2016, culture, Pangaea, medium, map by Blatc.
CDG10: Denmark, March 14th, 2016, domination, Lakes, hard, map by Beetle.
CDG11: Venice, April 1st, 2016, domination, Archipelago, very easy, map by Wild_Woojsha.
CDG12: Byzantium, April 15th, 2016, domination, Continents, very hard, map by Beetle.
CDG13: Inca, April 30th, 2016, culture, Pangaea, medium, map by Shark Diver.
CDG14: Celts, May 18th, 2015, domination or culture, Oval, hard, map by Consentient.
CDG15: America, May 30th, 2016, diplomacy, Mesopotamia, medium, map by Beetle.
CDG16: Sweden, June 14th, 2016, domination or diplomacy, HB Continents, medium, map by Consentient.
CDG17: Germany, July 2nd, 2016, diplomacy, Pangaea, easy, map by Dan Quayle.
CDG18: France, July 14rd, 2016, diplomacy, HB Continents, hard, map by MaxAttack.
CDG19: Ottomans, Aug. 5th, 2016, domination, Continents, medium, map by Beetle.
CDG20: Portugal, Aug. 20th, 2016, domination, Pangaea, medium, map by Beetle.
CDG21: China, Sept. 9th, 2016, domination, Pangaea, medium, map by @Dan Quayle.
CDG22: Maya, Oct. 2nd, 2016, domination or science, NQ Pangaea, hard, map by @consentient.
CDG23: Iroquois, Oct. 15th, 2016, domination or culture, NQ Oval, very hard, map by @consentient.
CDG24: Babylon, Nov. 11th, 2016, science, Terra Incognita, medium, map by @beetle.
CDG25: Arabia, Jan. 15th, 2018, domination, Pangea Plus, medium, map by @beetle.
CDG26: Polynesia, Jan. 29th, 2018, culture, Small Continents Plus, easy, map by @beetle.
CDG27: Poland, Feb. 18th, 2018, domination, Terra Incognita, medium, map by @beetle.
CDG28: Huns, March 4th, 2018, domination, Terra Incognita, hard, map by @Grendeldef.
CDG29: Korea, March 24th, 2018, science, Small Continents Plus, easy, map by @beetle.
CDG30: Songhai, April 23rd, 2018, domination, Terra Incognita, medium, map by @Grendeldef.
CDG31: Russia, May 10th, 2018, domination, Terra Incognita, medium, map by @Grendeldef.
CDG32: England, June 9th, 2018, domination, Continents, medium, map by @raider980.
CDG33: Aztec, June 24th, 2018, domination, Lakes, medium, map by @beetle.
CDG34: Rome, Nov. 29th, 2018, domination, HB Continents, hard, map by @beetle.
CDG35: Greece, Dec. 24th, 2018, domination, HB Pangea, very hard, map by @consentient.
CDG36: Japan, Jan. 12th, 2018, domination, Oceania, medium, map by @beetle.
 

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Slightly longer entry stint than usual but still only quick 50 turns and it looks like a suitable RP game as the AI is not rushing to the islands though I haven't met all yet.

Spoiler T50 :


T9 DoW Portugal, T13 DoW The Dutch, T19 peace with Maria after 2nd Worker as I was about to loose the Scout, DoF few turns later, T36 DoF India, currently also with Denmark & Byzantium, T45 pantheon - 2 fpt for Gems & Pearls.
7 Ruins so far, 3 CS first contacts and I sort of didn't think about the time it will take for the Settlers to swim around so the ones from 4th onwards are a bit late. On the other hand early Caravan to Maria gave instant DoF, 30% of my bpt and at least one pop in Carthage which in this case is useful.
I'll go for 5 or 6 cities I think as the securing city connection will be an issue even when free Harbors will give decent cash return for larger army. Advancing the current war with Will is highly unlikely as I got more important stuff to build and land to claim & secure. Some xp and pillaged caravans would be nice and he got the first religion so stopping that is good too.

Spoiler T50 Carthage :

 
After playing the map a bit further I made a slight change in achi #4 for the rest, I'll use the original wording & intent. I also changed the notion about the # of NWs to have some closer correlation with reality - there're tons of NWs.

Spoiler :




T67 Dutch peace as Horseman vs Archer is not an optimal battle plan. Only managed one Worker and two Caravans but prevented him settling any closer. T69 6th & final 1st wave city as ran out of units clearing barbs, T75 4th religion - all the good perks were taken but decided to run on Tithe anyway. T84 Liberty GS planted, T94 NC & CS and DoWed William again with support of Theo and he was denounced by everyone




T102 Pyramids, T103 Renaissance by Lizzy which was odd as she was several techs off the pace and had lost London very early. T106 Education and even bought a Uni, T114 enhanced against all odds with happiness from Shrines & Temples. T128 Machinery, T130 1st city on the 2nd continent by the first NW I saw and 2nd few turns later as I build 2 Settler to be ready to swim asap after Astronomy. T141 Amsterdam without wonders which was very odd as he was the point leader before the war. At this point William was also in war with Rome & Denmark






 
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Trying this now since I can’t seem to win the current (Deity) GotM.

Looks like a really fun map! Props enough for getting me to go Liberty!

SIP to be sure.
My usual Liberty BO: Scout, Scout, Shrine, Monument

EDIT: Looks like I am going for full points (plus Messenger of the Gods for bonus karma), but I need some help with the accounting:
1 additional point for each new city and additional island
For the additional point, must the new city be on an island different than the one before?
Is a new city (after the 1st additional island) on a new additional island worth one or two points?

