I don't think that would be a good thing to bet on. Had seen some data previously that I didn't care enough about to dig up again, but this popped up today for a vaccine candidate I've been following:
Durability and Cross-Reactivity of Immune Responses Induced by an AS03 Adjuvanted Plant-Based Recombinant Virus-Like Particle Vaccine for COVID-19
In any of the cases there won't be herd immunity. They're just hoping that natural immunity will keep being renewed without mass deaths that may lead the plebians to demand some action or - the dread! - refuse to keep working very exposed to the virus risks.
Those who had been saying there would be herd immunity will of course serve the bad news as a drip (" only 50% protective against infection") rather than admit outright that these vaccines can't have any protective effect. A few more weeks and the 50% claim will be dropped.
There is no way of stopping Covid spreading through the entire population, experts tell MPs as they call for end of mass testing
The delta variant has wrecked any chance of herd immunity, a panel of experts including the head of the Oxford vaccine team said as they called for an end to mass testing so Britain can start to live with Covid.
Scientists said it was time to accept that there was no way of stopping the virus spreading through the entire population, and monitoring people with mild symptoms was no longer helpful.
Prof Andrew Pollard, who led the Oxford vaccine team, said it was clear that the delta variant can infect people who have been vaccinated, which made herd immunity impossible to reach even with high vaccine uptake.
[...]
Speaking to the all-party parliamentary group on Covid, Sir Andrew said: "Anyone who is still unvaccinated will, at some point, meet the virus.
"We don't have anything that will stop transmission, so I think we are in a situation where herd immunity is not a possibility and I suspect the virus will throw up a new variant that is even better at infecting vaccinated individuals."
Until recently, it was hoped that increasing the number of Britons jabbed would create a ring of protection around the population. As late as last week, the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation said one of the reasons it had advised that 16 and 17-year-olds should be vaccinated was because it may help prevent a winter Covid wave.
However, analysis by Public Health England has shown that when vaccinated people catch the virus they have a similar viral load to unvaccinated individuals and may be as infectious.
Paul Hunter, professor in medicine at the University of East Anglia and an expert in infectious diseases, told the committee: "The concept of herd immunity is unachievable because we know the infection will spread in unvaccinated populations and the latest data is suggesting that two doses is probably only 50 percent protective against infection
Hysteria against the unvaccinated, blamed for spreading covid, took over the US so much that any reversal there will take longer. Talk of vaccinating children because "they might spread covid" continues but is slowly being shifted to a "they die too look at this anecdote, and that...".
I think without up protection the counter argument is no vaccines or you have the Chinese ones. Which are crap.
Nationalising them would slow delivery and Moderna still has to compete with Pfizer etc.
Lifting a monopoly on the production and sale of a product does not reduce offer or slow delivery. The opposite is true, more people and companies jump it to produce.
The chinese vaccines are most likely as crappy as the western ones. The cases offered for to attack them for lower efficacy, such as new waves happening in very vaccinated countries with those chinese ones (Chile, Seychelles) now have a parallel in the huge new wave underway in the US, and the ones in the UK, Israel, Iceland, etc. They all totally failed at containing the virus, for the same reason.
Continuing to claim "the chinese vaccines are clap" while the "western" ones are producing the very same results just shows how politicizied and unscentific all the narratives about the coronavirus and its treatments got. You still want to believe that.
About the "missing deaths" in the UK, when one compares its covid death numbers to those of other countries also vacinated and with waves - looking at Israel and it's becoming clearer - there's
this. It attributes a large number of extra deaths to cardiac problems. Now what do we know this virus does? Cardiac problems, circulatory problems... just because someone didn't die due to lung failure doesn't mean they're not dying from covid's damage a while later.
What I expect we'll see, and what this piece already hints at, is a big rise in cardiac-related deaths
due to the damage from covid. It may not get you immediately but it will cut your life expectancy drastically. And it's not necessary to have a serious case for being damaged, just look at the people being permanently damaged or dying from the spike in the vaccines. A few dozen in a million, you may say. For a limiter amount of spike protein produced.
How many then per million infected with the real virus will be permanently damaged due to the spike protein? My guess is hundreds or perhaps thousands. Now consider that the sole thing governments (look at the UK's example above) want to do is offer vacines and let you get infected over and over again.
It's madness to want to live with this virus. You
die living with this virus.