Thanks! Great map! Griefing the neighbor hard, but waiting on the AFE for maximum carnage.
 
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Hmm, it seems I haven't even posted my results and I even finished my game uncharacteristically fast. Dom on T26x I think after I was convinced that the AI sadly didn't want to or was very late in its expansion.

Anyway, to rephrase the achi in question 'one point for each settled city and one point for each settled island or in practical terms it means 1 point for the 1st city requiring Sailing, 2 points for a city on a new island after that and 1 pt for a city if the island is already inhabited by you. Seems much more confusing now than the time I originally wrote it.
 
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T266 Dom.

Quick points count brings it up to 40 .

1) 4 pts - 3 cities on 2 islands as I ran out of units claiming space in time. Barbs surely weren't using contraceptives here.
2) 6 pts - This achi has unintended version in the OP so I added the one which this was supposed to be there as well. You may use whichever version you prefer here.
3) 6 pts - 3 cities
4) 8 pts - 2 Panormus oil, ura
3 Lilybaeum coal, oil, alu, ura
3 Zama Regia alu, oil
5) 6 pts - 15th on T133 and some 25 in total
6) 7 pts - 5 with Sailing, 1 Astronomy
7) 3 pts - road to Lilybaeum as I apparently forgot to bomb on a mountain though I had plenty of Generals

Spoiler :
















 
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Turn 334 SV.

Finished a few days ago, forgot to keep track of points.

Spoiler :
15 total cities founded on 6 different landmasses including the starting one. William was the big military threat, but Theodora came closest to winning. Her culture was off the charts, only India held her off. No one else had launched more than 2 parts when I won.

Fun map. Never built that many cities before. 1st time I ever used the "new cities start with +3 pop" policy.
 
Any pix available? I'm especially keen on seeing if the AI was any more expansive than in my game.
 
upload_2019-4-8_18-9-4.png


thats the best I can do. still plenty of spots to settle. the AI never really seemed to explore. looking back i think it was actually 14 cities on 7 landmasses.
 
This map looks fun! I have no experience with this kind of map type. I don't even think I have it in my game.. Anyways! My first thought is to go wide and use Liberty. I would like to conquer early on, but all depends on how diplomacy works out in the game. So many factors to apply here. My plan is to then to go exploration for production and happiness. I would prefer if my ideology was order, but that's not something you decide on the spot. I will settle on the spot however, it seems decent to me.

I will try to settle on the different islands since colonization seems fun and also benefiting with the UA. It will also be fun to explore the map and not just the old pangea crap! Both of the UU will be come in handy since you probably need to kill a few barbs to make sure your settlers are ok.

I will not try to get points, but I will most likely build a very late NC since I will go with many cities.

This will of course probably make early war hard, but I will try.

All right... turn I'm at turn 156 now. It's all good in the hood.

I took a worker from The Netherlands and one from a CS (Ragusa). I made peace with The Netherlands after I forward settle both him and Portugal. It was pretty cool though, since I promised them both not to do it again. I also built caravans for them both for diplomatic and scientific. I never made peace with Ragusa with the mindset of conquering them. I want a wide Empire and it looks like a OK city. It's coastal so I get my use of my UA. I also enjoy the XP that my small army gets from it.

I decided to take a shot at The Netherlands. It seemed like a pretty good move. I didn't want to fight Portugal since I don't have a navy and she has been a good ally. The Netherlands also built the Forbidden Palace which is a great wonder, but other than that it had no other wonder. So I took his capital with very little resistance. He was at war with both Portugal and Denmark. I soon after made peace with him. This map is crazy though! I wish I had that Order policy, which make cities start with extra population. I will try to get as many cities as possible, but I fear that I will not be able to protect them if they are too far away during war..

Rome got screwed over by Denmark and Denmark is the one who does well in this game in the war area. Everybody also hates him.

So I'm building up a few frigates as you can see. I'm not sure if I will try to attack Portugal. I enjoy the trade caravans and our friendship.

Oh, and I haven't build the National College yet! It will probably happen super late if not at all..

Right now it's Liberty 5 (GS who is planted in Capital) Exploration 1 (Right, because of I needed happiness over production.) I will put one more point in there and then go for Rationalism.


Here are some screens:
Spoiler :
Turn 156 #1.png
Turn 156 #2.png
Turn 156 #3.png
 
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Turn 312, Domination Victory.

Yeah.. good game. I had huge problems during the second half with happiness so it was a real pain to play out this one. I was first to all ideologies so after I while I got pressured like crazy. I think I was -88 pressured by those other ideologies. Nobody went Order except me so it was real tough... I should probably have waited with the factories and just grabbed whatever ideology that was left... I had to sell conquered to avoid -20 minus at one point of the game. The conquering was the easy part of the game. I was pretty good with tech and culture this game.. The bots didn't settle on those other islands so perhaps some of them should have started there instead. Denmark had such a weak capital. Almost no production at all.

Lucky for me I was good friends with Byzantium so I could sell cities for a very good price. That helped my economy and my unhappiness. I wanted to settle many cities outside the island but many of them were perhaps unnecessary.. It was a real fun map though! Problem was that the bots didn't go for it, which was kinda disappointing.

I had no troubles at all in this game except my own stupidity. A great map, but the some of the bots should have different starting location.

And yeah.. I never built National College nor Ironworks. Pretty crazy. I never razed any city, because I wanted my Empire to be real massive. In the end I had 42 cities...t

Overall I like Carthage. I used all of UA and the UUs except travel over mountains so it was great. I like Carthage in general. :)

I also recorded the game and it's up on youtube for anyone that wants to see it.

Spoiler :
Turn 312.png
 
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